Inside look into Tigers Management/Negotiations

[innsaneink]

Vinnie said "hey chill out guys", but IMO the reason for lack of chill in this thread is the angle that Adrian is some kind of insider or has closer access to the club, and therefore what he says is a more valid opinion than the average punter.


I was mainly referring to people firing up and insulting each other all over a podcast.

To some people this is considered an inside perspective (myself included) as he did have some dealings relating to recruitment, more than I personally have or the average punter. Hence the title of the OP and hence why I shared it.

To others this may have been common knowledge - and that's completely fine.

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other's don't get anything out of it then sure...nothing wrong with that.

If people get so fired up over the title of a forum post, how do they survive being a Tigers fan? We have click bait journalist titles way worse than this 3-4 times a day posted in the media hahah

It's all pretty crazy isn't it?
I'm getting a sense of jealousy from some

 

[jirskyr]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.

Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

 

[Needaname]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

 

[cochise]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

 

[Needaname]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

Pathways though? I’m confused about this part.
Are they isolated to just building the frame work of the juniors and coaching them through it or are they (Kimmorely & Betsy) a part of the NRL operations? I guess I mean is there going to be collaboration or is It being completely divisionalised?

 

[tigerbalm]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

Who said Adrian for PM? get a grip.

Listen, ill make it simple. Adrian was a messenger of a message resonated with a lot of people who probably had similar thoughts. What gave it some weight was the guy has " some" dealings with the club on "some" level. More than me. The reason this is important is us plebs on the outside need to know that someone on the "inside" is seeing the same issues.

I read someone on here mention something about jealousy and i thought that was probably not it but after ready you list your club resume (lol) then call Adrian naïve and condescending before saying he's good at selling fruit (wow), i think they may have been on to something.

If you don't like the thread jog on. Its real **simps**...

 

[cochise]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

Pathways though? I’m confused about this part.
Are they isolated to just building the frame work of the juniors and coaching them through it or are they (Kimmorely & Betsy) a part of the NRL operations? I guess I mean is there going to be collaboration or is It being completely divisionalised?

A big part of their role is about providing synergy between the NRL systems and the pathway systems, it is about developing that consistency between what is happen at and NRL level to what is happening in the pathways. A lot of it will involve working with coaches and trainers in the pathways and having them closer align to the systems in the NRL to allow for players to be ready for NRL when they get there.

Pascoe is not heavily involved in football, he is not deciding who we sign or how we play. He is primarily focused on the corporate side of the business, people over state his role in football areas.

 

[innsaneink]

Maybe after 7 or 8 years of frustration you may do a 'spill the beans' podcast too

 

[cochise]

Maybe after 7 or 8 years of frustration you may do a 'spill the beans' podcast too

7 or 8? Its at least 35.

 

[Coastie_Tiger]

I had a bit of a listen to the podcast I guess it’s best to take these sorts of insights with a grain of salt. I was however gobsmacked by two things, 1) that a supporter who sends an email to the CEO actually gets somehow gets indirectly involved in recruitment 2) then gets asked with little notice to stump up some cash to keep Teddy 😂

I’m guessing the bloke involved posts here fair play to you mate, you can also talk with a mouthful of marbles underwater.

 

[gallagher]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

Pathways though? I’m confused about this part.
Are they isolated to just building the frame work of the juniors and coaching them through it or are they (Kimmorely & Betsy) a part of the NRL operations? I guess I mean is there going to be collaboration or is It being completely divisionalised?

A big part of their role is about providing synergy between the NRL systems and the pathway systems, it is about developing that consistency between what is happen at and NRL level to what is happening in the pathways. A lot of it will involve working with coaches and trainers in the pathways and having them closer align to the systems in the NRL to allow for players to be ready for NRL when they get there.

Pascoe is not heavily involved in football, he is not deciding who we sign or how we play. He is primarily focused on the corporate side of the business, people over state his role in football areas.

The think is though, Pascoe has a coffee with james Roberts to 'check on his health' then 3 days later he's contracted to the club.

That's what people see.

 

[cochise]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

Pathways though? I’m confused about this part.
Are they isolated to just building the frame work of the juniors and coaching them through it or are they (Kimmorely & Betsy) a part of the NRL operations? I guess I mean is there going to be collaboration or is It being completely divisionalised?

A big part of their role is about providing synergy between the NRL systems and the pathway systems, it is about developing that consistency between what is happen at and NRL level to what is happening in the pathways. A lot of it will involve working with coaches and trainers in the pathways and having them closer align to the systems in the NRL to allow for players to be ready for NRL when they get there.

