Madge Maguire - Mega Thread

[TrueTiger]

The only way that a team can win and be competative in the NRL is the players play according to their pay cheques and skill level,the coach set the structures and gameplans....AND everybody work together to achieve the best for team and club....

Storm are a great example.....

 

[avocadoontoast]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope. Is it blind hope to think Sheens can do better? In his 3rd season with us he won a premiership, whilst in Madge's 3rd season he's trying to avoid the spoon.

As for the players, I think a lot of them are an embarrassment, but when you sign a coaching contract you have to get the best out of the players you've got. He's also signed a number of players so it's not entirely Cleary's dud roster anymore (which Madge still got to 9th). A really good coach can adapt his style to suit the playing group he's got. I haven't seen any evidence of him adapting whatsoever.

So what is your strategy for success, is it to roll over the roster until he finally gets a team that can play for him? And is that practical? You asked me earlier why we got rid of Sheens. Why did Souths get rid of Madge?

 

[Papacito]

A lot of people forget that Sheens not only steered us to a title in 2005 but rebuilt us into a gun, top four side in 2010/2011.

He was sacked when we finished 10th.

We're now 14th and counting our lucky stars that the dogs are saving us from the wooden spoon.

 

[TheDaBoss]

Who is older wayne or sheens

 

[tigerap]

A lot of people forget that Sheens not only steered us to a title in 2005 but rebuilt us into a gun, top four side in 2010/2011.

He was sacked when we finished 10th.

We're now 14th and counting our lucky stars that the dogs are saving us from the wooden spoon.

We will win 6 out of the next 8 and all will be sweet again!

 

[DJG]

A lot of people forget that Sheens not only steered us to a title in 2005 but rebuilt us into a gun, top four side in 2010/2011.

He was sacked when we finished 10th.

We're now 14th and counting our lucky stars that the dogs are saving us from the wooden spoon.

We will win 6 out of the next 8 and all will be sweet again!

Someone has been on the predictor.. just like me this morning haha!

I had us for everything except for Panthers... am I crazy?

 

[Furious1]

A lot of people forget that Sheens not only steered us to a title in 2005 but rebuilt us into a gun, top four side in 2010/2011.

He was sacked when we finished 10th.

We're now 14th and counting our lucky stars that the dogs are saving us from the wooden spoon.

We will win 6 out of the next 8 and all will be sweet again!

Someone has been on the predictor.. just like me this morning haha!

I had us for everything except for Panthers... **am I crazy?**

yes

 

[GCfan]

A lot of people forget that Sheens not only steered us to a title in 2005 but rebuilt us into a gun, top four side in 2010/2011.

He was sacked when we finished 10th.

We're now 14th and counting our lucky stars that the dogs are saving us from the wooden spoon.

We will win 6 out of the next 8 and all will be sweet again!

Someone has been on the predictor.. just like me this morning haha!

I had us for everything except for Panthers... am I crazy?

Perhaps, but love the positivity, a rare quality for a Tigers supporter. Well done!

 

[851]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

**Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.**

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.

That was my fear when we signed Madge, yes he won the comp at Souths in 2014, but things turned sour pretty quickly afterwards, finishing 7th in 2015, 12th in 2016 and 12th in 2017.
Talk of player unrest surfaced early in 2016, the noise was deafening by 2017, and he was sacked, history is repeating it self, only we didn't get any success out of his stay.

 

[supercoach]

Bottom line is, with our current roster any coach will be on struggle street. What we need to know are potential signings staying clear because of Madge’s reputation and is there issues between the current roster and Madge.

I am not for changing the coach without having someone better lined up, but if we can’t attract players from the higher end of the market, or the players have real issues with the coach, than we may have no choice.

AlthoughI hate the practice of players turning on coaches. Personally, I would open the door for any player who is not happy and keep Madge to at least the end of next year

 

[Lauren]

Who do people think are responsible for setting and driving the the standards at the club? Or building the club's culture, including performance?
As I'm confused by comments which disregard that any damage caused (including the club/team image) is coming from within, and the buck stops with our management.
When expectations aren't being met everyone (management, coaching staff and players) who has a hand in it should be held in the same regard/light with any judgements.

