Watson Heleta and Marion Seve

[happy_tiger]

I think this Keebra Park thing is just about dead in the water. The kids don't want to come to Sydney to play for us they want to play in QLD and stay up here. We haven't had one come to the club, make grade and stick around in ages. We're just disrupting the development of kids who'd be better off not uprooting at this point.

Disagree, it is an excellent nursery, in order to be successful you need a number of pathways, Keebra makes up an important one for us.

We are never going to have a side of Keebra kids, but they will continue to throw up a couple.

Also play a role in our success in NYC, in itself important, but success and strength builds all players in the system.

I think I'm with Mac on this one

It was useful in the past , but when you have 11 and 12 year olds being approached by clubs and being told they will put them into their education programs when they reach the ages of 14 or 15 these kids have so much to choose from and the WT's doesn't look real appealing

I think we need to possibly establish a connection with a school on the mid Central Coast if possible , something closer to our roots

 

[Tiger_Tim]

Its a shame St Gregs isn't the powerhouse it used to be. I know we have Lawrence and Tedesco but on a whole they don't have the same calibre of players as other schools. If you look at the below you will see how far they are behind Patrician Brothers Blacktown.
http://mcscolleges.com/images/rugbyleague/rep/2015%20U18%20MCS%20RL%20Squad.pdf

Let's just hope we can poach a few from the stronger schools for our Matts and Ball teams.

 

[Tigerdon]

There's always been a lot of support for the WestTigers on the Central Coast. A lot of people from the West and Balmain area moved up to the Central Coast. When Manly choose to play home games against us at Blue-tongue there was a lot of local support for the WestTigers. At one stage Melbourne Storm had a training facility near the Juvenile Centre at Kariong. It's gone now (for whatever reason) but they were target this area as well.

 

[Geo]

Just in case anyone was interested….CONFIRMED,,,

Wests Tigers release Marion Seve

Wests Tigers Media

Wed 27th January, 11:00AM

Wests Tigers can confirm the release of Marion Seve from the final year of his playing contract.

Seve has been part of the extended NRL squad since November after playing 20 Holden Cup games throughout the past two seasons.

The 20-year-old Ipswich product recently **requested to take up an opportunity with another Club in Queensland to be closer to family**.

Wests Tigers wish Seve the best in his future endeavours.

http://www.weststigers.com.au/news/2016/01/27/wests_tigers_release.html

 

[balmain boy]

A lof of the kids from Keebra are recruited directly from NZ, so the whole home-sickness things doesn't really compute. Most have only spent a couple of years there… Seve was a QLDer though.

It's definitely worth us keeping Keebra. They send us a lot of young talented players which is all we can expect from a nursery. Some will make it, some won't... QLD and NZ are two huge markets and we need to maintain our presence in both. Can't leave it all to the bloody Broncos!

And on Seve's form last year in nsw cup, if you play a kid on his poorer side, and in a position he hasn't played before it shouldn't be surprising to see him struggle.

The question is why did we repeatedly play him out of position in both NYC and NSW Cup? Especially when there wasn't exactly strong options to play in his preferred position. The club has handled him poorly since his first injury (when he was averaging a try a game) and so it's perhaps not that surprising that after this latest setback he'd had enough.

He would want to maximise his opportunities of playing first grade and repeatedly being played out of position won't be helping his chances in his opinion, and so a change of scenery might give his the opportunities he needs.

He must be a poor trainer though, as there aren't that many outside backs ahead of him talentwise in nsw cup.

 

[jirskyr]

Its a shame St Gregs isn't the powerhouse it used to be. I know we have Lawrence and Tedesco but on a whole they don't have the same calibre of players as other schools. If you look at the below you will see how far they are behind Patrician Brothers Blacktown.
http://mcscolleges.com/images/rugbyleague/rep/2015%20U18%20MCS%20RL%20Squad.pdf

Let's just hope we can poach a few from the stronger schools for our Matts and Ball teams.

The fortunes of schoolboy football can rise and fall relatively quickly. You might say a given school isn't strong right now, but it depends on many things like club affiliations, school direction, talent pool at a given time.

