Coronavirus Outbreak

[mike]

Police and legal officers are drafting modifications to existing health orders relating to

1. ownership of two homes and owners being able to travel to the second home during lockdowns
2. issues around the single bubble.

Also there is a request for additional ADF personnel for the hot spot areas.

From what was advised on 9, Police consider the existing health orders work for the public but not the Police.

This follows what was reported as a fiery meeting between Brad Hazzard and David Elliott. The new health orders if accepted have to be redrafted in 48 hours.

Can’t see this ending well either way.

 

[Tiger Beach]

A lot of younger people are opting for AZ. Those who are under 60 and without medical conditions need to get the AZ. You shouldn't have to make the choice but that is the reality of the situation.

I think AZ has been unfairly maligned, it is perfectly safe.

It is not perfectly safe (11 people have died from it in Aus) but it is exceedingly safe relative to COVID. It is also significantly less effective than Pfizer.

11 deaths in millions of shots is perfectly safe. It is statistically safer than having a bath.

I'm guessing there are at least 11 families that would argue that

11 deaths in over 6 million doses.

Compare that to the 945 deaths from 37,300 cases. It's many times over safer than your chances in being offed by the virus, noting that it's killing healthy, young people now.

The TGA advises 7 deaths linked to the vaxx with a further 418 deaths in people who have recently been vaccinated. The conclusion is that these 418 didn’t die as a result of the vaxx so I’ll respect that view

I would however argue that in much the same manner there is a distinct likelihood that some to many of the so called covid deaths are attributed to people who tested positive using a flawed PCR test and then died of something other than covid. The age profile and co-morbidities would add weight to that view

Also I'm not sure I agree on the age profile moving younger based on this graph

To be fair, you would get similar results if you wrote: are not suited to or could die from playing rugby league, above the graph.

To be equally fair I sometimes think it could represent the profile of WTF members in this thread

 

[Tiger Beach]

A lot of younger people are opting for AZ. Those who are under 60 and without medical conditions need to get the AZ. You shouldn't have to make the choice but that is the reality of the situation.

I think AZ has been unfairly maligned, it is perfectly safe.

It is not perfectly safe (11 people have died from it in Aus) but it is exceedingly safe relative to COVID. It is also significantly less effective than Pfizer.

11 deaths in millions of shots is perfectly safe. It is statistically safer than having a bath.

I'm guessing there are at least 11 families that would argue that

11 deaths in over 6 million doses.

Compare that to the 945 deaths from 37,300 cases. It's many times over safer than your chances in being offed by the virus, noting that it's killing healthy, young people now.

The TGA advises 7 deaths linked to the vaxx with a further 418 deaths in people who have recently been vaccinated. The conclusion is that these 418 didn’t die as a result of the vaxx so I’ll respect that view

I would however argue that in much the same manner there is a distinct likelihood that some to many of the so called covid deaths are attributed to people who tested positive using a flawed PCR test and then died of something other than covid. The age profile and co-morbidities would add weight to that view

Also I'm not sure I agree on the age profile moving younger based on this graph

Do you have any evidence of PCR being flawed. I mean nothing is perfect but a % failure would be nice. I mean what is the % false positive and what is the % false negative (much more concerning).

I'm sure you can research that yourself Mike, there's loads of information out there and anything I post I sense is highly disregarded. There are significant concerns about cycle levels used and I'm sure you've read them. The WHO have backed away from it and the creator of the test himself also expressed his view that it wasn't fit for the purpose it was being used for

Well that’s rather disappointing. I was throwing you a bone. I thought you would have some inkling. If your were to post some scientific literature it wouldn’t be ignored. But I guess then you don’t have any to back up your statements. Do you even know what cycle level used means?

I equally have an inkling you'll get over your disappointment

I'll also pass on your bone thanks Mike, you can keep it for yourself

You guess wrong and as I say you can find it yourself and I'm sure you already know that

On your last condescending sentence, yes, do you? I also know that if it's too high it produces false positives and again, that's available anywhere you'd care to look for it

 

[earl]

https://www.smh.com.au/world/europe/astrazeneca-lead-scientist-says-delta-makes-mass-testing-pointless-in-uk-20210811-p58hpe.html

>Scientists who addressed Britain’s all-party parliamentary group on coronavirus said it was time to accept that there is no way of stopping the virus spreading through the entire population, and monitoring people with mild symptoms was no longer helpful.

