Moltzen Staying Or Going

@GNR4LIFE said:
@2041 said:
@GNR4LIFE said:
Doesn't matter who is right or wrong, if Moltzen realy does have intentions of sitting out the yr should he not get his own way, then i don't care how you try and justify it, it is the actions of a spoilt brat and he should be embarressed and ashamed to even contemplate such a childish action

Incidentally, I've just realised how ironic it is for a lecture on player standards of behaviour to appear in print right next to a picture of Michael Vick.

I've never condoned what Vick did, what he did was dispicable, however since being released from prison has done a full 360 and has raised money for lots of charity's. He served his time and ever since has gone to gone to great lengths to turn his life around. Why doesn't he deserve props for that?

He's still got a hell of a long way to go to make up for what he did in my books. It wasn't a one-off lapse of judgement, there has to be some lack of moral compass for someone to think it's okay to be involved in that sort of sick behaviour. Anyway we're off topic again so say something about Tim Moltzen before someone calls us on it!
 
@GNR4LIFE said:
@2041 said:
@GNR4LIFE said:
Doesn't matter who is right or wrong, if Moltzen realy does have intentions of sitting out the yr should he not get his own way, then i don't care how you try and justify it, it is the actions of a spoilt brat and he should be embarressed and ashamed to even contemplate such a childish action

And if I'm a murderer I should be in prison; fortunately for all concerned, I'm not. Personally speaking, I'm not even going to consider whether I agree or disagree with your view until I have some evidence that Moltzen is actually contemplating a strike. So far all I've seen is an article in the Sunday Telegraph with a grand total of no supporting quotes. Actually there is one key point in the article which some people here would do well to bear in mind: "Moltzen did not answer calls from The Sunday Telegraph yesterday."

If people would stop jumping to attention every time the Telegraph spins some bollocks it would be the first step to getting those bottom feeders out of the game for good.

geez perhaps if you read where i said the word 'if' you would realize i wasn't 'jumping to attention'. I was saying IF it is true then it is poor form

Yeah I read it. What I'm saying is that the chances of the Telegraph article being a total load of crap are so high there's no point in even considering - let along sharing - what you'd think if it turned out to be true.
 
@Yossarian said:
@GNR4LIFE said:
@2041 said:
@GNR4LIFE said:
Doesn't matter who is right or wrong, if Moltzen realy does have intentions of sitting out the yr should he not get his own way, then i don't care how you try and justify it, it is the actions of a spoilt brat and he should be embarressed and ashamed to even contemplate such a childish action

Incidentally, I've just realised how ironic it is for a lecture on player standards of behaviour to appear in print right next to a picture of Michael Vick.

I've never condoned what Vick did, what he did was dispicable, however since being released from prison has done a full 360 and has raised money for lots of charity's. He served his time and ever since has gone to gone to great lengths to turn his life around. Why doesn't he deserve props for that?

He's still got a hell of a long way to go to make up for what he did in my books. It wasn't a one-off lapse of judgement, there has to be some lack of moral compass for someone to think it's okay to be involved in that sort of sick behaviour. Anyway we're off topic again so say something about Tim Moltzen before someone calls us on it!

Fair enough we all have our opinion on him but Michael Vick is irrelavent in this conversation so the quicker we put that subject to bed the better.
Back to Moltzen, a contract was signed, its not like he's just being told to go for the sake of it. At some point he obviously had an intention of going, hence the signing of the contract. So if push comes to shove and he has to go, he should be a man and honour that agreement
 
The funny thing is 2041, when it comes to the tele, people will just believe what they want to. Some people won't believe a word thats written about Moltzen, yet those same people will believe from the get-go that Adam Blair will be making 500K a yr, and take that as gospel. And where do you think the 500K rumors originated?
 
@2041 said:
@prattenpark said:
If he wasn't chasing money he would never have signed with the dragons in the first place. He could have simply played out the last year of his contract with the Tigers.

Sounds like a right spoilt brat and this shows in his play - hogs the ball, bad positional play etc.
I'd be happy for him to sit the season out, but not quite as happy as watching him blow it big time in the number one at the red V.

On ya bike, Timmy

It's not often I read something on here that makes me genuinely angry but this is one occasion. I actually can't understand how anyone with a reasonable degree of intelligence can believe this sort of rubbish, let alone spout it.

"If he wasn't chasing money he would never have signed with the dragons in the first place."

Rubbish. So far as anyone's aware he was told there either wasn't room for him next year or that there might not be. The guy's got to make a living - do you seriously expect him to refuse to look elsewhere under those circumstances?

"He could have simply played out the last year of his contract with the Tigers."