Pascoe is not heavily involved in football, he is not deciding who we sign or how we play. He is primarily focused on the corporate side of the business, people over state his role in football areas.

The think is though, Pascoe has a coffee with james Roberts to 'check on his health' then 3 days later he's contracted to the club.

That's what people see.

Hartigan was also sitting in that meeting

 

[Animal Mother]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

Pathways though? I’m confused about this part.
Are they isolated to just building the frame work of the juniors and coaching them through it or are they (Kimmorely & Betsy) a part of the NRL operations? I guess I mean is there going to be collaboration or is It being completely divisionalised?

A big part of their role is about providing synergy between the NRL systems and the pathway systems, it is about developing that consistency between what is happen at and NRL level to what is happening in the pathways. A lot of it will involve working with coaches and trainers in the pathways and having them closer align to the systems in the NRL to allow for players to be ready for NRL when they get there.

Pascoe is not heavily involved in football, he is not deciding who we sign or how we play. He is primarily focused on the corporate side of the business, people over state his role in football areas.

The think is though, Pascoe has a coffee with james Roberts to 'check on his health' then 3 days later he's contracted to the club.

That's what people see.

Hartigan was also sitting in that meeting

He’s proven himself useful.

 

[Tiger5150]

Vinnie said "hey chill out guys", but IMO the reason for lack of chill in this thread is the angle that Adrian is some kind of insider or has closer access to the club, and therefore what he says is a more valid opinion than the average punter.


I was mainly referring to people firing up and insulting each other all over a podcast.

To some people this is considered an inside perspective (myself included) as he did have some dealings relating to recruitment, more than I personally have or the average punter. Hence the title of the OP and hence why I shared it.

To others this may have been common knowledge - and that's completely fine.

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other's don't get anything out of it then sure...nothing wrong with that.

If people get so fired up over the title of a forum post, how do they survive being a Tigers fan? We have click bait journalist titles way worse than this 3-4 times a day posted in the media hahah

Mate I was one of the posters who jumped in the hardest probably, but no question there is no problem with posting the OP, its of interest. No judgement.

 

[gallagher]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

I respect your post, appreciate the candidness of it.
I do question your final statement based solely off Pascoes CV (LinkedIn) and past experience you can read in the CV.
I don’t know anyone at the club so it’s great to hear from someone that has built those connections with some of the management personnel but my main concern is that he does not have enough experience of what works in a football club based solely on the fact that he did his trade in football operations at the Panthers during a tenure where they were not the most competitive club at the time.
He then came here at a club in similar circumstances with no real support (no general manager in the football department etc).
He has done an exceptional job of getting us to this position. But I feel we need more strength and support in the areas he himself admits he is limited in and that is the football operations.

Can Sheens alone provide that? I’m not sure.

In the past 4 months we have appointed Sheens, Kimmorley and Betsey to senior football roles in the club.

Pathways though? I’m confused about this part.
Are they isolated to just building the frame work of the juniors and coaching them through it or are they (Kimmorely & Betsy) a part of the NRL operations? I guess I mean is there going to be collaboration or is It being completely divisionalised?

A big part of their role is about providing synergy between the NRL systems and the pathway systems, it is about developing that consistency between what is happen at and NRL level to what is happening in the pathways. A lot of it will involve working with coaches and trainers in the pathways and having them closer align to the systems in the NRL to allow for players to be ready for NRL when they get there.

Pascoe is not heavily involved in football, he is not deciding who we sign or how we play. He is primarily focused on the corporate side of the business, people over state his role in football areas.

The think is though, Pascoe has a coffee with james Roberts to 'check on his health' then 3 days later he's contracted to the club.

That's what people see.

Hartigan was also sitting in that meeting

So why the need for Pascoe? He also flew to QLD to try and sign some donkeys.

 

[Tiger5150]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

Great post, well put and other than the fact that I have had zero interaction with the club for around 5 years, exactly the way I feel about the podcast and the thread.

 

[Tiger5150]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

Who said Adrian for PM? get a grip.

Listen, ill make it simple. Adrian was a messenger of a message resonated with a lot of people who probably had similar thoughts. What gave it some weight was the guy has " some" dealings with the club on "some" level. More than me. The reason this is important is us plebs on the outside need to know that someone on the "inside" is seeing the same issues.

I read someone on here mention something about jealousy and i thought that was probably not it but after ready you list your club resume (lol) then call Adrian naïve and condescending before saying he's good at selling fruit (wow), i think they may have been on to something.