>Paul Hunter, a professor at the University of East Anglia and an expert in infectious diseases, told the committee: “The concept of herd immunity is unachievable because we know the infection will spread in unvaccinated populations and the latest data is suggesting that two doses is probably only 50 per cent protective against infection.

I'm laughing but it sounds like there are various levels of acceptance when it comes to living with the virus. It also sounds like the vaccines are getting less and less effective at actually stopping people getting infected.

The argument is that there is no use testing for COVID anymore. You just manage the people getting sick going forward.

 

[mike]

A lot of younger people are opting for AZ. Those who are under 60 and without medical conditions need to get the AZ. You shouldn't have to make the choice but that is the reality of the situation.

I think AZ has been unfairly maligned, it is perfectly safe.

It is not perfectly safe (11 people have died from it in Aus) but it is exceedingly safe relative to COVID. It is also significantly less effective than Pfizer.

11 deaths in millions of shots is perfectly safe. It is statistically safer than having a bath.

I'm guessing there are at least 11 families that would argue that

11 deaths in over 6 million doses.

Compare that to the 945 deaths from 37,300 cases. It's many times over safer than your chances in being offed by the virus, noting that it's killing healthy, young people now.

The TGA advises 7 deaths linked to the vaxx with a further 418 deaths in people who have recently been vaccinated. The conclusion is that these 418 didn’t die as a result of the vaxx so I’ll respect that view

I would however argue that in much the same manner there is a distinct likelihood that some to many of the so called covid deaths are attributed to people who tested positive using a flawed PCR test and then died of something other than covid. The age profile and co-morbidities would add weight to that view

Also I'm not sure I agree on the age profile moving younger based on this graph

Do you have any evidence of PCR being flawed. I mean nothing is perfect but a % failure would be nice. I mean what is the % false positive and what is the % false negative (much more concerning).

I'm sure you can research that yourself Mike, there's loads of information out there and anything I post I sense is highly disregarded. There are significant concerns about cycle levels used and I'm sure you've read them. The WHO have backed away from it and the creator of the test himself also expressed his view that it wasn't fit for the purpose it was being used for

Well that’s rather disappointing. I was throwing you a bone. I thought you would have some inkling. If your were to post some scientific literature it wouldn’t be ignored. But I guess then you don’t have any to back up your statements. Do you even know what cycle level used means?

I equally have an inkling you'll get over your disappointment

I'll also pass on your bone thanks Mike, you can keep it for yourself

You guess wrong and as I say you can find it yourself and I'm sure you already know that

On your last condescending sentence, yes, do you? I also know that if it's too high it produces false positives and again, that's available anywhere you'd care to look for it

Again do you have evidence of that or do you just ‘know’ ? What’s the % of false positives? Is it 1% or 0.0000001% or somewhere in between? False positives aren’t much of a problem, just means you need to test further, if you are hospitalised that’s exactly what they do. False negative’s could be a much bigger issue IMO. Meaning you could have people testing negative who are actually positive, thinking they are OK but instead spreading the virus.

 

[Tim Sheens]

Add to this the single jab numbers are growing its the double jab numbers plus 2 weeks after that counts

It's been pretty obvious for a while that they weren't mentioning this issue. You do get good coverage after one dose. Dr Chant said she preferred 2 people with one dose each compared to 1 person with 2 doses.

The thing is we really need 2 doses plus 2 weeks for a large chunk of people.

I reckon we should be opening up at 50% fully vaccinated but I also think it should really be based on opportunity to get vaccinated. Give the opportunity to everyone. Give it 2 months. Open up.

It's going to be interesting. If we don't have high vaccination rates it's spreading and our ICU's are going to be under pressure.

I believe opening at 70% vaccination is madness with the current high numbers. Gladys should concentrate on eliminating the virus through tougher restrictions in those areas where the virus remains circulating.