Are you really that naive? He's been told he might not get a game. Just think about what that means for the kid's future for a few seconds. Can you really not understand how he could change his mind from "I'd like to stay at the Tigers but they don't want me, so I'll go and get the best deal I can somewhere else" to "It looks like the Tigers now want me, I've always wanted to play here so I hope I can stay". It's not ideal, but it's also hardly Moltzen's fault. Yet you want him to have a totally black and white (in both ways) mindset: he's a Tiger, then he's a Dragon. Never mind how he's been messed about by the Tigers - frankly I think the club's lucky he still wants to play for them after how he's been treated.

"Sounds like a right spoilt brat and this shows in his play - hogs the ball, bad positional play etc"

Seriously, this is just ridiculous. You think the guy's some kind of playground ball hog? If you really believe he doesn't pass because he's selfish then I strongly suggest that you don't know anything about professional sport, full stop. He, like virtually every other professional sportsman, is striving to be the best he can be. If his passing and positional sense are not the best in the comp that is, I can absolutely assure you, not because he's "a spoilt [sic] brat". Anyway, why would selfishness = bad positional play? You might as well say the reason Benji isn't brilliant defensively is that he's too interested in carvery dinners. Galloway would be quicker if he stopped watching the NFL. Lawrence would be less injury prone if he liked different kinds of t-shirts.

The bottom line is this: you are saying you want your club to lose a good player because of some character traits you have identified from (a) media/fan speculation and (b) some unrelated on-pitch performance matters. If you said you wanted rid of Moltzen because you don't think he's any good then that would be one thing (though I'd still say your player judgement skills would be severely lacking) but to make out like it's some big character issue is just nonsense of the highest degree. Frankly I think the club would be better off without fans like you trying to drive out players based on innuendo, supposition and borderline insane leaps of logic.

Could not disagree more. He is a VERY ordinary footballer and the amount of space taken up on this forum to discuss him is mind blowing.

Go to Saints Tim, please.

I have seen nothing in his play to suggest he will progress any further.

For someone to mention him in the same breath as Tallis is laughable.
 
@magpiecol said:
@2041 said:
@prattenpark said:
If he wasn't chasing money he would never have signed with the dragons in the first place. He could have simply played out the last year of his contract with the Tigers.

Sounds like a right spoilt brat and this shows in his play - hogs the ball, bad positional play etc.
I'd be happy for him to sit the season out, but not quite as happy as watching him blow it big time in the number one at the red V.

On ya bike, Timmy

It's not often I read something on here that makes me genuinely angry but this is one occasion. I actually can't understand how anyone with a reasonable degree of intelligence can believe this sort of rubbish, let alone spout it.

"If he wasn't chasing money he would never have signed with the dragons in the first place."

Rubbish. So far as anyone's aware he was told there either wasn't room for him next year or that there might not be. The guy's got to make a living - do you seriously expect him to refuse to look elsewhere under those circumstances?

"He could have simply played out the last year of his contract with the Tigers."

Are you really that naive? He's been told he might not get a game. Just think about what that means for the kid's future for a few seconds. Can you really not understand how he could change his mind from "I'd like to stay at the Tigers but they don't want me, so I'll go and get the best deal I can somewhere else" to "It looks like the Tigers now want me, I've always wanted to play here so I hope I can stay". It's not ideal, but it's also hardly Moltzen's fault. Yet you want him to have a totally black and white (in both ways) mindset: he's a Tiger, then he's a Dragon. Never mind how he's been messed about by the Tigers - frankly I think the club's lucky he still wants to play for them after how he's been treated.

"Sounds like a right spoilt brat and this shows in his play - hogs the ball, bad positional play etc"

Seriously, this is just ridiculous. You think the guy's some kind of playground ball hog? If you really believe he doesn't pass because he's selfish then I strongly suggest that you don't know anything about professional sport, full stop. He, like virtually every other professional sportsman, is striving to be the best he can be. If his passing and positional sense are not the best in the comp that is, I can absolutely assure you, not because he's "a spoilt [sic] brat". Anyway, why would selfishness = bad positional play? You might as well say the reason Benji isn't brilliant defensively is that he's too interested in carvery dinners. Galloway would be quicker if he stopped watching the NFL. Lawrence would be less injury prone if he liked different kinds of t-shirts.

The bottom line is this: you are saying you want your club to lose a good player because of some character traits you have identified from (a) media/fan speculation and (b) some unrelated on-pitch performance matters. If you said you wanted rid of Moltzen because you don't think he's any good then that would be one thing (though I'd still say your player judgement skills would be severely lacking) but to make out like it's some big character issue is just nonsense of the highest degree. Frankly I think the club would be better off without fans like you trying to drive out players based on innuendo, supposition and borderline insane leaps of logic.

Could not disagree more. He is a VERY ordinary footballer and the amount of space taken up on this forum to discuss him is mind blowing.