I can respect that we all offer broader insights as supporters, but no offence it feels a lot like walking on eggshells when discussing the topic of accountability, particularly when allocating any blame to appropriate persons/departments is usually met with defiance.
There's really no need for it as most of us are expressing the same desire, to have a club which drives high standards and promotes excellence.
This year only shows we're nowhere near at this stage.

This latest media crusade reveals a lot more than a toxic environment, it also IMO highlights how the club are still falling short in how it manages conflict and expectations but most importantly that it's not addressing the core issues which is preventing us form moving forward.
One positive about it is I suppose it sends the message that we're fed up with underperforming.
My one complaint about the article is it fails to address or mention anything about our poor team leadership. It's been a prevalent issue at the club and explains a lot of performance problems, especially our incapacity to push though certain mentals blocks/hurdles.

 

[Tiger5150]

Madge going nowhere.

The club is in the verge of sustained success.

Reworked roster based on youth.
Salary cap relief
Pathways investment
Tom Sheens
Reserve team performing well.

There not gonna dump a tough coach for a nobody or rookie now.

I'm intrigued why you believe a 'tough coach' gets results? Clearly it is not working.

Phil Gould said on ch9 this morning, one thing that is common in the bottom teams is a lack of mental toughness from the players when the pressure is on during a game, so they panic and their game falls apart.
Imo Madge would be trying to instill that in our players, but their either dumb or their rebelling because they have to work to hard.

With respect Magpies, Maguire has had nearly three years to do this and has failed miserably. There is a lot of blameshifting from the Maguire apologists towards the players. Apportion some blame to them but most should be attributed to Maguire. He has failed and should be sacked.

Despite the fact that overwhelming evidence that it is indeed the players?

 

[Tiger5150]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope.

I agree that sticking to the status quo would be blind hope and madness. On a downward trajectory, I would expect the club to do something about it. I would expect them to build a multi million dollar state of the art Centre of Excellence, I would expect them to shore up some of the best juniors, I would expect them to sign three ofthe best and most respected men in the code to be responsible for our Junior pathways and recruitment.

Now if the club DID make concrete changes like that to set up an actual structure and system for long term success and in a club with a reputation for constantly kicking out coaches on a whim, what would you think sacking another coach would do to the long term plan? IMO cutting your nose of to spite your face.

 

[avocadoontoast]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope.

I agree that sticking to the status quo would be blind hope and madness. On a downward trajectory, I would expect the club to do something about it. I would expect them to build a multi million dollar state of the art Centre of Excellence, I would expect them to shore up some of the best juniors, I would expect them to sign three ofthe best and most respected men in the code to be responsible for our Junior pathways and recruitment.

Now if the club DID make concrete changes like that to set up an actual structure and system for long term success and in a club with a reputation for constantly kicking out coaches on a whim, what would you think sacking another coach would do to the long term plan? IMO cutting your nose of to spite your face.

If the coach was sacked would the COE and junior pathways vanish into thin air?

 

[Tiger5150]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope.

I agree that sticking to the status quo would be blind hope and madness. On a downward trajectory, I would expect the club to do something about it. I would expect them to build a multi million dollar state of the art Centre of Excellence, I would expect them to shore up some of the best juniors, I would expect them to sign three ofthe best and most respected men in the code to be responsible for our Junior pathways and recruitment.

Now if the club DID make concrete changes like that to set up an actual structure and system for long term success and in a club with a reputation for constantly kicking out coaches on a whim, what would you think sacking another coach would do to the long term plan? IMO cutting your nose of to spite your face.

If the coach was sacked would the COE and junior pathways vanish into thin air?

Attracting new players would. Its hard now. If we sack Madge and take on our 6th coach in 9 years, we have signalled to the NRL world that we are a perpetual joke.

 

[tony soprano]

Who is older wayne or sheens

What is this an old off?

 

[avocadoontoast]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope.

I agree that sticking to the status quo would be blind hope and madness. On a downward trajectory, I would expect the club to do something about it. I would expect them to build a multi million dollar state of the art Centre of Excellence, I would expect them to shore up some of the best juniors, I would expect them to sign three ofthe best and most respected men in the code to be responsible for our Junior pathways and recruitment.

Now if the club DID make concrete changes like that to set up an actual structure and system for long term success and in a club with a reputation for constantly kicking out coaches on a whim, what would you think sacking another coach would do to the long term plan? IMO cutting your nose of to spite your face.

