Fifita, Teo and Hoffman

[TimmyB]

I'd still have him in our side over a few of the other props.

Absolutely true, and i haven't watched him a great deal this year.

Watching last night though he is still not a worker, and I don't think he'll ever be the leader of the forward pack. Not sure he would make a huge difference to us this year - he has a lot of support at the Sharks.

 

[Tbone]

Rewatching last night's match and there is no way in hell Fifita is a better player than Woods.

He's been on the field 15 minutes and he's made a couple of hit ups. He's slow to get back in defense and doesn't make any tackles from marker. Very few of the tackles has he made first contact. After he came on South were making a lot more metres through the middle of the ruck. There's a reason Fifita is playing off the bench for the Sharks and not starting. He looks like a luxury player to me.

Fafita ran for over 200 metres last night against the same team that killed us through the middle and reduced us to a laughing stock. He also made nearly 50 tackles (no missed tackles). He was involved in everything. Credit where its due.

If I'm not mistaken, Fafita has run over 200m in a match 3 or 4 times this year. His last month of football has been epic. If he was still at the Tigers we'd be singing his praises.

Nothing against Woods. I'm a big fan and when he gets his chance at rep level he will do well.

 

[Demonborger]

Fafita is big and aggressive and destroyed the biggest pack in the comp. Ellis + Dwyer + Fafita = big and aggressive, all gone… :frowning:

 

[1974semifinal]

some of you people wouldn't know a good forward if he ran over the top of you..a bit like Sheens and McDonnell…he wasnt called into the NSW up and comers a couple of years ago for no reason.......Wests Tigers management and Sheens and his offsiders have screwed this club stupid... and the management continues to be a joke. How do you resign your post and then stay on to spend whatever money is left ....get Humpty out.

 

[TimmyB]

Did you watch the game?

Statistics are useful, but at times an overeliance upon these is reductionist and facile.

The facts are that the overwhelming and vast majority of Fifita's hitups last night were when Cronulla was on the attack. When Cronulla were fighting territory war between the 15-30 minute mark and 40-55 minute mark he took almost no hitups. In fact I counted about 5 hitups from within the Sharks' half. He was extremely slow to get back the 10 - at one stage in the first half he retreated 10 far before the tackle was even made. I was more impressed with Bukaya and Tupou who did a lot of the hard yards.

In defence he was slow and looked tired. Case in point Burgess' try. Whilst Burgess was not Fifita's man, his fatigue was. fairly evident in that play.

I think the Cameron Smith/Billy Slater/Cooper Cronk combination could find him out in origin, unless he players very few minutes. Just an opinion.

 

[TimmyB]

Rewatching last night's match and there is no way in hell Fifita is a better player than Woods.

He's been on the field 15 minutes and he's made a couple of hit ups. He's slow to get back in defense and doesn't make any tackles from marker. Very few of the tackles has he made first contact. After he came on South were making a lot more metres through the middle of the ruck. There's a reason Fifita is playing off the bench for the Sharks and not starting. He looks like a luxury player to me.

Fafita ran for over 200 metres last night against the same team that killed us through the middle and reduced us to a laughing stock. He also made nearly 50 tackles (no missed tackles). He was involved in everything. Credit where its due.

If I'm not mistaken, Fafita has run over 200m in a match 3 or 4 times this year. His last month of football has been epic. If he was still at the Tigers we'd be singing his praises.

Nothing against Woods. I'm a big fan and when he gets his chance at rep level he will do well.

Mate did you watch the game? Of course he didn't miss any tackles, he made first contact in 10 of those tackles at the very most.

When Cronulla were doing the hard yards out of there own territory, he made very, very few carries. It's simply inarguable to suggest otherwise.

 

[innsaneink]

Someone has an axe to grind

I watched the game but didnt pay as close attention to where and when he did this or that, I'll take your word for it, but maybe…just maybe Flanagn has him playing that way to get the max benefit out of hist style of game....god coaches dont leave things like this up in the air to be played by ear at the time

 

[TimmyB]

Someone has an axe to grind

I watched the game but didnt pay as close attention to where and when he did this or that, I'll take your word for it, but maybe…just maybe Flanagn has him playing that way to get the max benefit out of hist style of game....god coaches dont leave things like this up in the air to be played by ear at the time

My opinion is that Fifita's metamorphosis is not as complete as some might think, particularly those who are basing their views upon statistics. I readily confessed my view was largely based upon watching the match last night. It was an opinion and nothing more.

Sure Flannagan may be using him this way because that is when there is max benefit. That's accords pretty nicely with my contention that he is a a luxury player. I don't think Fifita would have anywhere near the impact he is having with our rabble, nor do I think he will be useful in making the tough metres at origin level. Cronulla are getting massive purchase from all of their forwards, and Ryan, Pomeroy and Wright also make a lot of metres out of dummy half. From watching last night's match, and subsequently the Newcastle match, Fifita hasn't put his hand up on those occasions where Cronulla were in trouble.

Why accuse me of an agenda and not those who are using this as a further reason to flog the dead horse that is Tim Sheens? What drives you to be so damn churlish all the time? It's quite remarkable. I watched with a keen interest because of all the press about Fifita, and because I was surprised he was selected over the incumbent Grant - particularly when Grant has been critically important to the Panthers' excellent form.

 

[Paris_Cobbs]

I thought that the story with Hoffman was that he left when Sheens took over because his father, Jay Hoffman hates Sheens. Sheens coached Jay Hoffman at The Raiders and Hoffman sat on the bench for the entirety of a Grand Final and Sheens never gave him a run. Not sure which Grand Final.

Anyone else heard this story?

My understanding is that Hoffman left because his old man is good mates with Bellyache Bellamy, from those same Canberra days, and Storm put up unmatchable $$$ to make it happen.

Ha Ha, mine is a better story, but yours is more likely true!

 

[Tbone]

Did you watch the game?

Statistics are useful, but at times an overeliance upon these is reductionist and facile.

The facts are that the overwhelming and vast majority of Fifita's hitups last night were when Cronulla was on the attack. When Cronulla were fighting territory war between the 15-30 minute mark and 40-55 minute mark he took almost no hitups. In fact I counted about 5 hitups from within the Sharks' half. He was extremely slow to get back the 10 - at one stage in the first half he retreated 10 far before the tackle was even made. I was more impressed with Bukaya and Tupou who did a lot of the hard yards.

In defence he was slow and looked tired. Case in point Burgess' try. Whilst Burgess was not Fifita's man, his fatigue was. fairly evident in that play.

I think the Cameron Smith/Billy Slater/Cooper Cronk combination could find him out in origin, unless he players very few minutes. Just an opinion.

I watched it twice as I do for every game every weekend. He was dominant, aggressive and in Burgess's face (both of them). He was probably tired from running 200+ metres and making 50 tackles. Even if your argument is that he made a lazy/easy 200+ metres (!!!) he was bloody good. And I agree statistics arent everything. He is actually one player that brings more to the team than just his stats. He brings aggression and intimidation; both are critical and the Tigers have neither.

Again, I'm not knocking Woods. I think he is incredible for us. But I also think Fafita has been excellent. I think Fafita's aggression and raw power is something that an origin coach would love to have in their team. If he is used well by Daley he shouldn't be playing enormous minutes in his first origin, but he should be good for 30-40.

I agree Bokuya and Tupou were both very good too.