International triple header *live thread*

[diedpretty]

Do people seriously believe the lack of "anthem singing" affected the result of that game? I somewhat agree with rustycage, and think some of you are outraged for the totally wrong reasons.

Blame Mal for the team selections. He's a myth of a coach anyway.

FYI Addo-Carr wears a mouthguard with the Aboriginal logo during most games he's played over the past couple of years (and has flashed it quite frequently, including in Origin and in last week's game).
His reasoning is to display pride in his Aboriginal heritage, as well as for inspiration or motivation for all Indigenous kids. So you want to hold that against him.

It's disgusting to see any ignorant comments re: the Indigenous issues the players are trying to highlight - which actually include Aboriginal recognition in the Constitution, Youth suicide and Youth detention.

So yeah if that big robust Tongan forward pack had players such as Cook and Tedesco rattled, how hard is it fathom that others were too.

This is a free country and everyone is entitled to voice their opinions.
I happen to agree the anthem is non-inclusive of our Indigenous population and honestly wish the politics would be left out of this forum ALTOGETHER because some of the comments just look borderline racist and it's disappointing to see.

You know absolutely nothing about me. I worked for Central Australia Health Services for years and worked closely with people in remote communities. I lived in Alice Springs for a number of years and have seen first hand the problems faced by Indigenous people. I was a youth worker in Kempsey and supported the young people in attaining accommodation and finishing school. And yet you think a comment I make about JAC's mouthguard is racist. I couldn't care what he does with his mouthguard however flashing it during the national anthem prior to a football match was obviously a political statement that I believe denigrates what he is attempting to promote. There are far better ways to protest that will send a stronger message and gain greater support.

 

[Lauren]

@diedpretty
I never said I knew you, or any posters for that matter personally, or called anyone racist.

I've only explained how I felt highly uncomfortable reading content that is
a) Outdated or ignorant

b) Disrespectful to the causes or issues that were being protested about

c) Politicising in itself....

You commented that flashing the mouthguard was somewhat disrespectful, while I only asked if people genuinely thought that the "lack of anthem singing" actually indirectly affected the scoreline??

I think that's absolutely fantastic that you do your bit for the Indigenous community and commend you for that.....but please why do you feel the need to attack others who don't share your view or highlight the things I have?

Like I said yesterday, who are we to tell anyone what their place is in this world? These players are not the only people who have an issue with the anthem.
Tell me exactly how it is inclusive of our Indigenous population?? It should represent contemporary Australia and pay some respect to our First Peoples IMO.

And please just tell it like it is, and call the players bloody lazy if that's what their attitude or performance is Game wise instead of being passive aggressive - by labelling a smile as disrespectful to our country, jersey or anthem......

It's okay if we have different values or beliefs, that's the real beauty of this country, but I'd very much prefer a debate or any interaction to be more civil.

Edit: Alice Springs and Hermannsburg are actually the two places that had a profound effect on me personally. It was a real culture shock(for me) yet gave me an opportunity to understand more about cultural protocols and how to apply cultural inclusive teaching strategies. So cheers for sharing that @diedpretty

 

[WT2K]


 

[TheDaBoss]


Welcome back johnson.....

Now can we get half decent commentators

 

[Russell]

We complain about our commentators.

Those NZ guys even make Voss sound good.

 

[happy_tiger]

Talking about the non singing players ....the game , the indigenous players have a real chance to make positive change for our entire community

We have an indigenous national coach as well ....why can't we find something that indigenous players could do at the end of Anthem that would show what playing as an indigenous player for your country as they see it

How much positive reinforcement could that give to our community as a whole and the young indigenous kids that look up to these players

I had an epiphany today talking to one of my indigenous staff about this ...A/ he didn't agree with what they did

So I mentioned to him why don't we sing all three parts of the National Anthem ...much as they South Africans do .......first part could be in one indigenous language , second part done in another indigenous language and then the part we all now sing done in English

It shows respect for everyone and gives a chance for both sides of the divide to reach equal ground and maybe finally feel we are all on the same page

