Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[Yossarian]

Its almost got to the stage where you'd feel sorry for whoever wins.

I agree with Watto, lets do it again with a record roll out and get a difinitive winner

Imagine the amount of time and effort Gillard and Abbott and their respective parties would spend in some of these very close seats (According to last Saturdays election) if we went to another election. Tony Abbott would spend plenty of time around those marginals in Victoria and Julia Gillard would take up residence in QLD. The Liberals would go to all ends to get Wilson Tuckeys seat back and Labor would go hard at that Hobart seat that went to the independant. It would be interesting times.

They'd both struggle. Dennison and O'Connor (I think that's Tuckey's seat) voters probably enjoy the perceived benefits of having non-aligned MPs. It would come down to whether voters were giving Labor a kick and are over it or whether they want Abbott as PM.

 

[Yossarian]

The independants are effectivly stalling to see who actually:

1\. has the most seats; and
2\. if they finish equal - who has the most votes.

Patience is required. All will become known soon.

Doesn't necessarily have anything to do with it. The independents are more interested in what both parties can offer them. In any event they are likely to be 72-all, the Coalition are going to win the primary vote and Labor the 2PP.

 

[citizen_cub]

This whole campaign's turned into a farce. I could only just handle listening to Gillard's crap for 5 weeks, listening to her suck up to the independents for the past 10 days has made me even sicker. As I said before, the independents are incompetents who SHOULD NOT be allowed to determine the result of an election. BTW, 2 days worth of Labor's borrowed money could fund an election anyway, not that expensive..

 

[Citizen_Tiger]

Interesting watching the Westminster system of Gov't in action at times, particularly when it trips itself up. Many more have been converted to the school of thought that the preferential system is flawed, the worst case scenario having realised iteself. If there is an outcome, it won't prove to be anything other than untenable. I don't believe either Gov't could be effective where the balance of power is held by those with regional self interest. Time will become an issue and neither party will tolerate endless meetings and negotiations over successive legislative proposals. The thing that's often forgotten here is that Independents are inevitably elected on the strength of their local focus, not Green House Emissions, Indigenous Issues or the BER.

It can only end in another election and the ANU polls are already suggesting a Coalition win by 6-10.

 

[Yossarian]

Interesting watching the Westminster system of Gov't in action at times, particularly when it trips itself up. Many more have been converted to the school of thought that the preferential system is flawed, the worst case scenario having realised iteself. If there is an outcome, it won't prove to be anything other than untenable. I don't believe either Gov't could be effective where the balance of power is held by those with regional self interest. Time will become an issue and neither party will tolerate endless meetings and negotiations over successive legislative proposals. The thing that's often forgotten here is that Independents are inevitably elected on the strength of their local focus, not Green House Emissions, Indigenous Issues or the BER.

It can only end in another election and the ANU polls are already suggesting a Coalition win by 6-10.

Westminster government is not the same as preferential voting. Britain doesn't have preferential voting…

Do you have a link to this ANU poll? I can't find any details on it.

 

[Kul]

Wilkie just backed Labor

74 to 73 Labor

 

[matty_tiepie]

He is a moron. his whole campaign was based on the Alp dont deserve to be in government. basically the bloody alp have bribed him.

 

[Yossarian]

He is a moron. his whole campaign was based on the Alp dont deserve to be in government. basically the bloody alp have bribed him.

:laughing: :laughing: :laughing:

So you'd have the same objection if Katter backs the Coalition? The man stood as a Green in an election and was chased out of his job by a government containing current Coalition MPs. Who do you think he was going to back? Seriously?

 

[Yossarian]

Wilkie just backed Labor

74 to 73 Labor

Really its 74 to 72… Crook has said on numerous occasions he doesn't want to be counted as a Coalition number.

 

[Tiger_Watto]

This is a joke. Australia didnt vote for these Independants to decide who runs this country…

Get rid of Gillard and her head-hunting cronies, and make sure she takes her Fair Work Bill with her...

Cant these Independants see this country has gone stagnant since Rudd took power???

 

[Yossarian]

This is a joke. Australia didnt vote for these Independants to decide who runs this country…

Get rid of Gillard and her head-hunting cronies, and make sure she takes her Fair Work Bill with her...

Cant these Independants see this country has gone stagnant since Rudd took power???

This is hilarious! So they are free to make a choice so long as they support the Coalition?

Stagnant? 3.3% growth not enough for you?

 

[Student_of_the_game]

It's gonna be interesting to see how a stable government can be maintained if Katter, Oakeshott and Windsor go to labour.

Lets see…

We'll have the Labor who are moderately left wing. Then we'll have the Greens who are even further left wing. Then we'll have Wilkie who is supposedly centre, but has made some strange comments re war. Then we'll have the disgruntled ex Nationals who are conservative by nature.