The Sydney basin needed to be isolated no later than the **Thursday prior to school holidays** commencing. Instead we have have had other states and regions in lockdown and at this rate are probably going to be an outlier state until closer to the end of the year than the Grand Final.

Did you mean the Thursday before 20th September? The 20th is when the next school holidays start. Or did you mean tomorrow 12th August?

He meant last holidays

Thanks, I couldn’t make sense of it. That clears it up. I missed the word needed, past tense.

I wrote here about the number of holiday makers headed up the motorway on the opposite side that Thursday back in late June and my disbelief that it wasn’t stopped prior to the school holidays that were about to begin.

That's where my greatest frustration with this almost helpless situation of treading water was born and my disgust when they bring up hindsight irks me further.

Seeing a new round of half price flights to a nice warm reopening today Cairns, along with other destinations that in the coming months we are unlikely able to board just rubs it in. Footy in Townsville doesn't help either.

 

[Tim Sheens]

Mmk...

Likely for some Newcastle/Hunter lockdowns to be extended today, allegedly.

I think once summer hits, it's going to be extremely hard to keep people inside and not going to the beach.

Should be a rush to get this sorted as best they can before summer, IMO.

The cutoff points for the Hunter lockdowns were weird, ending at Muswellbrook and not including Aberdeen or Scone was a mistake and I would expect that to be extended.

Yeah, pretty weird...
I'm reading they'll extend lockdowns 2 weeks.
Likely, later today.

Feel sorry for everyone impacted, across the country.

Will be announced at 11 mate

Mmk...

Likely for some Newcastle/Hunter lockdowns to be extended today, allegedly.

I think once summer hits, it's going to be extremely hard to keep people inside and not going to the beach.

Should be a rush to get this sorted as best they can before summer, IMO.

The cutoff points for the Hunter lockdowns were weird, ending at Muswellbrook and not including Aberdeen or Scone was a mistake and I would expect that to be extended.

Yeah, pretty weird...
I'm reading they'll extend lockdowns 2 weeks.
Likely, later today.

Feel sorry for everyone impacted, across the country.

Will be announced at 11 mate

Indeed.

I'll put on that Covid-19 channel on Foxtel and see what they have to say.

Hope you're holding up well Cochise.

Finding it tough, 7 weeks in. Its really hard for my daughter, it is getting to her and she was begging me last night to let her go to school for just one day. She is 8 and hasn't played with another kid for 7 weeks, it really is a little heart breaking to see the negative impact it is having on her.

That's rough.
There is no replacing the social aspect of schooling.
Hoping it works its self out soon.

The iPad and messenger for kids works a treat but isn't the same.

Yeah, I always said I wouldn't get her an ipad but relented for that very reason. Been buying things like totem tennis and things to keep her busy, but its hard when she is by herself and only has me to play with.

100%
You're aware but just a reminder, you're not the only one feeling this way. Hard time for all, unfortunately.

These lockdowns are isolating and no surprise the mental health hospitals and services are getting smashed.

Hope everyone's handling it the best they can, utilising whatever they have inside their homes to keep busy and keep their mind active.

This is a challenge and hopefully we'll all be stronger after conquering it.

Inbox is open for anyone feeling they need a chat.

Thanks mate, I'm actually feeling a lot better than I did last week.


In regards to mental health it does seem that there will be many sad stories that will be heard due to these lockdowns, and even as many or more that **will not be heard**.

When the freedom of a community has been restrained for so long, some of those individuals are not going to handle the lockdown as good as some other individuals, and it really doesn't matter what type of a person it is, **it can be anybody.**

When locked down and at home, Some people would try to manage some of their awkward situations by going into lets say **silent depression** with the intention of supposedly avoiding conflict with their family members, but this attitude can lead to frustration, then aggression, and than **even DV**. and you can guess the rest. It's all very sad.

