Signings, Suggestions & Rumours Discussion

Mighty_Tiger said:
Any assistant coach will be the next Ciraldo at the Panthers. Give any coaching team the best roster in the comp and they do well, move them onto an ordinary roster and look at how Holbrook, O'Brian, Madge and co all go. It's all about the roster not the coach in the majority of times.

He has been assistant all year and in charge of our attack which under Madge was atrocious and lacked any form of structure. He had a job here and just didn't deliver this year.
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True gauge is when he is in charge of a team.
He did great when in charge of reserve grade and his one and only first grade game.
 
tony soprano said:
He's average let knights cap rot
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C'mon he isn't average. He is in the top 10 props in the game atm.

In the NRL for all players Klemmer is:

* 7th for average post contact meters per game - 66mtrs (last 4 games only 1 wests tigers player hit above 66 in a game, outside of that they struggle to make 30mtrs a game)

* 15th for run meters per game - 155mtrs, 3rd best forward. Joe is our best avg 124mtrs per game.

* 3rd for average offloads per game

His error rate, penalties, missed & ineffective tackles are great compared to forwards in the NRL as well.

He would be an instant sizeable uplift for our starting forward pack.

Yes he has agility concerns but so did Lodge and look at how he is being played & it's working very well at the Roosters and now everyone is like grab Lodge.

Sometimes wonder if people actually watch games and want us to improve or not these days.
 
Mighty_Tiger said:
C'mon he isn't average. He is in the top 10 props in the game atm.

In the NRL for all players Klemmer is:

* 7th for average post contact meters per game - 66mtrs (last 4 games only 1 wests tigers player hit above 66 in a game, outside of that they struggle to make 30mtrs a game)

* 15th for run meters per game - 155mtrs, 3rd best forward. Joe is our best avg 124mtrs per game.

* 3rd for average offloads per game

His error rate, penalties, missed & ineffective tackles are great compared to forwards in the NRL as well.

He would be an instant sizeable uplift for our starting forward pack.

Yes he has agility concerns but so did Lodge and look at how he is being played & it's working very well at the Roosters and now everyone is like grab Lodge.

Sometimes wonder if people actually watch games and want us to improve or not these days.
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It's been discussed in the media he's a real hand break in attack takes for ever to play the ball. He's not worth it imo.
 
Telltails said:
So if he is successful at Penrith then clearly it falls back on the players - the ones that can execute and the ones that can't.
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Having a high quality squad that contains superstar players within it will automatically make your CV look excellent as the results have a higher chance to follow, it's just how the world works.

The successful Teams all have something in common though - they let players play to their strengths & then structure things around this.

End of the day we need to measure coaches on delivering outcomes & reality is our structures this year have been the worst looking & totally disorganised like we have never seen before.

Cayless had a better CV than Gardiner coming from the Roosters but he is gone also because end of day they just didn't deliver.

When you come last & have been on a clear downward trend over the last few years it's very hard to quantify keeping the coaching & performance staff.
 
LARDS said:
True gauge is when he is in charge of a team.
He did great when in charge of reserve grade and his one and only first grade game.
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Wrong. True gauge is his success in the role he accepted & commits too.
He was an Assistant this year, he accepted the role and wasn't successful.

He is going to the Panthers apparently as an assistant as well & if they go backwards he will get measured accordingly same as if they are a success in which it will help him land an NRL gig no doubt.
 
Mighty_Tiger said:
Having a high quality squad that contains superstar players within it will automatically make your CV look excellent as the results have a higher chance to follow, it's just how the world works.

The successful Teams all have something in common though - they let players play to their strengths & then structure things around this.

End of the day we need to measure coaches on delivering outcomes & reality is our structures this year have been the worst looking & totally disorganised like we have never seen before.

Cayless had a better CV than Gardiner coming from the Roosters but he is gone also because end of day they just didn't deliver.

When you come last & have been on a clear downward trend over the last few years it's very hard to quantify keeping the coaching & performance staff.
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That's all well and good but you can't possibly the measure the success of coach without taking into account the roster that they have to work with.
Coaches are the biggest scapegoats in the game - players know it better than anyone.
 