 

[happy_tiger]

Or B/ Lets change the anthem to John Williamson's True Blue ......it chokes me up every time I hear it

 

[rustycage]

Talking about the non singing players ....the game , the indigenous players have a real chance to make positive change for our entire community

We have an indigenous national coach as well ....why can't we find something that indigenous players could do at the end of Anthem that would show what playing as an indigenous player for your country as they see it

How much positive reinforcement could that give to our community as a whole and the young indigenous kids that look up to these players

I had an epiphany today talking to one of my indigenous staff about this ...A/ he didn't agree with what they did

So I mentioned to him why don't we sing all three parts of the National Anthem ...much as they South Africans do .......first part could be in one indigenous language , second part done in another indigenous language and then the part we all now sing done in English

It shows respect for everyone and gives a chance for both sides of the divide to reach equal ground and maybe finally feel we are all on the same page

It's not because of who sings it or how it's sung. It's the content of the anthem that so many have an issue with. Sing it in whatever language you like. If it doesn't resonate with you it still means nothing. It's a shame that our national anthem is so divisive. Although I'm not old enough to remember any controversy from when we layed down the God Save the Queen anthem for our current one, I'm sure there were plenty that disagreed at the time. But now nobody thinks we should have kept it. Reason? I guess time - and maybe we grew up a little as a nation. That particular one became outdated & maybe this one is now outdated as well. It would be wonderful to find something that would stand the test of time. One that's all inclusive.

 

[Geo]

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pL_JvhfQjms

 

[NT_Tiger]

@happy_tiger Only problem with singing it in an indigenous language is there are many many languages in Australia. There were four active languages just in the relatively small area I worked in the NT. There is no 'one size fits all' solution.

 

[Russell]

Or B/ Lets change the anthem to John Williamson's True Blue ......it chokes me up every time I hear it

Or B/ Lets change the anthem to John Williamson's True Blue ......it chokes me up every time I hear it

For God sake Hap .... let's keep that in the cupboard.

Write a new one but .....

 

[Russell]

Could someone point out the offending verses please.

Australians all let us rejoice,
For we are young and free;
We’ve golden soil and wealth for toil;
Our home is girt by sea;
Our land abounds in nature’s gifts
Of beauty rich and rare;
In history’s page, let every stage
Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.
Beneath our radiant Southern Cross
We’ll toil with hearts and hands;
To make this Commonwealth of ours
Renowned of all the lands;
For those who’ve come across the seas
We’ve boundless plains to share;
With courage let us all combine
To Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.

 

[Geo]

girt is offesive to fat people..

 

[gallagher]

Could someone point out the offending verses please.

Australians all let us rejoice,
For we are young and free;
We’ve golden soil and wealth for toil;
Our home is girt by sea;
Our land abounds in nature’s gifts
Of beauty rich and rare;
In history’s page, let every stage
Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.
Beneath our radiant Southern Cross
We’ll toil with hearts and hands;
To make this Commonwealth of ours
Renowned of all the lands;
For those who’ve come across the seas
We’ve boundless plains to share;
With courage let us all combine
To Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.

Young and free I was told earlier this year. I doubt changing that line would appease them though.

 

[Russell]

Could someone point out the offending verses please.

Australians all let us rejoice,
For we are young and free;
We’ve golden soil and wealth for toil;
Our home is girt by sea;
Our land abounds in nature’s gifts
Of beauty rich and rare;
In history’s page, let every stage
Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.
Beneath our radiant Southern Cross
We’ll toil with hearts and hands;
To make this Commonwealth of ours
Renowned of all the lands;
For those who’ve come across the seas
We’ve boundless plains to share;
With courage let us all combine
To Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.

Young and free I was told earlier this year. I doubt changing that line would appease them though.

Could someone point out the offending verses please.