Dear @cochise this topic could all be discussed in the Players>People>Socialmedia>Psychology, thread,
Please delete my last post in there with the realisation now that it did give a negative impression of a frustrated, distressed person, **i apologise**, but i now know how to better manage my frustrations, it is also worth noting here and to realise that these **undesired reactions** by a person is controlled by a function in our brain by what is known as the "**amygdala**" The amygdala is primarily involved in the processing of emotions and memories associated with fear. The amygdala is considered to be a part of the limbic system within the brain and is key to how we process strong emotions like fear or pleasure. The challenge for all of us then is to know how to refine these reactions so as to not to cause chaos in situations of **fear and threats**.

I beleive that thread could be beneficial for all of us to know more about the awareness of social behaviour how it is defined and how it is viewed from the science of psychology.

Like i've said before i do not have any experience in this field, but being married with children in a covid lockdown and now spending a considerable amount of time on social media such as this one has made me determined?? to learn more about social media and psychology.

So my wish now is that the deleted post be replaced by this one then allow the thread to resume from there. Cheers

I wasn't going to read this, but came back to it because of the bolded end to your initial paragraph. I pretty well ignored said thread, but will say it is good that you maintain an interest in such content alongside your family role.

Don't know if others are listening, though you have been heard by at least me.

 

[Tiger Beach]

Mmk...

Likely for some Newcastle/Hunter lockdowns to be extended today, allegedly.

I think once summer hits, it's going to be extremely hard to keep people inside and not going to the beach.

Should be a rush to get this sorted as best they can before summer, IMO.

The cutoff points for the Hunter lockdowns were weird, ending at Muswellbrook and not including Aberdeen or Scone was a mistake and I would expect that to be extended.

Yeah, pretty weird...
I'm reading they'll extend lockdowns 2 weeks.
Likely, later today.

Feel sorry for everyone impacted, across the country.

Will be announced at 11 mate

Mmk...

Likely for some Newcastle/Hunter lockdowns to be extended today, allegedly.

I think once summer hits, it's going to be extremely hard to keep people inside and not going to the beach.

Should be a rush to get this sorted as best they can before summer, IMO.

The cutoff points for the Hunter lockdowns were weird, ending at Muswellbrook and not including Aberdeen or Scone was a mistake and I would expect that to be extended.

Yeah, pretty weird...
I'm reading they'll extend lockdowns 2 weeks.
Likely, later today.

Feel sorry for everyone impacted, across the country.

Will be announced at 11 mate

Indeed.

I'll put on that Covid-19 channel on Foxtel and see what they have to say.

Hope you're holding up well Cochise.

Finding it tough, 7 weeks in. Its really hard for my daughter, it is getting to her and she was begging me last night to let her go to school for just one day. She is 8 and hasn't played with another kid for 7 weeks, it really is a little heart breaking to see the negative impact it is having on her.

That's rough.
There is no replacing the social aspect of schooling.
Hoping it works its self out soon.

The iPad and messenger for kids works a treat but isn't the same.

Yeah, I always said I wouldn't get her an ipad but relented for that very reason. Been buying things like totem tennis and things to keep her busy, but its hard when she is by herself and only has me to play with.

100%
You're aware but just a reminder, you're not the only one feeling this way. Hard time for all, unfortunately.

These lockdowns are isolating and no surprise the mental health hospitals and services are getting smashed.

Hope everyone's handling it the best they can, utilising whatever they have inside their homes to keep busy and keep their mind active.

This is a challenge and hopefully we'll all be stronger after conquering it.

Inbox is open for anyone feeling they need a chat.

Thanks mate, I'm actually feeling a lot better than I did last week.


In regards to mental health it does seem that there will be many sad stories that will be heard due to these lockdowns, and even as many or more that **will not be heard**.

When the freedom of a community has been restrained for so long, some of those individuals are not going to handle the lockdown as good as some other individuals, and it really doesn't matter what type of a person it is, **it can be anybody.**

When locked down and at home, Some people would try to manage some of their awkward situations by going into lets say **silent depression** with the intention of supposedly avoiding conflict with their family members, but this attitude can lead to frustration, then aggression, and than **even DV**. and you can guess the rest. It's all very sad.