When I was a teen, St George started putting their juniors through Kingsgrove High, who suddenly became the hot schoolboy team in St George district (it was usually a fight between Penshurst Marist, Kogarah and Lewisham). That stopped and Kingsgrove went back to being an average performing school. The same thing happened at St Dom's Penrith in the early 2000s; schoolboy footy been dominated in the last decade by the sports high schools (Endeavour, Hills, Matto), Keebra and Blacktown.

So should we discontinue a fairly long association with Keebra, who are a very successful schoolboy side? I'd say no, but you are always at risk of the geographical angle, even for Kiwi kids, transplanted to Sydney at 18.

The thing is, we already have our thumbs in many West and Inner-West Sydney pies. What would an extended association to build back up Gregs or Holy Cross, like with Keebra, serve when we already have junior clubs in those areas that develop kids into our systems?

At least with Keebra, it's a talent pool that does not sit within our existing geography.

 

[Yossarian]

Brisbane Broncos are the world champs of the compassionate release. It's disgusting what they het away with.

 

[Demps]

There's always been a lot of support for the WestTigers on the Central Coast. A lot of people from the West and Balmain area moved up to the Central Coast. When Manly choose to play home games against us at Blue-tongue there was a lot of local support for the WestTigers. At one stage Melbourne Storm had a training facility near the Juvenile Centre at Kariong. It's gone now (for whatever reason) but they were target this area as well.

I think Storm had a feeder club in the local comp on the Coast…
Central Coast Storm.

Not sure what happened to that.

 

[Yossarian]

There's always been a lot of support for the WestTigers on the Central Coast. A lot of people from the West and Balmain area moved up to the Central Coast. When Manly choose to play home games against us at Blue-tongue there was a lot of local support for the WestTigers. At one stage Melbourne Storm had a training facility near the Juvenile Centre at Kariong. It's gone now (for whatever reason) but they were target this area as well.

I think Storm had a feeder club in the local comp on the Coast…
Central Coast Storm.

Not sure what happened to that.

They lost interest or found a better setup. It was just their reggies basically. They may have also rebranded the CC junior rep teams but it was all pretty half arsed. All tip no iceberg. Easts use Wyong now and have some pathway through the juniors.

Anyway if the WT wanted to replicate Keebra on the CC I'd suggest St Edwards would be the way to go. They already have junior teams playing weekends.

 

[Demps]

Jacob Liddle is from the Central Coast…
He was scouted and recruited.

So maybe there is something already going on behind the scenes we don't know about but yes, it is a good idea.

 

[balmain boy]

Just in case anyone was interested….CONFIRMED,,,

Wests Tigers release Marion Seve

Wests Tigers Media

Wed 27th January, 11:00AM

Wests Tigers can confirm the release of Marion Seve from the final year of his playing contract.

Seve has been part of the extended NRL squad since November after playing 20 Holden Cup games throughout the past two seasons.

The 20-year-old Ipswich product recently **requested to take up an opportunity with another Club in Queensland to be closer to family**.

Wests Tigers wish Seve the best in his future endeavours.

http://www.weststigers.com.au/news/2016/01/27/wests_tigers_release.html

Well the club was ahrdly going to come out and bad mouth him in public, saying Marion spat the dummy when told in the coaches opinion others were ahead of him in the pecking order.

Standard PR crap. You can never read much into a press release from any sporting team.

 

[Tiger_Watto]

Also remember Seve battled a serious illness from which he fought back. It seems to me the reason for his departure is not consistent with his will to overcome illness as well as the very disciplined training regime under Greg Lenton.

I've seen alot of Greg's Squads over the years and there has been a few years when I have looked at his structure and said to myself "this is better than some NRL & Q Cup Squads".

Obviously there is a huge difference, but he is a brilliant operator and judge of talent… Its not just WT who use his system and bring him into discussions on RL talent.

He is a good RL professional!

