Let's give credit where credit's due

alex

New member
Joined
Jul 12, 2009
Messages
3,748
Location
Haberfield
A lot of people in Rugby League have been slamming the Toyota Cup as a weak second tier competition that is not a suitable pathway to first grade for many reasons, mainly the fact that the age limit of 20 is too young.

I agree to some extent and believe the age should be raised to U22s or U23s.

A lot has also been said about how the forwards aren't being fully developed and are still too raw when they enter first grade.

I must admit, last night put that theory to bed. I noticed in one set of six when we had the Bulldogs pinned in their own 20, three tackles in a row, the tacklers were Rob Lui, Simon Dwyer and Andrew Fifita, in all of the three tackles. Gotta say, it's provided a pretty decent pathway at our club, not to mention the graduates in Moltzen and Ayshford.

We've pretty much covered every position with someone from the 20s .. 2 in the back line, 2-3 in the halves, a monstering prop, and some talented backrowers in Dwyer and Mataka.

Well done to the young guns in the team and let's hope their futures are with the Tigers.
 

Peaches

New member
Joined
Jul 11, 2009
Messages
2,925
Location
Mount Pritchard
The likes of Dwyer, Fifita and Lui would have made FG in the old system as well. In fact more players are playing FG because there is no reserve grade comp and clubs are scared of losing future stars. Look at the rosters at the start of the year and there are a few players who have little or no FG experience.

This Toyota Cup I think is the wrong system. Its the numerous players who haven't quite peaked by the age of 18 or 20 who than go into other sports or give it up entirely, they are the ones lost to the game.
 

alex

New member
Joined
Jul 12, 2009
Messages
3,748
Location
Haberfield
Yeah it seems the two systems - NYC and State Cup - is a bit muddled. While I'm all for raising the age .. what would then differ it from the SC?
 

Geo

Moderator
Staff member
Forum Leader
Joined
Jul 10, 2009
Messages
47,745
Location
Campbelltown NSW..
Darren Nichols, Chris Corby, David Fifita, Blake Lazarus, Rhys Curren, Willie Mataka, Jason Schirnack, Sioeli Makaui, Michael Stolk and Lance Siataga have all found positions with either Wests or BRET in State Cup after out growing the 20's

That's not including Fifita and Dwyer currently in FG…or Lui who is still eligable to play 20's this year...

Not a bad retention rate....Not too many get away...

Cap concessions also come into it...

We have one of the best junior development of any Club IMO...

Credit to McDonnell and Sheens for sure...
 

alex

New member
Joined
Jul 12, 2009
Messages
3,748
Location
Haberfield
As much as I dislike/criticised McDonnell for not being active enough in the current player market - ie only shopping at the Panthers reserve grade shop … he does have a good eye for junior talent.

Lui was brought down from Townsville. The Fifitas are from the Wagga area. He does have his eyes and ears in all corners of the country.
 

tigergirlz

New member
Joined
Jul 11, 2009
Messages
2,812
Under 23's, then reserve grade like the good old days.
If they want the kids game to take priority, run it -
game 1\. Reserve Grade (would probably mean one reserve grade per club, i.e. a Wests Tigers reserve grade instead of BRET and Magpies)
game 2\. Toyota Cup (Under 23's)
game 3\. First grade.
Only problem is that for Friday and Monday night games reserve grade players will need to be at the ground by about 2.30pm, which is difficult if you work in the real world as well.
 

Colonel

New member
Joined
Jul 10, 2009
Messages
293
If I was making the rules, I'd put in a rule whereby a player who plays even one game on Toyota Cup cannot play in first grade in the same year. They can play Queensland or NSW Cup, but not in the NRL.

If a team had a talented under 20s player that they were hoping to use in first grade at some point, they still could, but he'd need to play the entire season in NSW Cup.

This would raise the quality of the NSW Cup because the very best under 20s players would be playing there instead of the Toyota Cup. It would also raise the profile of the NSW Cup to that of a proper reserve grade, while the Toyota Cup would revert to being a true developmental league - as it should be.
 

tigesup

New member
Joined
Jul 12, 2009
Messages
336
Location
South West NSW
@Geo. said:
Darren Nichols, Chris Corby, David Fifita, Blake Lazarus, Rhys Curren, Willie Mataka, Jason Schirnack, Sioeli Makaui, Michael Stolk and Lance Siataga have all found positions with either Wests or BRET in State Cup after out growing the 20's

That's not including Fifita and Dwyer currently in FG…or Lui who is still eligable to play 20's this year...

Not a bad retention rate....Not too many get away...

Cap concessions also come into it...

We have one of the best junior development of any Club IMO...

Credit to McDonnell and Sheens for sure...

I'll just point out Geo that Lance Siataga is still available next season for 20's.

I think you'll find they don't lose many that they want to keep, but as the 20's keep moving to the next stage it's going to be very difficult to continue to keep the numbers they want.
 

Geo

Moderator
Staff member
Forum Leader
Joined
Jul 10, 2009
Messages
47,745
Location
Campbelltown NSW..
@tigesup said:
I'll just point out Geo that Lance Siataga is still available next season for 20's.

I think you'll find they don't lose many that they want to keep, but as the 20's keep moving to the next stage it's going to be very difficult to continue to keep the numbers they want.

Yeah…my mistake ...come to think of it Wests have already benefited from an injection of youth from the 20's this year...Issac Lui, Shaun Spence I think even Ethan Tafili has had a run in State Cup...
 

tigergirlz

New member
Joined
Jul 11, 2009
Messages
2,812
Need to add a loyalty benefit for clubs supporting young players in the salary cap (like the Tigers do).
It must be tough to go out and scout, then nurture young kids for 4-5 years to have to let them go (or have them poached) as they turn 20.
 
Top