Signings, Suggestions & Rumours Discussion

TSP said:
If I may respond in the same respectful good faith manner:

“Through no fault of his own, Benji was not able to serve his apprenticeship..”

The assumption you may have made here is that he was somehow forced to take the job and that lets him off the hook and portrays him as some kind of unwilling victim.

I beg to differ.

At all material times, Benji could have declined the first grade coaches position he was offered on several bases.

Including the fact that the contractual expectation was for another year at least under the catastrophic reign of Tim’s less than triumphant second coming.

But he was determined to strike whilst the iron was hot so far as he was concerned and he cared not for his own inexperience.

I don’t wish to the cruel, but when the job is best handled by a master tradesman, I don’t want to see the first year apprentice turn up with some of the wrong tools and try to muddle through.

What Benji failed to realise is that he wasn’t quite ready. Every time he uses the “rookie coach” excuse, that’s an admission of his shortcomings to some extent.

I would have thought that Benji and those throwing the dice on his development, should have realised that he was far better off waiting for the “draining of the swamp” of the roster and more exposure to successful coaching.

Recalling and pointing out that on many occasions Benji has cited Tim as a major influence. That makes me nervous.

Patience can be a virtue.

I remain disappointed that he took off overseas for a 5 star holiday when the ship had been holed and water was gushing in unimpeded.

For the record, I wanted Des Hasler and I don’t dislike Benji in anyway. He is trying, but the Cult of Benji seems to be struggling to get bums on seats these day.

We are stuck with him for awhile, so my views don’t have any force whatsoever at this point!
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I'm not sure we totally disagree. My very first paragraph outlines my position that the difference with Benji and other rookie coaches is they earned their promotion through a series of coaching jobs prior to taking over an NRL side. Benji did not.

Now, Benji could have knocked back the job, but the job was already his, albeit after a 2 year apprenticeship which was cut short. That was the plan the club agreed on and they stuck to it.

In saying the above, I'd be more on board with dumping him as coach if we had stability in that area since Sheens left and the attempt was to return to stability, but we have put multiple coaches in and regardless of their pedigree, we dump them before they've had a chance to finish the job. It's time now for stability through thick and thin.

There are some things I do like about Benji and one of them is the roster overhaul. We have been in these situations many times before and a coach will go out and saddle us with big money contracts for players that were never going to perform just to turn the roster. I like Benji and Richos patience in this area and, although painful now, we will see the benefits of this next season or thereafter. It remains to be seen what the real impact of Luai will be and what positions will need to be addressed to get more wins, but we have players on contract that we are obligated to pay until they find a new club or their contracts run out.

I dont think you can give a coach less than a season before you start death riding them. We have a huge number of u20s in the NRL side, suspensions, injuries and underperformers. Let's be honest...what coach would do any better than last with what we have?
 
The Chad said:
He'd play 30+ minutes for us, I'm sure. I see him as the softening up period guy. Then Pole & Fainu come on to do the highlight work. If Klemmer, Hetherington, Horsburgh & Seyfarth are on a rotation & all play 30+ minutes each, you will have some on the field at all times. Reality is- some will play more than others, but the style will hold over most of the game.
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His salary v benefit will be a concern. Knights paid very good upwards of 600k per year coin for him so doubt he would join a desperate team for much less than he is on now. I just can’t have him onboard for that price.

Food for thought could be that Knights have found the right balance for him & 25-30mins prevents fatigue/dumb actions to come into play. Granted he maybe maturing his playing style/fitness somewhat but default behaviors don’t just vanish over a preseason.

I would prefer Lucas from the Knights if targeting one of their backrowers. His mobility, work rate and size would lock up the right backrow spot probably for same coin Hetherington would want.
 
tigers. said:
I'm a bit confused that people actually rate Faataape. Must see something I can't. I even seen some one compare him to Kotoni Staggs 😄 I'll have to watch him more closely because I'm not seeing it ATM.
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Love is blind at times.
I think some Wests Tigers fans are very blind when it comes to our own players and yet wonder why we looking at 3 spoons in a row.
 
Tigers_Wests said:
Interestingly he has been dropped to Flegg (and 18th man for Cup) this week after only playing 10 minutes last week off the bench. Could be just based on form and his own development, or it could be the Panthers reacting to him leaving and putting their development into someone else.
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The kid is a goer but his frame is very undercut.
He isn’t in the hopgood mould and would need alot of effort to get his frame right for NRL level.
 
tigers. said:
I'm a bit confused that people actually rate Faataape. Must see something I can't. I even seen some one compare him to Kotoni Staggs 😄 I'll have to watch him more closely because I'm not seeing it ATM.
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Benji picks the team. Not forum members. Can you see what Benji cant?
 
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weststigers said:
I'm not sure we totally disagree. My very first paragraph outlines my position that the difference with Benji and other rookie coaches is they earned their promotion through a series of coaching jobs prior to taking over an NRL side. Benji did not.

