Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[Cultured_Bogan]

Hammer I think he has a lot of explaining to do. Would he be gone by now in other times? Most likely he would have been eased out of the seat - at the end of the day nothing has really been proven yet. What is unsettling is the pressure some federal Coalition members have been placing on the state A-G to investigate the claims. To me that seems inappropriate.

And why is it we rarely get stories about Mary Jo Fisher?

Possibly because she's a South Australian senator Yoss. If she were a NSW senator we'd hear alot more about it.

 

[Yossarian]

Hammer I think he has a lot of explaining to do. Would he be gone by now in other times? Most likely he would have been eased out of the seat - at the end of the day nothing has really been proven yet. What is unsettling is the pressure some federal Coalition members have been placing on the state A-G to investigate the claims. To me that seems inappropriate.

And why is it we rarely get stories about Mary Jo Fisher?

Possibly because she's a South Australian senator Yoss. If she were a NSW senator we'd hear alot more about it.

Maybe. Then again you don't hear much about John Flowers these days either.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Hammer I think he has a lot of explaining to do. Would he be gone by now in other times? Most likely he would have been eased out of the seat - at the end of the day nothing has really been proven yet. What is unsettling is the pressure some federal Coalition members have been placing on the state A-G to investigate the claims. To me that seems inappropriate.

And why is it we rarely get stories about Mary Jo Fisher?

Possibly because she's a South Australian senator Yoss. If she were a NSW senator we'd hear alot more about it.

Maybe. Then again you don't hear much about John Flowers these days either.

True, but drawing a disability pension while running for office is a lot less scandalous than the shenanigans that Thompson got up to, or Della-Bosca and Neal. Doesn't make it any less wrong though.

 

[Yossarian]

Hammer I think he has a lot of explaining to do. Would he be gone by now in other times? Most likely he would have been eased out of the seat - at the end of the day nothing has really been proven yet. What is unsettling is the pressure some federal Coalition members have been placing on the state A-G to investigate the claims. To me that seems inappropriate.

And why is it we rarely get stories about Mary Jo Fisher?

Possibly because she's a South Australian senator Yoss. If she were a NSW senator we'd hear alot more about it.

Maybe. Then again you don't hear much about John Flowers these days either.

True, but drawing a disability pension while running for office is a lot less scandalous than the shenanigans that Thompson got up to, or Della-Bosca and Neal. Doesn't make it any less wrong though.

Belinda Neal is probably an example of an overly hysterical press reaction to very minor issues. Before this whole AVO saga what was her crime? Getting uppity when asked to move (mid meal mind you) so they can set up a disco? I'd be pretty shirty myself! Now I've met the woman and found her to be fairly unpleasant but the press coverage she got was and continues to be way over-the-top. Comparing her to Thompson or Flowers is a bit harsh.

I'm not saying Flowers is in the the Thompson category (assuming he did what he is being accused of) but I do think there is a double standard running. You'd never hear the end of it if it was an ALP member. At the end of the day it is pretty dodgy that someone can collect a pension for so long supposedly because they can't face a class of kids and then they run for parliament.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

True, but drawing a disability pension while running for office is a lot less scandalous than the shenanigans that Thompson got up to, or Della-Bosca and Neal. Doesn't make it any less wrong though.

Belinda Neal is probably an example of an overly hysterical press reaction to very minor issues. Before this whole AVO saga what was her crime? Getting uppity when asked to move (mid meal mind you) so they can set up a disco? I'd be pretty shirty myself! Now I've met the woman and found her to be fairly unpleasant but the press coverage she got was and continues to be way over-the-top. Comparing her to Thompson or Flowers is a bit harsh.

I'm not saying Flowers is in the the Thompson category (assuming he did what he is being accused of) but I do think there is a double standard running. You'd never hear the end of it if it was an ALP member. At the end of the day it is pretty dodgy that someone can collect a pension for so long supposedly because they can't face a class of kids and then they run for parliament.

I'm not arguing with you Yoss. My point was that the press decide is what's scandalous and what's not. There was a bit of loose sarcasm intended in my OP :slight_smile:

An MP getting fired up at humble restuarant staff is far easier for the press to blow out of proportion than someone drawing a pension while running for office. My take is that the public almost expect MP's to rort the system these days and as a result the press don't deem it as newsworthy.

 

[cunno]

Isn't Flowers working against the rules being an MP and drawing a disability (or similar) pension? How is he getting away with that?

 

[Yossarian]

True, but drawing a disability pension while running for office is a lot less scandalous than the shenanigans that Thompson got up to, or Della-Bosca and Neal. Doesn't make it any less wrong though.

