Sack Marshall

Telltails said:
Ciraldo struggled last season with Mahoney Kikau JAC and Burton in his team. Add a marquee and six FG players from good systems and the improvement is evident. It's not rocket science it's about resources. Can guarantee if six or seven of them get injured they will be struggling again.
Click to expand...
Struggling is fine. It’s how you do it that matters. If these blokes were getting done by 12-16 every week but really trying, and showing signs of improvement we’d be happier. If they showed emotion at full time, I.e. pissed off but unified and determined to do better next week, we’d be happier.
It won’t take much to galvanise the fanbase. Fight hard and give a damn.
Look at the Titans this year…losing a lot but they have respect amongst the league world as they are trying their guts out most weeks. We say they’ve been a bit unlucky. Don’t hear that narrative about our mob.
 
jirskyr said:
That's all hindsight nonsense. Our coach had just quit to join another team and we had some momentum approaching the Top 8 with a revised squad - you don't hire some interim hasbeen or rookie coach the following season.

Madge was a reasonable hire under those circumstances, he had a great pedigree.

The fact that Bennett was eventually sacked is irrelevant to Tigers and only helpful to Souths who were in our same position but had lucky timing.
Click to expand...
Ok. Nonsense. Got it. Love your passion
 
I will quote Phil Gould here, having looked up the 100% Footy stream today - he says the plan to have Sheens oversee Marshall's development for 2 years was a decent plan, but they probably made a mistake terminating Sheens too early and thrusting Benji into the fire.

That's a point I didn't consider deeply on the weekend, that it was still supposed to be Sheens coaching this year, but he was knifed due to bad performances. Not that Sheens was to be defended for 2023, but because terminating Sheens immediately put all that pressure and expectation onto Benji, at the same time as the club was about to undergo a complete restructure.

So to put it another way - 2022 Madge gets knifed for bad performance, Kimmorley comes in and the team crashes into a wooden spoon, Sheens is hired and gets knifed inside 12 months, now Benji is up and people want to knife him too. What's the next bloke supposed to do, pull an amazing handbrake and turn the club around in 1 season?

Gould also stressed that turning around cellar dwellars takes a long long long time and unfortunately nobody is willing to wait. Now of course Tigers fans will shout "we've been waiting 15 years" but the point is specifically about new personnel being afforded time to bring their plan to life, not being excessively burdened by the failures of others in the past.

I think Bulldogs will show you that even with top operators it takes years and years to get the team half-decent. Bulldogs were in 2020-2021 as bad as the Tigers are now (and would have had 2 wooden spoons if not for a shocking Broncos season), haven't made the finals since 2016, had 4 coaches during this period (plus 2 interims) and still haven't finished better than 11th in that 8-year period. Bulldogs are certainly going better in 2024 than many of the previous seasons, but they were still 3rd-last during Ciraldo's first season and basically recruited heavily from the Premiers to boost their side (as we are doing, just a few years behind).
 
Last edited:
weststigers said:
Ok. Nonsense. Got it. Love your passion
Click to expand...
Honest question: is there any precedent in the NRL, of a team losing their coach and hiring the replacement for the year after next? The fact that it's uncommon, possibly to the point of never having occurred, should tell you that it's not a good strategy.

And you understand, right, that Wayne Bennett didn't fall into the Tigers' lap - we pursued him and attempted to get him to quit his Broncos contract a year early. But unlike Cleary, Bennett was a man of his word and refused to quit early even though Broncos had already told him that 2019 would be his last year. It's all been confirmed in public by Bennett - they had basically agreed to terms but he would not quit Broncos and Tigers needed the coach to start in 2019.

Now with hindsight you say this is "the thing we should have done". But that's with your 2024 hat on; hiring Maguire to replace Ivan was a very solid decision, it just didn't work out. And it's quite possible it didn't work out due to club inefficiencies, which then casts doubt on exactly what Wayne Bennett could or would have done in this fantasy scenario you have imagined.
 
jirskyr said:
Honest question: is there any precedent in the NRL, of a team losing their coach and hiring the replacement for the year after next? The fact that it's uncommon, possibly to the point of never having occurred, should tell you that it's not a good strategy.

And you understand, right, that Wayne Bennett didn't fall into the Tigers' lap - we pursued him and attempted to get him to quit his Broncos contract a year early. But unlike Cleary, Bennett was a man of his word and refused to quit early even though Broncos had already told him that 2019 would be his last year. It's all been confirmed in public by Bennett - they had basically agreed to terms but he would not quit Broncos and Tigers needed the coach to start in 2019.
Click to expand...
I know the story.

I'm simply saying that arguably the best coach of the modern era was available from the next year and all we had to do was wait it out, but the club saw it your way and hired someone else to take over mid season instead.

Honest question: Putting aside Bennett being sacked as that was an unknown at the time, would you have preferred to wait it out and now we have Bennett? Or do what we did?

Your scenario has already played out. 2 wooden spoons and a 3rd one coming.

My scenario...we'll never know, but the Dolphins sit 4th right now.
 
Tucker said:
Struggling is fine. It’s how you do it that matters. If these blokes were getting done by 12-16 every week but really trying, and showing signs of improvement we’d be happier. If they showed emotion at full time, I.e. pissed off but unified and determined to do better next week, we’d be happier.
It won’t take much to galvanise the fanbase. Fight hard and give a damn.
Look at the Titans this year…losing a lot but they have respect amongst the league world as they are trying their guts out most weeks. We say they’ve been a bit unlucky. Don’t hear that narrative about our mob.
Click to expand...

