Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[citizen_cub]

If Liberal had a better leader at this election, they would have won quite comfortably. With the turmoil Labor were in just 2 months ago, any good leader would have put Labor to the sword, and captilised on issues like the Mining Tax, Carbon Tax, School Halls programme, Border Protection policy etc. So much ammunition and so little bullets fired, he didn't push his case, he didn't convince the public he was the man for the job and hence why we are in the situation we are today. Liberal should really take a better look at the candidates on offer, surely there must be someone better than Abbott

 

[hammertime]

If Liberal had a better leader at this election, they would have won quite comfortably. With the turmoil Labor were in just 2 months ago, any good leader would have put Labor to the sword, and captilised on issues like the Mining Tax, Carbon Tax, School Halls programme, Border Protection policy etc. So much ammunition and so little bullets fired, he didn't push his case, he didn't convince the public he was the man for the job and hence why we are in the situation we are today. Liberal should really take a better look at the candidates on offer, surely there must be someone better than Abbott

Completely agree Cub. Hockey is the man to lead the Liberal to the next election. He would have done a much better job than Abbott, he is far more real and likeable.

Abbott is a Rhodes Scholar so he has the smarts to do a good job, but he just doesn't come across well.

In other news, they have done a poll on the independents electorates to see who they would support..

http://www.news.com.au/features/federal-election/support-tony-abbott-voters-tell-independents/story-fn5tas5k-1225910138530" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

 

[Yossarian]

Anyway If any of this means I can get decent internet speeds on the peninsula I'll be happy.

Are you talking about Manly?

No Central Coast

 

[Yossarian]

If Liberal had a better leader at this election, they would have won quite comfortably. With the turmoil Labor were in just 2 months ago, any good leader would have put Labor to the sword, and captilised on issues like the Mining Tax, Carbon Tax, School Halls programme, Border Protection policy etc. So much ammunition and so little bullets fired, he didn't push his case, he didn't convince the public he was the man for the job and hence why we are in the situation we are today. Liberal should really take a better look at the candidates on offer, surely there must be someone better than Abbott

Completely agree Cub. Hockey is the man to lead the Liberal to the next election. He would have done a much better job than Abbott, he is far more real and likeable.

Abbott is a Rhodes Scholar so he has the smarts to do a good job, but he just doesn't come across well.

In other news, they have done a poll on the independents electorates to see who they would support..

http://www.news.com.au/features/federal-election/support-tony-abbott-voters-tell-independents/story-fn5tas5k-1225910138530" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Abbott's not doing himself any favours by refusing to give the costings. The longer he leaves it the worst it will get.

 

[MGB]

Agreed, Abbott's acting like he has something to hide there which I'm sure he doesn't, he is probably just concerned that showing his costings will allow Gillard and Swann to put a spin on things, either way he has to just do it and deal with them, this is what the independants need and it is unlikely they would consider giving Abbott power untill he does so.

Regardless of all other reasoning though the majority of the people in this country want the Libs back in Govt. as shown by the primary vote (two party preferred is a joke when you consider the green preferences) and the fact that it is likely they will win an extra seat.

 

[hammertime]

If Liberal had a better leader at this election, they would have won quite comfortably. With the turmoil Labor were in just 2 months ago, any good leader would have put Labor to the sword, and captilised on issues like the Mining Tax, Carbon Tax, School Halls programme, Border Protection policy etc. So much ammunition and so little bullets fired, he didn't push his case, he didn't convince the public he was the man for the job and hence why we are in the situation we are today. Liberal should really take a better look at the candidates on offer, surely there must be someone better than Abbott

Completely agree Cub. Hockey is the man to lead the Liberal to the next election. He would have done a much better job than Abbott, he is far more real and likeable.

Abbott is a Rhodes Scholar so he has the smarts to do a good job, but he just doesn't come across well.

In other news, they have done a poll on the independents electorates to see who they would support..

http://www.news.com.au/features/federal-election/support-tony-abbott-voters-tell-independents/story-fn5tas5k-1225910138530" onclick="window.open(this.href);return false;

Abbott's not doing himself any favours by refusing to give the costings. The longer he leaves it the worst it will get.

In the past, 3rd party costings have always found to fall short. Mainly because they don't have access to near the same data that the line agencies/finance do. They are possibly incorrect so I can understand Abbott's reluctance to expose them to scrutiny.

But there was apparently a leak of one policy during the campaign which made Abbott go outside. Otherwise, who would spend party funds when it can be done in house more accurately? Swan really has something to answer for there.

 

[Yossarian]

Abbott's not doing himself any favours by refusing to give the costings. The longer he leaves it the worst it will get.

In the past, 3rd party costings have always found to fall short. Mainly because they don't have access to near the same data that the line agencies/finance do. They are possibly incorrect so I can understand Abbott's reluctance to expose them to scrutiny.

But there was apparently a leak of one policy during the campaign which made Abbott go outside. Otherwise, who would spend party funds when it can be done in house more accurately? Swan really has something to answer for there.

Come now… The leak angle was always just to avoid treasury scrutiny. What could they leak anyway? All the costings would be made public so what was there to hide?

As someone pointed out the Libs were happy to rely on leakers like Grech when it suited them. Unless there is some proof that Swan himself was causing the leaks then its ridiculous to blame him. And besides Abbott wouldn't even allow a major firm to do the costing figures.

It was always an outrage that an opposition could get away with releasing costings on Wednesday evening before an election and get away with it. Now they have even less excuse.

 

[Yossarian]

Agreed, Abbott's acting like he has something to hide there which I'm sure he doesn't, he is probably just concerned that showing his costings will allow Gillard and Swann to put a spin on things, either way he has to just do it and deal with them, this is what the independants need and it is unlikely they would consider giving Abbott power untill he does so.