All organisations are run by the board .They have the right to hire and fire the CEO. The chairman is elected by the board and conducts the meetings .
So I believe to start afresh we need a new board which may or may not include existing members.
The criteria for becoming a board member is that they must not identify themselves as either a Western suburbs member or a Balmain member
If when asked the question which one are you and if they answer NEITHER
I am a wests tigers member then providing they bring something to the table be it Business acumen or football management acumen .Then their in !
A rebuild to be successful must by definition change the formula ..
No more dinosaurs
 
coivtny said:
Was just on facebook and came across this comment. I want to make it clear it's not my work but I shouldn't name the author for privacy reasons. It's a note of positivity in a season filled with a lot of gloom. It illustrates what's possible if you get your act together.

On a positive note, the Sharks got the wooden spoon in 2014 and beat Storm in the 2016 grand final, Roosters got the spoon in 2009 and made the grand final in 2010, Bulldogs got the spoon in 2002 and won the grand final against the Roosters in 2004 and Panthers got the spoon in 2001 and beat the Roosters in the 2003 grand final.
Hopefully, Wests Tigers can find a way to turn things around, the way that other clubs have done.
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Not trying to be a wet blanket, but the chooks and the dog’s recruited themselves off the bottom. Sharks put a squad together by cheating the cap. You can’t get off the bottom in a couple of years without quality recruitment. We can’t even get past ninety And our recruitment outside Papi and API looks bleak
 
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supercoach said:
Not trying to be a wet blanket, but the chooks and the dog’s recruited themselves off the bottom. Sharks put a squad together by cheating the cap. You can’t get off the bottom in a couple of years without quality recruitment. We can’t even get past ninety And our recruitment outside Papi and API looks bleak
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Agree totally. That's why I added "if you get your act together".
 
Telltails said:
That's all well and good but you can't possibly the measure the success of coach without taking into account the roster that they have to work with.
Coaches are the biggest scapegoats in the game - players know it better than anyone.
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Let's be real on this if it was just the players then we wouldn't need coaches.
The scapegoat comment is rubbish most of the time.

For all the success and lack of success a team has the coaches play an important part just as players do.

We have come last and by a clear 2 games based on F&A.
We also now hold the record since 2017 to have the biggest pts gap between last and 8th.

If you watch our games especially early our attacking formations & structures were diabolical.
Players looked lost and didn't know what to do.
30% of our games this year we scored 1 try or less - 7 games this year which isn't just on the players.

We have scored 160+ less points than last year which is the 3rd worst over the last 5yrs (other 2 have been the Bulldogs not a great benchmark)

Our F&A of -281 (with a game in hand) is the 3rd worst in the last 5yrs of all teams as well.

Year/For/Against /Difference
2022 - 342 / 623 / -281
2021 - 500 / 714 / -214
2020 - 440 / 505 / -65 (20 game season)
2019 - 475 / 486 / -11

Yes our defence had an improvement of sorts this year on last however benchmark again ranks us bottom 3 year on year with 600+ so isn't an actual positive.

Our performance this year isn't just on the players or roster. It's across the board hence why a big cleanout has occurred as it shows a combination of problems such as strategies, formations, game plan, research, roster management, quality & depth, training & skill level, performance, training, preparation - game and next in line, commitment etc are lacking given how big a gap we have.

I'm not at all saying Madge & Gardiner are the only one's responsible, we know the players have responsibility on the seasons performance also. But in saying that it's also not 100% on the players or how bad our squad is - the coaches also must be held accountability for how badly we have declined over the last 2yrs (Madge and Gardiner have played a key coaching part in this during that time).
 
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coivtny said:
Was just on facebook and came across this comment. I want to make it clear it's not my work but I shouldn't name the author for privacy reasons. It's a note of positivity in a season filled with a lot of gloom. It illustrates what's possible if you get your act together.