Dear @cochise this topic could all be discussed in the Players>People>Socialmedia>Psychology, thread,
Please delete my last post in there with the realisation now that it did give a negative impression of a frustrated, distressed person, **i apologise**, but i now know how to better manage my frustrations, it is also worth noting here and to realise that these **undesired reactions** by a person is controlled by a function in our brain by what is known as the "**amygdala**" The amygdala is primarily involved in the processing of emotions and memories associated with fear. The amygdala is considered to be a part of the limbic system within the brain and is key to how we process strong emotions like fear or pleasure. The challenge for all of us then is to know how to refine these reactions so as to not to cause chaos in situations of **fear and threats**.

I beleive that thread could be beneficial for all of us to know more about the awareness of social behaviour how it is defined and how it is viewed from the science of psychology.

Like i've said before i do not have any experience in this field, but being married with children in a covid lockdown and now spending a considerable amount of time on social media such as this one has made me determined?? to learn more about social media and psychology.

So my wish now is that the deleted post be replaced by this one then allow the thread to resume from there. Cheers

Take care of yourself @FinestTigers
Treasure every minute with your family, stand in your own power and keep speaking your truth

You may be up against it in here but ignore the insults and know that there are plenty out there with alternate views which challenge the version of the covid narrative which is defended so aggressively in here

 

[pawsandclaws1]

We're lucky to live in a country where a vaccine is available and there is a social security system to assist our citizens. The scenes in Pattaya, Thailand where the tourist industry has been devastated are disturbing.

 

[bathursttiger1]

From the SMH.

"A Sydney man who triggered a snap lockdown in Byron Bay after travelling to the area while infected with COVID-19 will be charged with breaching public health orders.

Zoran Radovanovic, 52, who is now being treated at Lismore Base Hospital, is believed to have travelled to the Byron area at the start of August to look at real estate, potentially using an exemption contained in NSW COVID-19 restrictions.

A resident of Rose Bay in Sydney's eastern suburbs, he will be served with a court attendance notice on Wednesday for allegedly breaching public health orders during the trip, NSW Police said in a statement.

Mr Radovanovic's trip plunged the Byron Bay, Richmond Valley, Lismore and Ballina local government areas into a week-long lockdown on Monday.

Following an initial investigation into the man, who travelled with his teenage children, police allege he did not have a reasonable excuse to be away from his Sydney home.

He will be visited by police at the hospital and be subject to strict bail conditions before an appearance in Lismore Local Court scheduled for September 13.

"I would appeal to all members of the community, regardless of where you come from, to abide by these public health orders," Assistant Commissioner Peter McKenna said.

Under the reasonable excuses for leaving the home outlined in the public health order, people are permitted to travel to inspect "a potential new place of residence".

Speaking in Sydney on Wednesday morning, Deputy Commissioner Gary Worboys indicated police were looking into the legitimacy of the man's property search.

"There is the appointments that are made, the time that's taken, there's a whole range of things that police can investigate to see whether that journey was bona fide in terms of its reasonableness in terms of the orders," he said. "So that will form part of the investigation for sure."

His wife, who was a confirmed case of COVID-19, before leaving to spend six days in Byron Bay and surrounding communities.

Mr Radovanovic's family moved to Rose Bay from Forestville on the northern beaches last year, selling the house for $2.2 million.

It has emerged that **Mr Radovanovic has historical convictions for burglary, theft, criminal damage, drug and forgery offences** - a record that was scrutinised when he successfully prevented his deportation to Serbia two decades ago.

In the Administrative Appeals Tribunal in 2000, Mr Radovanovic successfully appealed against a federal government attempt to cancel his visa and deport him to the former Yugoslavia.

AAT Deputy President B.M. Forrest said he was "not satisfied that [Mr Radovanovic] passes the character test" but exercised his discretion to allow him to stay in Australia.

On Tuesday, Byron Shire mayor Michael Lyon said the man "came up from Sydney in late July, ostensibly to look at real estate".

Cr Lyon said he was told the man, whose two teenage children have also tested positive and are at the same hospital, wasn't checking in anywhere and has "apparently been quite evasive with questions".

