What it takes to make the 8

The only stat that really counts is we have lost more games than any of the other sides and if that trend continues we will land our first ever spoon. Forget the rest of the stats because yes we may be on the improve but the bottom line the other 15 clubs are still in front of us
 
@stryker said:
@happy tiger said:
@stryker said:
@everett said:
Just look at the Cowboys side and that would be a great template for a winning team. Excellent half back, fast backs, good full back and a big and mobile pack.

Not to mention a clever and speedy dummy half and a 5/8 who is constantly evolving for the better. Not an awesome defensive side but one who can cover the weakness brilliantly.

And if we manned the Cows and the WTs how many battles do we win ??

Three at the most ,possibly 4

And people wonder why Taylor is struggling to get this side to perform at an NRL standard on even a weekly basis

3 sounds right, Farah, Woods, Tedesco. Thats not the point. The point is you coach to your players strengths whilst slowly introducing new structures. You don't hamstring the strengths whilst making your weaknesses your only focus.

I'm not convinced if Taylor can coach well or not but I am positive that his approach to season 2015 has been a massive failure.

Over coaching a strength can quickly turn it into a weakness , especially while your weakness continues to stay the same or go backwards

Mate I agree that the question of whether Taylor is a good coach is up for question , but at least he has had a bigger set than other coach in our history to try and turn this club around the right way

If he fails , well he can't be shot for not trying to do what had to happen , like it or not
 
Rating Farah v Granville is very hard

If Farah was feeding Thurston and Morgan he would be far more dangerous out of dummy half

Granville would have little room to work with playing off our forwards and teams wouldn't fear Brooks or Moses anywhere near as much as they would the Cows halves
 
@cqtiger said:
I will miss all the stats comparisons when we finally start winning because nobody bothers or has the inclination to compile stats when you are winning … It's a losers habit.

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_

They don't huh?

https://broncoshq.com/brisbane-broncos-talk/22909-broncos-2015-discussion-78.html?s=e6d94edd62b6b5dc42830fdc7172cfb5
https://broncoshq.com/brisbane-broncos-talk/26387-golden-opportunity.html?s=e6d94edd62b6b5dc42830fdc7172cfb5
http://www.cowboysstampede.com.au/showthread.php?1002-The-all-important-top-two-finish-Threats-and-opportunities&s=f40c9afcf8f85a5025dea9b459128032
http://www.thechookpen.com.au/vb5/forum/the-chookpen-general-discussion/sydney-roosters-discussion/592775-sydney-roosters-2015-penalty-count-tally
http://www.thechookpen.com.au/vb5/forum/the-chookpen-general-discussion/sydney-roosters-discussion/611845-roosters-v-tigers
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=6566
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9974
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=10000
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9964
 
Just to confirm the feeling that we seem to be getting worse in recent times - 33.6 pt against per game over the last five games.
 
Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games.
Ahh, I feel better now!
 
@stryker said:
I'm not convinced if Taylor can coach well or not but I am positive that his approach to season 2015 has been a massive failure.

Taylor has stuffed us this season and I think that is unacceptable. I also fail to see how anyone can defend his performance as a coach this year.
 
@jirskyr said:
@cqtiger said:
I will miss all the stats comparisons when we finally start winning because nobody bothers or has the inclination to compile stats when you are winning … It's a losers habit.

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_

They don't huh?

https://broncoshq.com/brisbane-broncos-talk/22909-broncos-2015-discussion-78.html?s=e6d94edd62b6b5dc42830fdc7172cfb5
https://broncoshq.com/brisbane-broncos-talk/26387-golden-opportunity.html?s=e6d94edd62b6b5dc42830fdc7172cfb5
http://www.cowboysstampede.com.au/showthread.php?1002-The-all-important-top-two-finish-Threats-and-opportunities&s=f40c9afcf8f85a5025dea9b459128032
http://www.thechookpen.com.au/vb5/forum/the-chookpen-general-discussion/sydney-roosters-discussion/592775-sydney-roosters-2015-penalty-count-tally
http://www.thechookpen.com.au/vb5/forum/the-chookpen-general-discussion/sydney-roosters-discussion/611845-roosters-v-tigers
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=6566
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9974
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=10000
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9964

Yep thanks
You really MUST have a lot of time on your hands.
You also must be a bit touchy about it too because you are quick to try and retort anyone who questions the stats.