Go to Saints Tim, please.

I have seen nothing in his play to suggest he will progress any further.

For someone to mention him in the same breath as Tallis is laughable.

You've totally missed the point, I'm afraid. What you're saying is fine: you don't rate Moltzen and you're happy to lose him. Fair enough. I think you're wrong, personally, but there's no reason why my judgement of a player should be any better than yours and I respect your right to a different opinion.

(FWIW, I'd also add that even if you don't think Moltzen's very good I'd like to know who you think is going to be a better full-back _for the Tigers in 2012_. He doesn't have to be Billy Slater to be the best option available to us. But whatever, you probably think Tedesco or Reddy or whatever is a better choice. As I say, each to their own).

What I'm objecting to is people making judgements about Moltzen's character based on this fiasco (and then making judgements on his playing ability based on those judgements about his character).
 
I doubt this whole "sit out a year in protest" is real. In talking to a team mate he might have said something to this effect, but we don't know the context or if he even said it at all.

How often do we all say something to a workmate without really meaning it, or having any intention on following it through?

"I swear if the boss asks me to work late one more day I will kick him in the nuts" etc.

Normally its better to ignore rumours rather then let to respond and fuel them, but in this instance I think Tim would be doing himself a favour to sit down and workout a short statement with his manager, just something to put out the spot fires about the whole thing.

Reputations do matter in this sport, and right now Timmys rep is taking a battering.
 
People may like the fact Moltzen might stay, they also like the fact Dragons miss out and Doust is crying over it.

But nobody here likes our reputation being harmed. Nobody.
 
@LaT said:
People may like the fact Moltzen might stay, they also like the fact Dragons miss out and Doust is crying over it.

But nobody here likes our reputation being harmed. Nobody.

Agreed.

The length of the thread is due to it being off season and there being nothing else going on. I struggle to imagine there's a single person who's posted in it who wouldn't rather have had the whole thing wrapped up weeks ago, or - even better - not happen at all.
 
@LaT said:
People may like the fact Moltzen might stay, they also like the fact Dragons miss out and Doust is crying over it.

But nobody here likes our reputation being harmed. Nobody.

my bad.. i read your comment wrong.
 
Apparently Schubert met officials from both clubs last week. Hopefully a decision will be made this week. It was also mentioned in today's Sunday Telegraph that if the Tigers fail in their bid to keep Moltzen, then they may look at Wade Graham as he is apparently quite worried about retaining his spot at the Sharks now that Carney is on board.
 
@willow said:
Apparently Schubert met officials from both clubs last week. Hopefully a decision will be made this week. It was also mentioned in today's Sunday Telegraph that if the Tigers fail in their bid to keep Moltzen, then they may look at Wade Graham as he is apparently quite worried about retaining his spot at the Sharks now that Carney is on board.

Wade Graham Now that is desperation

I reckon there are better footballers on this forum than Wade Graham 😱pen_mouth:
 
@GNR4LIFE said:
I've never condoned what Vick did, what he did was dispicable, however since being released from prison **has done a full 360** and has raised money for lots of charity's.

:laughing:

So he's… back to where he started?
 
@happy tiger said:
@willow said:
Apparently Schubert met officials from both clubs last week. Hopefully a decision will be made this week. It was also mentioned in today's Sunday Telegraph that if the Tigers fail in their bid to keep Moltzen, then they may look at Wade Graham as he is apparently quite worried about retaining his spot at the Sharks now that Carney is on board.

Wade Graham Now that is desperation

I reckon there are better footballers on this forum than Wade Graham 😱pen_mouth:

We went hard out to sign Graham when he became unhappy at Penrith, but Penrith refused to release him.
I'd rather have Graham in the 7 jumper than Lui.
 
@steven_tiger said:
@GNR4LIFE said:
I've never condoned what Vick did, what he did was dispicable, however since being released from prison **has done a full 360** and has raised money for lots of charity's.

:laughing:

So he's… back to where he started?

one could make a case he has, if your saying he 'started' before his indescretion :wink:
maybe a 180 might be more appropriate :slight_smile:
back on topic, Wade Graham i don't think would be too bad of a pick up. Don't think it will come to that though, coz I think Moltzen is odds on to be staying a Tiger. If a miracle happens and he heads to the Dragons, get the popcorn ready, coz Dragons fans are spitting chips at the prospect of him going there, and after making the stance he has, he'll be in a very uncomftable situation. Thats if he doesn't sulk and sit out the season
 
Is Wade Graham a better choice then Miller though? Maybe at this point Graham has the experience advantage but picking up Graham would be a weird choice for us.

Sharks fans want him in the forwards, even before Carney signed he was never really a 1st choice in the halves for Sharks.
 
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