 

[Tiger_Watto]

I don't know what to make of Seve. He has mixed opinions on here. Watto is usually a good judge and he reckons he will be a star. But he also doesn't rate Simona as a centre and I think he's wrong on that. Personally I can only go off what I've seen with my own eyes, and Seve has shown me ZERO in regards to being a potential star. It must be said though that have only seen very limited time of him and it was after injury, so my judgement is unfair. But now that he has gone I'm hoping I'm right and Watto is wrong. Seve is no loss.

Thanks mate… :laughing:

I do think Simona is a brilliant player, but I believe he is a Winger and I'd love to see him play there for a season or two.

I feel he could be something special on the Wing. :sign:

 

[Demps]

I think Simona is that versatile he can play centre, wing, fullback and I'm almost certain he played #6 for Samoa….

It just so happens we need a gun centre and Simona can fill that void for us.
I'm sure he'd be a machine on the wing but he's found a home at centre and can be just as good there as wing, going forward for the future.

 

[stevetiger]

I think Simona is that versatile he can play centre, wing, fullback and I'm almost certain he played #6 for Samoa….

It just so happens we need a gun centre and Simona can fill that void for us.
I'm sure he'd be a machine on the wing but he's found a home at centre and can be just as good there as wing, going forward for the future.

Simona is real good in the centres. I'd play him at wing or fullback as well but he is just as good in the centres.

 

[greatodensraven]

I think Simona is that versatile he can play centre, wing, fullback and I'm almost certain he played #6 for Samoa….

It just so happens we need a gun centre and Simona can fill that void for us.
I'm sure he'd be a machine on the wing but he's found a home at centre and can be just as good there as wing, going forward for the future.

Yep he played halfback for Samoa. Didn't set the world on fire but wasn't poor either.

I'd prefer him on the wing only because I think he'd be deadly with more space especially on kick-returns. Although he more than holds his own at centre & has a real knack for putting his winger away - how many tries did Patty score last year without anyone laying a hand on him!

I think Simona with have a better year at centre this year aw he's likely to have more speed outside him, will keep the opposition in 2 minds.

 

[ricksen]

He could defo do a job on the wing.
That said, I'd rather a good centre than a good winger when it comes down to it, so he's better served at #4\. If he can stay injury free, he's up for a big year IMO.

 

[Pawsandclaws]

Also remember Seve battled a serious illness from which he fought back. It seems to me the reason for his departure is not consistent with his will to overcome illness as well as the very disciplined training regime under Greg Lenton.

I've seen alot of Greg's Squads over the years and there has been a few years when I have looked at his structure and said to myself "this is better than some NRL & Q Cup Squads".

Obviously there is a huge difference, but he is a brilliant operator and judge of talent… Its not just WT who use his system and bring him into discussions on RL talent.

He is a good RL professional!

I agree with what you have written Watto. Greg Lenton is one of our greatest assets. His value in identifying, recruiting and providing talent to WTS is immeasurable.

Liam Pakau and Kees Nicholson are two junior rep Qld centres with Keebra. Both have been brought into the fold from the Titans and Pakau, like Seve, is an Ipswich product. I am looking forward to watching the play GIO Cup.

 

[Pawsandclaws]

I think this Keebra Park thing is just about dead in the water. The kids don't want to come to Sydney to play for us they want to play in QLD and stay up here. We haven't had one come to the club, make grade and stick around in ages. We're just disrupting the development of kids who'd be better off not uprooting at this point.

Disagree, it is an excellent nursery, in order to be successful you need a number of pathways, Keebra makes up an important one for us.

We are never going to have a side of Keebra kids, but they will continue to throw up a couple.

Also play a role in our success in NYC, in itself important, but success and strength builds all players in the system.

I agree Goose. Greg Lenton's ability to identify and recruit talent is remarkable especially in an area which is so heavily scouted by clubs. While a lot of our talent is from NZ, it is interesting to note at least three of the six players on scholarship this year are from QLD with two ex Titans. the fact Wayne Bennett likes our Keebra players is a compliment to Lenton. We need to be smarter with how we retain them.

 

[haberfield_tiger]

Now that Seve is gone does Watson go too? He is not the tallest fella for a spot on the wing or centre? I know Naquama isnt the tallest either but he is an exception.

http://www.weststigers.com.au/team/profiles/watson_heleta.html