Agree it’s how we lose, that then leads to new recruits & more experience with the kids growing into success.

The dumbness & getting spanked makes it hard to see any improvement. Add to this currently we have more quality outbound than inbound.
 
Tucker said:
Struggling is fine. It’s how you do it that matters. If these blokes were getting done by 12-16 every week but really trying, and showing signs of improvement we’d be happier. If they showed emotion at full time, I.e. pissed off but unified and determined to do better next week, we’d be happier.
It won’t take much to galvanise the fanbase. Fight hard and give a damn.
Look at the Titans this year…losing a lot but they have respect amongst the league world as they are trying their guts out most weeks. We say they’ve been a bit unlucky. Don’t hear that narrative about our mob.
Click to expand...
Up until this week I think they have been playing to their ability, and fielded probably the weakest squad of any run on side this season. May have more of a chance against a weakened Titans side but the situation in relation to players is as dire as I can recall.
 
Robbie's Love Child said:
Potter- successful in Super League
Madge- Premiership winner, international coach
Sheens- enough said about his credentials.
Face the facts no one would win with this squad, only Api and Bula would start in an NRL first grade side, the rest would be KOE or Flegg.
Click to expand...
I'm not advocating for Benji to be sacked (though I thought the appointment of he and Sheens was foolish) and I also think we've a poor squad. But, as well as Api and Bula there is (was) 2 international backrowers. A front rower who reportedly has several clubs chasing him. A young forward that has outperformed the 3 above. A former centre of the year. It is disingenuous to say only the 2 are first grade quality.
Additionally Benji (alongside Sheens) is largely responsible for the roster. We sacked Madge who was hamstrung by an out of sorts cap whilst Benji has no such excuse. I think it's fair to give him to mid next season given his marquee signing is yet to arrive but he still should well and truly be under pressure as it stands.
 
Think Benji needs to go. If we dont qin a game in the ne t two rounds i cant see them winning another game. He is not ready. Need an experienced coach asap.
 
Tucker said:
Struggling is fine. It’s how you do it that matters. If these blokes were getting done by 12-16 every week but really trying, and showing signs of improvement we’d be happier. If they showed emotion at full time, I.e. pissed off but unified and determined to do better next week, we’d be happier.
It won’t take much to galvanise the fanbase. Fight hard and give a damn.
Look at the Titans this year…losing a lot but they have respect amongst the league world as they are trying their guts out most weeks. We say they’ve been a bit unlucky. Don’t hear that narrative about our mob.
Click to expand...
We all have different opinions on the matter but other than last weeks game I think we've been doing what you said all season. I mean two weeks ago we could've just buried our head against the cows 20-0 down but the boys fought their way back & made a real contest of it. Ultimately the amount of players unavailable currently eventually catches up to you & I think that's what we're starting to see.
 
At the begin of the year was lucky to be involved in a conversation with couple of ex canterbuy players who agreed that A) in time Benji would be a good coach B) Benji needed to do a longer apprenticeship and should have coached Flegg last season at a minimal.
But their biggest concerns where what resources are there at the Tigers??
 
WesternSuburbsBoy said:
We all have different opinions on the matter but other than last weeks game I think we've been doing what you said all season. I mean two weeks ago we could've just buried our head against the cows 20-0 down but the boys fought their way back & made a real contest of it. Ultimately the amount of players unavailable currently eventually catches up to you & I think that's what we're starting to see.
Click to expand...
Round 2 to round 5 you may have a point.
Since then they’ve only tried in spits and spurts…I.e. played great first half v Dogs, didn’t try at all in the second half.
I think the reason they are copping so much flak is because they aren’t trying to play their way out of this hole they are in.
Whinging at the ref, halfarsed defence, trying to get out of contracts…they aren’t putting in.
 
SeanT said:
Think Benji needs to go. If we dont qin a game in the ne t two rounds i cant see them winning another game. He is not ready. Need an experienced coach asap.
Click to expand...

And how does sacking Benji in 2 games or getting an experienced coach help us?

We had Madge and Sheens not long ago - that didn’t work.

We have half our squad out injured or suspended and zero depth. Expecting to win games in that situation when we can’t win games with our full squad is unrealistic.
 
The reality of the situation and the what should be happening don't align when the playing group each week is further weakened and was already flawed to start with.
 
Droppy05 said:
Both those teams have won more than 2 games and are not wooden spoon candidates or favourites for spoon. Tigers don't look like winning a game and have become the laughing stock of the NRL. Coach has to take responsibility for that!
Click to expand...
Rubbish! We have been close most of the season. At half time last week we looked like winning. Then a dumb sinbinning, unforced errors and 20% possession ruined a great first half.

That loss cost us big time. Souths getting up with a plus result and our big minus result impacted our for and against.

We have two good players coming next year and we will probably sign a few more. Have faith and patience. We will be ok.
 
Mighty_Tiger said:
Agree it’s how we lose, that then leads to new recruits & more experience with the kids growing into success.

The dumbness & getting spanked makes it hard to see any improvement. Add to this currently we have more quality outbound than inbound.
Click to expand...
We are playing like a team with a lot of youth blended with players who got moved on from their previous clubs due to unsatisfactory performances. Any surprise is pretty funny based on recent history.

As Richo said yesterday, keep doing what you’ve always done and you’ll keep getting what you always got.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.

Latest posts

Staff online

Members online

... and 40 more.
Total: 1,252 (members: 90, guests: 1,162)
Back
Top