If the coach was sacked would the COE and junior pathways vanish into thin air?


Attracting new players would. Its hard now. If we sack Madge and take on our 6th coach in 9 years, we have signalled to the NRL world that we are a perpetual joke.

I'm not sure our ability to attract players could get much worse to be honest.

 

[mike]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope. Is it blind hope to think Sheens can do better? In his 3rd season with us he won a premiership, whilst in Madge's 3rd season he's trying to avoid the spoon.

As for the players, I think a lot of them are an embarrassment, but when you sign a coaching contract you have to get the best out of the players you've got. He's also signed a number of players so it's not entirely Cleary's dud roster anymore (which Madge still got to 9th). A really good coach can adapt his style to suit the playing group he's got. I haven't seen any evidence of him adapting whatsoever.

So what is your strategy for success, is it to roll over the roster until he finally gets a team that can play for him? And is that practical? You asked me earlier why we got rid of Sheens. Why did Souths get rid of Madge?

Roll over the roster until you get a team that can play for Wests Tigers and not just bludge to get their pay packet. Madge should say a few more things like his we need men comment, this would further help identify those players with a bad attitude.

 

[TheDaBoss]

Who is older wayne or sheens

What is this an old off?

Just intrigued lol... but if we want it to make it a competition then yes its a old off lol

3 rounds, 1st is age 2nd is coaching record and then 3rd they fight it out in ring

 

[avocadoontoast]

I'm a huge Madge fan, but from what I can see he's a dead man walking.

Let's not forget that he was dumped by Souths for allegedly losing the support of the playing group.

It's looking like that's exactly what's happening here.

With Tim Sheens coming on board, it's just a matter of time.

To be fair, I think that's a good move too. He's a club legend and will have mega respect and influence from the board down.


God help us if Sheens has much influence in coaching.He was sacked here and had a low percentage win rate in ESL.As long as he stays where he is supposed to be in pathways he should be ok

**the two seasons prior to being sacked we finished top 4.** In UK his win record has been 58%.

So why was he sacked?
I honestly can’t remember, too long ago, I remember it wasn’t pleasant and most were pleased. I thought it was results driven?
I do think he’s been away from the NRL scene too long to offer much in the way of game day tactics, but he will still know what a good player looks like?

We were favs to win in 2012 (the year he was sacked) and when we didn't make the 8 he was ditched. He'd been here for 10 years and our expectations that year were to win it.

He's coached over 650 NRL games and has still been involved in the game since he left here. In many ways the way the game is currently played is a perfect match for his style of coaching. I think he'd be the sort of coach that could get us on the right track pretty quickly.

Are you now saying you want him as coach?

As i've previously mentioned, my preference would be to have someone like Gardiner/Ciraldo/Morris take over the head coaching role with Sheens sitting above as Coaching Director.

But surely you will agree that a coaching director will be the coach, while the poor coach will basically be the assistant but cop the blame when the directors plans go awry?

Not necessarily, depends on how it's structured. But if Sheens was made head coach i'd have no major issues with that either, provided a succession plan was in place.

We're at a place now where we make a change or just blindly hope that Madge can improve the team.

So blindly hoping Tim can is better?
You don’t think the players are letting the team down, at all?

When you're on a downward trajectory like us, sticking with the status quo and hoping for it to turn around is blind hope. Is it blind hope to think Sheens can do better? In his 3rd season with us he won a premiership, whilst in Madge's 3rd season he's trying to avoid the spoon.

As for the players, I think a lot of them are an embarrassment, but when you sign a coaching contract you have to get the best out of the players you've got. He's also signed a number of players so it's not entirely Cleary's dud roster anymore (which Madge still got to 9th). A really good coach can adapt his style to suit the playing group he's got. I haven't seen any evidence of him adapting whatsoever.

So what is your strategy for success, is it to roll over the roster until he finally gets a team that can play for him? And is that practical? You asked me earlier why we got rid of Sheens. Why did Souths get rid of Madge?

Roll over the roster until you get a team that can play for Wests Tigers and not just bludge to get their pay packet. Madge should say a few more things like his we need men comment, this would further help identify those players with a bad attitude.

Hypothetically, in your opinion, how many of the 30 would you need to be rolled over for him to finally get the team he needs to be competitive?