If you don't like the thread jog on. Its real **simps**...

There have been a few posts in this thread and a specially dedicated thread to what the hell is wrong with this forum at the moment. This post is what is wrong with this thread at the moment.

@jirskyr posted a really well written and detailed response outlining how he felt about the issue, in a LOT of detail, how he got to that point of view and he gets told to "jog on if he doesn't like it".

Getting to the point that if people don't toe the line of the narrative, they need to shut up which kind of defeats the purpose of a forum. More like an echo chamber.

 

[Animal Mother]

I never said he is more valid than anyone, was purely sharing a podcast I came across that was worth a listen. If other’s don’t get anything out of it then sure…nothing wrong with that.


Just for the record I wasn't accusing you personally of anything. From my reading, the first dozen or so reactions to the podcast were along the lines of "hey yes I knew Tigers were incompetent" and "Adrian for PM" and stuff like that. I honestly opened up the pod expecting some kind of insider take on Tigers, which is not what it turned out to be - so was my misinterpretation of what had been written so far. From the comments it sounded like some kind of expose.

I think it's reasonable enough that some folks push back on that. I wouldn't personally be calling the guy out or calling him a wannabe, but I can understand how some folks will feel that slagging off the club in a public capacity, with your real name and background on the record, is not a positive move, no matter how personally invested you are in the ultimate success of the Tigers.

I'll put it another way - last 12-16 months I have had a fair amount of contact directly with the club via The Ambush. Not as regular as some of the other Ambush members like cochise or Geo or Tiger_Steve, but regular enough (especially during the offseason). I've met Adam Hartigan 4 or 5 times, Pascoe about once a month and some other membership and marketing folks. I've also met with the Wests Ashfield COO and set up a relationship with the Wests Ashfield events team so we can host matches at the club.

Now I could go on a podcast and discuss everything I've learned about the club, for good and bad, and provide my precise opinion on everything that's going on and the personnel that work at the club. My information is not super top secret but it's privy enough that I'm careful about what I say. I could very easily go on rants about Tigers and criticise Pascoe for things, and it would be supported by actual knowledge of operations, but I also want to consider the trust Tigers have placed in me / The Ambush and what is the actual goal of what I would say in public. I want to cooperate with and build something positive with the people in charge, not throw them under whatever bus I can find.

Also - I know for certain that what I think I know and what is the real truth are separate things. I know it's never as simple as it looks and almost always the media or public perception of some topic is usually not quite on the mark. I also know different people have different interpretations of what's going on at the club. So obviously people like Pascoe think they are doing the right thing, otherwise they'd be doing it differently.

I think Adrian is being both naive and condescending when describing Pascoe as "nice but lacking killer instinct". That definitely has an element of showboating in it. As far as I can tell, Adrian is good at selling fruit and has used that starting point to develop property, which is great when you have the capital to buy property. It's hard to lose money on property in Sydney the last 30 years. I don't know if it's an indicator of business excellence. I am certain Pascoe has far far more expertise and wile in operating a football club than many people give him credit for. I'd even argue his 6-year tenure must be testament to some kind of ability.

Who said Adrian for PM? get a grip.

Listen, ill make it simple. Adrian was a messenger of a message resonated with a lot of people who probably had similar thoughts. What gave it some weight was the guy has " some" dealings with the club on "some" level. More than me. The reason this is important is us plebs on the outside need to know that someone on the "inside" is seeing the same issues.

I read someone on here mention something about jealousy and i thought that was probably not it but after ready you list your club resume (lol) then call Adrian naïve and condescending before saying he's good at selling fruit (wow), i think they may have been on to something.

If you don't like the thread jog on. Its real **simps**...

There have been a few posts in this thread and a specially dedicated thread to what the hell is wrong with this forum at the moment. This post is what is wrong with this thread at the moment.

@jirskyr posted a really well written and detailed response outlining how he felt about the issue, in a LOT of detail, how he got to that point of view and he gets told to "jog on if he doesn't like it".

Getting to the point that if people don't toe the line of the narrative, they need to shut up which kind of defeats the purpose of a forum. More like an echo chamber.

There is a narrative alright. I pointed it out last night.

 

[tony soprano]

I'm pretty sure he got his desired effect you blokes still talking about it, radio and media .

 

[Animal Mother]

I'm pretty sure he got his desired effect you blokes still talking about it, radio and media .

Lol Shh I don’t think that has occurred to them yet.