The man had "nothing in his phone in terms of QR codes, didn't believe in COVID", Cr Lyon said.

Contact tracing investigations revealed on Tuesday the man had visited five venues in the area while infectious from August 2 to 7. Close contacts include visitors and staff at the Foodworks supermarket in Bangalow, Woolworths in Byron Bay, Bangalow Pharmacy, Japonaise Kitchen in Byron Bay and Harvest at Newrybar.

Japonaise Kitchen posted a message to Instagram on Tuesday, saying it was forced to close until at least August 20 while staff isolate, and its ability to reopen would depend "on the condition that the staff workers are in".

Harvest, a restaurant, bakery, deli and wedding venue just over 10 kilometres south-west of Byron Bay township, was running its takeaway operation on Wednesday morning after it was deep cleaned on Tuesday.

In a post to Instagram, co-owner Tristan Grier said the man visited the venue on Saturday morning, picked up a coffee and perused the bakery.

Mr Grier said police spoke to staff about protocols on Monday "and we followed those to a tee". Half of the venue's staff were tested and are in isolation for 14 days, he said".

A real big thanks to the bleading hearts on the AAT board.

 

[Pascoes_barber]

*Sure would be a shame if the Department of Home Affairs decided to revisit his suitability to hold a visa huh?*

Things have changed since the year 2000.

 

[Tim Sheens]

We're lucky to live in a country where a vaccine is available and there is a social security system to assist our citizens. The scenes in Pattaya, Thailand where the tourist industry has been devastated are disturbing.

A country tearing itself apart yet forging ahead for so many years.
Divided community, Thaksin, on and off military rule and the loss of a beloved King now replaced by what many think of as an undeserving and inappropriate heir.

To be fair the nation has been slowly implementing a social security network with improved pension type payments etcetera, but is suffering more than just about any other through the lack of the tourism industry on which it depends.

Next door in Myanmar is much worse with their hardening junta plunging the strongly covid affected country much deeper than it should be.

 

[Tiger5150]

We're lucky to live in a country where a vaccine is available and there is a social security system to assist our citizens. The scenes in Pattaya, Thailand where the tourist industry has been devastated are disturbing.

For most of the tourists going to Pattaya, catching COVID would the least of their problems and risks.

 

[Wildcat777]

Covid sux. Its a changing / evolving beast. Though the majority are doing and trying their best. Its the minority who are blind / stupid or both that are the vehicle for its movement and evolution. No point revisiting the past. Wont help other than confirm the above which we cant do anything about. In The current CB LGA a friend who is in Hospital with Covid is a Non believe of the virus and antivaxer. I hope he pulls through ok. But in reality you can only lead a horse to water. But what disturbing where he contracted the business Owner knew he was sick with Covid But continued to serve the public. If you ask me is criminal But ask him, he did nothing wrong. Thats the world we live in and the ppl we have to deal with.

 

[jadtiger]

I had my 2nd AZ jab yesterday,all good so far though i was tired yesterday afternoon

 

[earl]

But in reality you can only lead a horse to water.

I read an article yesterday and the point was to just let it rip. Once you get vaccines out if people don't want to believe in COVID or they have funny theories about vaccination call their bluff.

It's their decision.

My only concern is people who haven't had a chance to get vaccinated including children. It does effect children a lot less.

It's going to be interesting times coming up. The virus gets out the unvaccinated die. The people who were brand shopping and they don't understand the meaning of efficacy have died. This will continue.

 

[Wildcat777]

Had my 2nd Phz Jan today. All good so far. Recommend we all get Jabbed. Wouldnt dare risk not having it. I am sure the consequences of those that make that decision will be realised in the near future. I dont understand why you wouldn’t but sheep will be sheep. Hopefully not too late for some.

 

[earl]

I dont understand why you wouldn’t but sheep will be sheep.

Apparently everyone getting the vaccine are the sheeple. It's fascinating isn't it.

My personal opinion is that COVID doesn't care if you are a sheeple or not.

 

[Wildcat777]

True dies not discriminate!

 

[Wildcat777]

Apologies auto text ‘does not’