Nuff said

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_
 
This is actually a very good thread as we have established that to make the top 8:
Win more than 50% of your games.

How simple and easy is that to understand?!

Someone please send this data to JT and his coaching staff so they know what they need to do next year.

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_
 
I will tell you what it takes to make the eight or higher…
You need a very good playing roster with players that specialise in particular positions eg,centres,spine...
You need a coach to instil structure and game plans to suit the playing roster..ie.playing to strengths and weakness...
You need a stable environment within the club,coaching,S&C and playing roster...
These are some of the most important areas needed to be successful...
At the moment we have a sub standard roster with inexperience and on the way out players.
Our coach has been shackled with a fair mess within the cap to buy players to meet his structured gameplans..our roster as much as they are trying are still learning something that is unfamiliar to them( defensive structure),because of youth and limited NRL experience..
Taylor has been selected by our board and has two further seasons to at least show a much better improvement to this team than this year..
If Taylor and this team have a very good offseason and concentrate on the defensive side of the gameplan,the attack can be incorporated within that structure,but they must get the defense right first in order to implement the attack..
This first year has been hard on us the fans,but I'm sticking to them,it has also been hard on the youth of this team,but I can guarantee they will be much better for this year,they also have to stick and show that they can play to an NRL standard week in week out..

The NRL is a Proffessional arena,you must be Proffessional to succeed,no good hanging your head when you get beaten,you must learn why you lost and how to become better at it as not to lose again...

Unfortunately this all takes time,the thing is...it's easy to blame someone when things go wrong..it's harder to accept that things just might turn around with a little more time and patients..

Go the WESTS Tigers and fight off the threat of the spoon,you guys can do it,hold your heads up high and have a crack at showing the people you have pride in the jumper,this includes you JT.... :smiley:
\
\
:sign:
 
@cqtiger said:
@jirskyr said:
@cqtiger said:
I will miss all the stats comparisons when we finally start winning because nobody bothers or has the inclination to compile stats when you are winning … It's a losers habit.

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_

They don't huh?

https://broncoshq.com/brisbane-broncos-talk/22909-broncos-2015-discussion-78.html?s=e6d94edd62b6b5dc42830fdc7172cfb5
https://broncoshq.com/brisbane-broncos-talk/26387-golden-opportunity.html?s=e6d94edd62b6b5dc42830fdc7172cfb5
http://www.cowboysstampede.com.au/showthread.php?1002-The-all-important-top-two-finish-Threats-and-opportunities&s=f40c9afcf8f85a5025dea9b459128032
http://www.thechookpen.com.au/vb5/forum/the-chookpen-general-discussion/sydney-roosters-discussion/592775-sydney-roosters-2015-penalty-count-tally
http://www.thechookpen.com.au/vb5/forum/the-chookpen-general-discussion/sydney-roosters-discussion/611845-roosters-v-tigers
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=51&t=6566
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9974
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=10000
http://www.weststigersforum.com/viewtopic.php?f=80&t=9964

Yep thanks
You really MUST have a lot of time on your hands.
You also must be a bit touchy about it too because you are quick to try and retort anyone who questions the stats.

Nuff said

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_

Point is - and you obviously missed it.

You were incorrect and put in your place.

You also were very quick to defend by attacking him again.
 
@NT Tiger said:
Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games. Win more games.
Ahh, I feel better now!

16 wins sounds nice NT
 
@jirskyr said:
If you don't like stats, look away now.

If you do, I was taking a look at what a team needed to achieve to be a Top 8 side in the last 10 years (2005-2014). Not just "be better" and other barely quantifiable things, but actually what kind of numbers you need to achieve to make the finals on average in the last decade.