Regardless of all other reasoning though the majority of the people in this country want the Libs back in Govt. as shown by the primary vote (two party preferred is a joke when you consider the green preferences) and the fact that it is likely they will win an extra seat.

44% is a majority?

 

[magpie_mania]

agreed, abbott's acting like he has something to hide there which i'm sure he doesn't, he is probably just concerned that showing his costings will allow gillard and swann to put a spin on things, either way he has to just do it and deal with them, this is what the independants need and it is unlikely they would consider giving abbott power untill he does so.

Regardless of all other reasoning though the majority of the people in this country want the libs back in govt. As shown by the primary vote (two party preferred is a joke when you consider the green preferences) and the fact that it is likely they will win an extra seat.

44% is a majority?

yossarian are you julia gillard in disguise.

 

[Yossarian]

agreed, abbott's acting like he has something to hide there which i'm sure he doesn't, he is probably just concerned that showing his costings will allow gillard and swann to put a spin on things, either way he has to just do it and deal with them, this is what the independants need and it is unlikely they would consider giving abbott power untill he does so.

Regardless of all other reasoning though the majority of the people in this country want the libs back in govt. As shown by the primary vote (two party preferred is a joke when you consider the green preferences) and the fact that it is likely they will win an extra seat.

44% is a majority?

yossarian are you julia gillard in disguise.

So you think 44% is a majority too? Actually I preferred Kevin Rudd.

 

[MGB]

Fair enough you got me there. The Libs were the more popular choice.

 

[hammertime]

Abbott's not doing himself any favours by refusing to give the costings. The longer he leaves it the worst it will get.

In the past, 3rd party costings have always found to fall short. Mainly because they don't have access to near the same data that the line agencies/finance do. They are possibly incorrect so I can understand Abbott's reluctance to expose them to scrutiny.

But there was apparently a leak of one policy during the campaign which made Abbott go outside. Otherwise, who would spend party funds when it can be done in house more accurately? Swan really has something to answer for there.

Come now… The leak angle was always just to avoid treasury scrutiny. What could they leak anyway? All the costings would be made public so what was there to hide?

As someone pointed out the Libs were happy to rely on leakers like Grech when it suited them. Unless there is some proof that Swan himself was causing the leaks then its ridiculous to blame him. And besides Abbott wouldn't even allow a major firm to do the costing figures.

It was always an outrage that an opposition could get away with releasing costings on Wednesday evening before an election and get away with it. Now they have even less excuse.

You really think they would go to another firm and tell them to deliberately underestimate costings knowing that it will come back to bite them?

Yes, the costings were made public, but the proposal was in Labors hands before the Liberals announced it which means they were able to fire their salvo before Abbott even announced. Imagine if every good policy that Abbott thought of, was preempted by a identical Labor one. It really could have hurt the campaign and I understand the Liberal actions.

 

[hammertime]

Agreed, Abbott's acting like he has something to hide there which I'm sure he doesn't, he is probably just concerned that showing his costings will allow Gillard and Swann to put a spin on things, either way he has to just do it and deal with them, this is what the independants need and it is unlikely they would consider giving Abbott power untill he does so.

Regardless of all other reasoning though the majority of the people in this country want the Libs back in Govt. as shown by the primary vote (two party preferred is a joke when you consider the green preferences) and the fact that it is likely they will win an extra seat.

44% is a majority?

It's more than 38%..

 

[Yossarian]

Agreed, Abbott's acting like he has something to hide there which I'm sure he doesn't, he is probably just concerned that showing his costings will allow Gillard and Swann to put a spin on things, either way he has to just do it and deal with them, this is what the independants need and it is unlikely they would consider giving Abbott power untill he does so.

Regardless of all other reasoning though the majority of the people in this country want the Libs back in Govt. as shown by the primary vote (two party preferred is a joke when you consider the green preferences) and the fact that it is likely they will win an extra seat.

44% is a majority?

It's more than 38%..

It still means 56% voted for against them. It's not a FPTP system so primary votes are only part of the picture. In a preferential system 2PP is the more important stat. Doesn't matter if you get 43-44% of the primary vote if you lose the 2PP. Ask Darren Jameson…

 

[Gary_Bakerloo]

Two thoughts on Abbott's actions:

1\. Is he extremely confident he will get the ex-national independents to join with the Coalition or;

2\. A bit left field, but does he even want to form a government? He has assurred his place as Opposition leader till the next election after clawing back at Labor's majority, but does he want to have to negotiate with the Independents? Could be easier to sit on the sidelines for the next 1-3 years and hope cracks start to appear and widen. This would be in the hope he could secure a majority at the next election.

 

[stryker]

I choose number 2 Garry….

 

[Yossarian]

I'd go with one. 2 would be extremely risky. A lot can happen in 3 years. I think Abbott believes that the natural conservative leanings of Katter/Oakshote/Windsor will make them more likely to support the Coalition. He also is probably banking on ending up with more seats than the ALP which would make his sell a lot easier. Ideally he'd want 74 seats and ALP 71 but even then if Katter votes against the Libs it would be a 73-74 loss (assuming Wilkie and Brandt vote with the ALP and the speaker is a Lib).

Then you have to factor in the WA Nat!

 

[Gary_Bakerloo]

A lot can happen in 3 years.

I doubt that whoever forms government will go 3 years without calling an election. There will be a double dissolution within 3 years.

 

[Yossarian]

A lot can happen in 3 years.

I doubt that whoever forms government will go 3 years without calling an election. There will be a double dissolution within 3 years.

Why a double dissolution? Why not just a reps election?

 

[mike]

NBN Co has suspended recruitment pending the outcome of the election. They were happy to take applications for various positions right up to election day. Wonder if they know something.