On a positive note, the Sharks got the wooden spoon in 2014 and beat Storm in the 2016 grand final, Roosters got the spoon in 2009 and made the grand final in 2010, Bulldogs got the spoon in 2002 and won the grand final against the Roosters in 2004 and Panthers got the spoon in 2001 and beat the Roosters in the 2003 grand final.
Hopefully, Wests Tigers can find a way to turn things around, the way that other clubs have done.
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Very interesting. And in 2003 its not like we were a good team either. Dogs, Chooks and Sharks play a much better TPA game and that's where we need to vastly improve. I don't understand how we cannot hook these up given our record membership fanbase.
 
Stevec said:
The criteria for becoming a board member is that they must not identify themselves as either a Western suburbs member or a Balmain member
If when asked the question which one are you and if they answer NEITHER
I am a wests tigers member then providing they bring something to the table be it Business acumen or football management acumen .Then their in !
A rebuild to be successful must by definition change the formula ..
No more dinosaurs
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This could be the hidden big flaw of the WT, which is allowing these members to be only partially loyal to the WT.
What if they are/were members of other clubs? Then how can we trust them to be fully loyal to the WT?

I thaught that it would be in the best interest of the WT if they were either a Western suburbs or a Balmain member.

So by this criteria they are assuming that these people would not have had connections and would not have been members and loyal of a rival club?

How the hell does this Criteria make sense that a candidate won't be accepted as a board member if they are identified as Western suburbs or a Balmain member?
 
Mighty_Tiger said:
Let's be real on this if it was just the players then we wouldn't need coaches.
The scapegoat comment is rubbish most of the time.

For all the success and lack of success a team has the coaches play an important part just as players do.

We have come last and by a clear 2 games based on F&A.
We also now hold the record since 2017 to have the biggest pts gap between last and 8th.

If you watch our games especially early our attacking formations & structures were diabolical.
Players looked lost and didn't know what to do.
30% of our games this year we scored 1 try or less - 7 games this year which isn't just on the players.

We have scored 160+ less points than last year which is the 3rd worst over the last 5yrs (other 2 have been the Bulldogs not a great benchmark)

Our F&A of -281 (with a game in hand) is the 3rd worst in the last 5yrs of all teams as well.

Year/For/Against /Difference
2022 - 342 / 623 / -281
2021 - 500 / 714 / -214
2020 - 440 / 505 / -65 (20 game season)
2019 - 475 / 486 / -11

Yes our defence had an improvement of sorts this year on last however benchmark again ranks us bottom 3 year on year with 600+ so isn't an actual positive.

Our performance this year isn't just on the players or roster. It's across the board hence why a big cleanout has occurred as it shows a combination of problems such as strategies, formations, game plan, research, roster management, quality & depth, training & skill level, performance, training, preparation - game and next in line, commitment etc are lacking given how big a gap we have.

I'm not at all saying Madge & Gardiner are the only one's responsible, we know the players have responsibility on the seasons performance also. But in saying that it's also not 100% on the players or how bad our squad is - the coaches also must be held accountability for how badly we have declined over the last 2yrs (Madge and Gardiner have played a key coaching part in this during that time).
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Coaches are always held accountable for performance first and foremost.
But you have to ask why an NRL club could not recruit/ attract a coach to take them on?
Our record in recruiting and retaining quality players gives little hope of being successful in the foreseeable future, and the first person that wears that is always the coach.
The biggest barrier to achieving success always starts and finishes with the quality of the squad - and ours in the eyes of many is not of a standard needed to be playing finals footy.
 
LARDS said:
Gardiner will be the next "ciraldo". You watch.
The talent identification skills of our admin is breathtaking
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Was Gardiner still teaching full team in addition to being an assistant coach or did he give it up? I don’t know the answer but maybe sheens wanted someone available full time for an assistant role.
 
gallagher said:
Inner Wests Tigers and South Wests Tigers could be our names. To be one club.
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Is there a Balmain Tigers Football club still running? As in a separate administration to the Wests Ashfield club.
I know Wests Ashfield support Balmain Junior reps financially but is there still a ‘business affiliated that is run separately’?
 
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