What's really interesting is that within the Top 8, the difference between a Top 4 and a Bottom 4 (5th-8th) side is much wider in defence than attack:
- Top 4 sides average 23.72 points for and 17.08 points against
- Bottom 4 average 22.02 for (1.71 less) and 19.91 against (2.83 less)

When you look at the difference between making the Top 8 (8th) and not (9th), the gap is extraordinarily small: 0.20 points for per game and 0.27 points against. That small improvement turns a 47.50% win ratio into 50%, which is what 8th position almost always achieves.

So how do Tigers turn into a Top 8 side again? First and obviously, you need to score more points than you concede:
- only 6 teams have ever made the Top 8 with a negative for/against
- only 8 sides have ever failed to make the Top 8 with a positive differential.

Tigers 2015 are running at 20.91 points for and 23.67 points against per game. That rate of attack is usually good enough to achieve 11th position. However that defence is typical of a 13th placed side. Unfortunately for us, the wooden spooners average an attack of 17.21 and defence of 28.47, which even in 2015 we are clearly ahead of, though we run last. This is a boom year for crap teams!

To make the 8 next year, our attack would only need to improve slightly (needs to be up 0.38 points per game) but our defence still needs substantial improvement (needs to be up 3.18 points per game). To put that into perspective, a defensive improvement of 3.18 points per game would turn the average 8th-placed side into a 2nd-placed side.

Even more importantly, the minor premiers concede an average 2.78 points less per game in defence than 2nd place, which is almost the same gap as between 2nd and 8th place averages. Weirdly, the minor premiers do not score more points on average than 2nd place.

So JT is right that defence wins competitions. The best sides over the last 10 years are significantly better defenders than attackers when compared with their opponents.

When I ran the numbers last week to compare Tigers sides over the past 16 years, the figures said attack 2015 was worse than average, but defence was better than average.

What this analysis tells us is that whilst the defence is better than last year (so far), it still falls significantly behind what is required of a Top 8 side. The attack however is not far off.

There is also a positive and eerie message amongst all these numbers. We require a 3.18 points per game improvement in defence in 2016 to achieve the average defensive record of an 8th-placed side. That happens to be EXACTLY the figure by which defence has improved per game from 2014 to 2015.

In other words, if our defensive record is steady for the rest of 2015 (i.e. no further blowouts like the end of 2014), and our attack is steady, then a similar defensive improvement next year would tip us to be right on the cusp of the Top 8\. If such an improvement was achieved against in 2017, we could be a Top 2 side.

Wow, just Wow. A lot of effort put in to this. Good work Jerskyr!
 
@foreveratiger said:
@happy tiger said:
But yet again we still have a quarter of the season to go everyone

We win 4/6 and that changes everything , especially if we can continue to improve our defence and structures in defence and attack

Why not 6/6 and a mid week semi final play off game?
Don't kill of all my hopes please happy.

Wouldn't that be Loverly FT! :stuck_out_tongue:
 
@Tigermama said:
@foreveratiger said:
@happy tiger said:
But yet again we still have a quarter of the season to go everyone

We win 4/6 and that changes everything , especially if we can continue to improve our defence and structures in defence and attack

Why not 6/6 and a mid week semi final play off game?
Don't kill of all my hopes please happy.

Wouldn't that be Loverly FT! :stuck_out_tongue:

If only TM
 
@cqtiger said:
Yep thanks
You really MUST have a lot of time on your hands.
You also must be a bit touchy about it too because you are quick to try and retort anyone who questions the stats.

Nuff said

_Posted using RoarFEED 4.2.0_

You've made over 1200 posts yourself, you appear to have plenty of time to talk Tigers too!
 
Here's a stat that shows our D still needs a helluva lot of work -

The Raiders have conceded over 1500 metres per game, the most of any team, **while the Tigers are the second worst offenders at 1491.**

from http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/sport/nrl/jason-taylor-canberra-cold-could-put-freeze-on-wests-tigers/story-fni3gpz1-1227476206297
 

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