Australians all let us rejoice,
For we are young and free;
We’ve golden soil and wealth for toil;
Our home is girt by sea;
Our land abounds in nature’s gifts
Of beauty rich and rare;
In history’s page, let every stage
Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.
Beneath our radiant Southern Cross
We’ll toil with hearts and hands;
To make this Commonwealth of ours
Renowned of all the lands;
For those who’ve come across the seas
We’ve boundless plains to share;
With courage let us all combine
To Advance Australia Fair.
In joyful strains then let us sing,
Advance Australia Fair.

Young and free I was told earlier this year. I doubt changing that line would appease them though.

WHAT! Indigenous people are all old and captive (excluding the ones in prison of course)?

No wonder they object.

 

[OzLuke]

Talking about the non singing players ....the game , the indigenous players have a real chance to make positive change for our entire community

We have an indigenous national coach as well ....why can't we find something that indigenous players could do at the end of Anthem that would show what playing as an indigenous player for your country as they see it

How much positive reinforcement could that give to our community as a whole and the young indigenous kids that look up to these players

I had an epiphany today talking to one of my indigenous staff about this ...A/ he didn't agree with what they did

So I mentioned to him why don't we sing all three parts of the National Anthem ...much as they South Africans do .......first part could be in one indigenous language , second part done in another indigenous language and then the part we all now sing done in English

It shows respect for everyone and gives a chance for both sides of the divide to reach equal ground and maybe finally feel we are all on the same page


It's not because of who sings it or how it's sung. It's the content of the anthem that so many have an issue with. Sing it in whatever language you like. If it doesn't resonate with you it still means nothing. It's a shame that our national anthem is so divisive. Although I'm not old enough to remember any controversy from when we layed down the God Save the Queen anthem for our current one, I'm sure there were plenty that disagreed at the time. But now nobody thinks we should have kept it. Reason? I guess time - and maybe we grew up a little as a nation. That particular one became outdated & maybe this one is now outdated as well. It would be wonderful to find something that would stand the test of time. One that's all inclusive.

Preston Campbell does so much for the community, much, much more than these guys do today, and he is one one the most respected figures within the game. Why did he not get scrutinized like the indigenous players do these days? How did he not come under so much controversy?

 

[OzLuke]

girt is offesive to fat people..

you may be confusing that with girth.....

 

[OzLuke]

@happy_tiger Only problem with singing it in an indigenous language is there are many many languages in Australia. There were four active languages just in the relatively small area I worked in the NT. There is no 'one size fits all' solution.

There have been ideas about introducing an indigenous war dance like the haka.....

Now the debate that would come from that would be if indigenous communities would appreciate non-indigenous players performing it with them?

 

[NT_Tiger]

@OzLuke
It would also be interesting to see what dance they come up with. From my experience, knowledge of proper 'in law' dances is very rare on the ground.
In the area I worked and lived, very few people were willing to perform religious dances, for example funeral dances, because they simply didn't have full knowledge of how to perform them properly. Particularly if someone important died, the local people would wait until a certain group of elders from within Arnhemland could come to perform the dancing.
The dances are taken very seriously and I can assure you that some of them are quite frightening, every bit as much as a haka.
The other side of the coin may be that if the dance is sacred (which it could well be) there is very little likelihood that anyone would be willing to teach it to outsiders.
Most likely the result, if there is one, is that it would be some kind of gammon.

 

[OzLuke]

@OzLuke
It would also be interesting to see what dance they come up with. From my experience, knowledge of proper 'in law' dances is very rare on the ground.
In the area I worked and lived, very few people were willing to perform religious dances, for example funeral dances, because they simply didn't have full knowledge of how to perform them properly. Particularly if someone important died, the local people would wait until a certain group of elders from within Arnhemland could come to perform the dancing.
The dances are taken very seriously and I can assure you that some of them are quite frightening, every bit as much as a haka.
The other side of the coin may be that if the dance is sacred (which it could well be) there is very little likelihood that anyone would be willing to teach it to outsiders.
Most likely the result, if there is one, is that it would be some kind of gammon.

But if people are willing to learn who aren't indigenous, I know you said they are sacred, then wouldn't education of others help more than hiding it away? most who don't have indigenous background would find it fascinating.