Now, Benji could have knocked back the job, but the job was already his, albeit after a 2 year apprenticeship which was cut short. That was the plan the club agreed on and they stuck to it.

In saying the above, I'd be more on board with dumping him as coach if we had stability in that area since Sheens left and the attempt was to return to stability, but we have put multiple coaches in and regardless of their pedigree, we dump them before they've had a chance to finish the job. It's time now for stability through thick and thin.

There are some things I do like about Benji and one of them is the roster overhaul. We have been in these situations many times before and a coach will go out and saddle us with big money contracts for players that were never going to perform just to turn the roster. I like Benji and Richos patience in this area and, although painful now, we will see the benefits of this next season or thereafter. It remains to be seen what the real impact of Luai will be and what positions will need to be addressed to get more wins, but we have players on contract that we are obligated to pay until they find a new club or their contracts run out.

I dont think you can give a coach less than a season before you start death riding them. We have a huge number of u20s in the NRL side, non limp j ok on oil suspensions, injuries and underperformers. Let's be honest...what coach would do any better than last with what we have?
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All fair points, but your last question can’t be answered and the answer is we don’t know and never will.

Benji was not given the job based on any merit whatsoever. He didn’t have a barest skerrick of experience.

It was a “mates appointment” because people liked him and he is a club icon.

And it’s not a sensible, commercial or ethical way to appoint a coach or anyone else to an important position.

As for stability, stability for its own sake doesn’t cut it. You don’t continue to persist with a losing coach so you swan about and declare “ yeah, we are coming last, but at least we are stable”

I’d rather us be unstable and off the bottom, I’d rather us be unstable but signing better players and having us play better. So long as there is progress on the park.

And once again, it’s not just a case of whether or not the job was his, it’s also about whether or not Benji should have waited until we had more ducks in a row.

And this “rookie coach” nonsense.

In my respectful submission, Benji simply isn’t coping. That’s where we are.

I think he should probably step down, but stay on as an assistant to a new coach. That would take a lot of courage, to have that solemn yet truthful conversation with himself.

Thanks for your side of it, much appreciated.
 
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WestsTigers4VR said:
I don’t know, he’s made some pretty good calls with Galvin and Samuela, even Reuben Porter to an extent. I can’t think of many other coaches beside Wayne that’d give an 18 year old the 6 jersey. I also would like to know who you’d swap Faataape for?

Since our NSW cup squad just got abused 64-6 I highly doubt anyone in there could come in and do a better job. Tell me how many of these names excite you : Faaletino Tavana, Nick Mougious, Josh Feledy and Declan Casey. Cause those are your other options pretty much.
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Naden is better than Faataape in every facet of the game, sure he has his moments, but it’s not even close on ability.
And playing Api at 7 is just stupid, it kills our attack and lessens our chances through the middle
 
When we talk about depth signings, 2 that would be very good are the Puru twins.
Both played in the Panthers Jersey Flegg winning team in 20222 and both are having stand out seasons for their respective NSW Cuo teams this season.
If we offload Sullivan which looks certain, we will be needing a 4 string halve and preferably one that is a controlling halfback with a good kicking game who can help our NSW Cup team become highly competitive and also be good enough to play NRL if required.
NIwhai Puru currently with the Newtown Jets which is the Sharks feeder team fits this description perfectly.
His twin brother Hohepa is the lock, captain and mainstay of the Raiders strong NSW Cup team.
He is a nuggety tough ball playing style of 13 who makes makes plenty of tackles and is also a very capable 9.
He reminds me a lot of a younger Jazz Tevaga style of player.
 
851 said:
851 said:
Naden is better than Faataape in every facet of the game, sure he has his moments, but it’s not even close on ability.
And playing Api at 7 is just stupid, it kills our attack and lessens our chances through the middle
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Naden is better than Faataape in every facet of the game, sure he has his moments, but it’s not even close on ability.
And playing Api at 7 is just stupid, it kills our attack and lessens our chances through the middle
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💯
 
AmericanHistoryX said:
I prefer Faatappe. Younger. Room to grow. Naden not so. We all see life differently. Im not talking about yesterday but tomorrow from today.
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@Tucker shares Benjis view that there’s a solid footy player creeping about in there somewhere.

But I am really enjoying the kids press interviews. He’s still innocent and a bit of a lad.

He’s one of our investments.
 
Vicious said:
💯
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You are both right. But only if short term outcomes are the priority.

Playing Naden in a wooden spoon team is the short term thinking that dug this hole.

It’s a mixed message. We need him to move on. He needs to know if he stays with us he will NEVER see first grade again.

Beyond him, we need our culture to be that we aren’t an easy retirement fund for any late career player. Players needs to see what happens.

Perform or fade to nothing in state cup.

Every player that comes here needs to understand that is a truth that waits if they don’t put in or can’t control their behaviour on field.
 
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