That'd almost be a record regarding the political orientation of the members in that government.

 

[Tiger_Watto]

Im a business owner, so of course they can vote for the Coalition :wink:

Take out Mining and every other sector is going backwards?

Personally Yossarian, I just hate the Fair Work Bill!!!

 

[Student_of_the_game]

This is a joke. Australia didnt vote for these Independants to decide who runs this country…

Get rid of Gillard and her head-hunting cronies, and make sure she takes her Fair Work Bill with her...

Cant these Independants see this country has gone stagnant since Rudd took power???

This is hilarious! So they are free to make a choice so long as they support the Coalition?

Stagnant? 3.3% growth not enough for you?

I don't know why you presume that TigerWatto meant stagnant in terms of the economy… He may well have meant climate change, fuel/grocery watch, what about the human rights bill Rudd promised???

 

[Yossarian]

This is a joke. Australia didnt vote for these Independants to decide who runs this country…

Get rid of Gillard and her head-hunting cronies, and make sure she takes her Fair Work Bill with her...

Cant these Independants see this country has gone stagnant since Rudd took power???

This is hilarious! So they are free to make a choice so long as they support the Coalition?

Stagnant? 3.3% growth not enough for you?

I don't know why you presume that TigerWatto meant stagnant in terms of the economy… He may well have meant climate change, fuel/grocery watch, what about the human rights bill Rudd promised???

When did Rudd promise a human rights bill? All of the other things you mention were voted down in the senate by the Liberal and National parties.

 

[system]

Wilkie was never going to align with the coalition unless they gave him every single one of his list items and a sweetener on top.

Abbott was instrumental in the attempted discreditation of Wilkie after his revelations on the reasonings and stretched truths of our commitment to war in Iraq

 

[Yossarian]

Im a business owner, so of course they can vote for the Coalition :wink:

Take out Mining and every other sector is going backwards?

Personally Yossarian, I just hate the Fair Work Bill!!!

LOL! Fair enough!

Of course mining is a big factor but to quote reuters:

"Growth in the second quarter was driven by household consumption, which added 0.9 percentage points to GDP in a major surprise given lacklustre retail sales. Consumer spending on vehicles alone jumped a hefty 11.2%"

In any case 3.3% is about the limit of what you want anyway.

I'm guessing the Fair Work Bill/Workchoices is where we disagree on Watto!

 

[Yossarian]

It's gonna be interesting to see how a stable government can be maintained if Katter, Oakeshott and Windsor go to labour.

Lets see…

We'll have the Labor who are moderately left wing. Then we'll have the Greens who are even further left wing. Then we'll have Wilkie who is supposedly centre, but has made some strange comments re war. Then we'll have the disgruntled ex Nationals who are conservative by nature.

That'd almost be a record regarding the political orientation of the members in that government.

The last Coalition government has Petro Georgio and Wilson Tuckey in it…

In any case Bandt and Wilkie won't be members of the government, they are promising to support the ALP in no-confidence motions and pass supply bills. They won't be caucusing with Labor.

 

[Citizen_Tiger]

Interesting watching the Westminster system of Gov't in action at times, particularly when it trips itself up. Many more have been converted to the school of thought that the preferential system is flawed, the worst case scenario having realised iteself. If there is an outcome, it won't prove to be anything other than untenable. I don't believe either Gov't could be effective where the balance of power is held by those with regional self interest. Time will become an issue and neither party will tolerate endless meetings and negotiations over successive legislative proposals. The thing that's often forgotten here is that Independents are inevitably elected on the strength of their local focus, not Green House Emissions, Indigenous Issues or the BER.

It can only end in another election and the ANU polls are already suggesting a Coalition win by 6-10.

Westminster government is not the same as preferential voting. Britain doesn't have preferential voting…

Do you have a link to this ANU poll? I can't find any details on it.

Yoss, 'Westminster' in this case refers to the style of Government, not the big building by the Thames.

I quote 'The system is a series of procedures for operating a legislature. It is used, or was once used, in the national legislatures and sub national legislatures of most Commonwealth and ex-Commonwealth nations upon being granted responsible government, beginning with the first of the Canadian provinces in 1848 and the six Australian colonies between 1855 and 1890'

Preferential voting can be utilised in any system of democracy, but it is a key feature of the Australian political landscape and therefore a feature of our style of the Westminster System.

The poll dropped into my in box and I have deleted it, but was a newsletter from ANU. Will try and track it down.

 

[senexx]

So often, the government with little or cursory debate rams through legislation, knowing it has the numbers. Government and Opposition backbenchers, and independents, are treated with disdain.

Support the Independents, Democracy should always have a balance of power.