Belinda Neal is probably an example of an overly hysterical press reaction to very minor issues. Before this whole AVO saga what was her crime? Getting uppity when asked to move (mid meal mind you) so they can set up a disco? I'd be pretty shirty myself! Now I've met the woman and found her to be fairly unpleasant but the press coverage she got was and continues to be way over-the-top. Comparing her to Thompson or Flowers is a bit harsh.

I'm not saying Flowers is in the the Thompson category (assuming he did what he is being accused of) but I do think there is a double standard running. You'd never hear the end of it if it was an ALP member. At the end of the day it is pretty dodgy that someone can collect a pension for so long supposedly because they can't face a class of kids and then they run for parliament.

I'm not arguing with you Yoss. My point was that the press decide is what's scandalous and what's not. There was a bit of loose sarcasm intended in my OP :slight_smile:

An MP getting fired up at humble restuarant staff is far easier for the press to blow out of proportion than someone drawing a pension while running for office. My take is that the public almost expect MP's to rort the system these days and as a result the press don't deem it as newsworthy.

Which is a sad reflection on the quality of journalism and the kind of stuff Lindsay Tanner was talking about in his book. As a point of interest, the humble restaurant in question (iguanas) is now closed.

 

[hammertime]

Which is a sad reflection on the quality of journalism and the kind of stuff Lindsay Tanner was talking about in his book. As a point of interest, the humble restaurant in question (iguanas) is now closed.

I agree Yoss, I don't think it was probably a major deal. Not as bad as the things that are going on with Thompson (if the allegations are true).

But I know I personally cannot stand anyone who thinks that they are above anyone else. Most Australians probably share that and it's why it was more prominently in the media. It's almost a similar thing with Thompson since he was misappropriating funds from hard working Aussies.

Things like shoplifting from the senator is bad and they should get rid of her. But it's hardly something that makes me angry.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

True, but drawing a disability pension while running for office is a lot less scandalous than the shenanigans that Thompson got up to, or Della-Bosca and Neal. Doesn't make it any less wrong though.

Belinda Neal is probably an example of an overly hysterical press reaction to very minor issues. Before this whole AVO saga what was her crime? Getting uppity when asked to move (mid meal mind you) so they can set up a disco? I'd be pretty shirty myself! Now I've met the woman and found her to be fairly unpleasant but the press coverage she got was and continues to be way over-the-top. Comparing her to Thompson or Flowers is a bit harsh.

I'm not saying Flowers is in the the Thompson category (assuming he did what he is being accused of) but I do think there is a double standard running. You'd never hear the end of it if it was an ALP member. At the end of the day it is pretty dodgy that someone can collect a pension for so long supposedly because they can't face a class of kids and then they run for parliament.

I'm not arguing with you Yoss. My point was that the press decide is what's scandalous and what's not. There was a bit of loose sarcasm intended in my OP :slight_smile:

An MP getting fired up at humble restuarant staff is far easier for the press to blow out of proportion than someone drawing a pension while running for office. My take is that the public almost expect MP's to rort the system these days and as a result the press don't deem it as newsworthy.

Which is a sad reflection on the quality of journalism and the kind of stuff Lindsay Tanner was talking about in his book. As a point of interest, the humble restaurant in question (iguanas) is now closed.

It is a sad reflection. The media should be pressing the issue when it comes to rorts. It's at the point now where rorting is seen as parliamentary privilege whereas any caught rorting should be taking a bath for their troubles.

As I said earlier, I don't find this to be any less wrong than what the media reports on, but unfortunately certain people within media groups have agendas and the power to highlight what they want to their audience. That Liberal fanboy Piers Akerman is the first that springs to mind.

 

[hammertime]

It is a sad reflection. The media should be pressing the issue when it comes to rorts. It's at the point now where rorting is seen as parliamentary privilege whereas any caught rorting should be taking a bath for their troubles.

As I said earlier, I don't find this to be any less wrong than what the media reports on, but unfortunately certain people within media groups have agendas and the power to highlight what they want to their audience. That Liberal fanboy Piers Akerman is the first that springs to mind.

Agreed CB. I hate that Piers guy. Seriously a poor reflection on society if he is one of the best political commentators that they can find. Such a snobby, pompous, up himself douchebag. The telegraph should do themselves a favor and dump him.

 

[Yossarian]

Their continued employment of him hardly helps their credability does it?

 

[hammertime]

Their continued employment of him hardly helps their credability does it?

Agreed. Terrible paper. I only buy it on Saturday's because the SMH is still in that massive format that won't fit on a table…

How about the ETS today huh? I just hope the economy doesn't take a bigger jolt when this comes in next year. Very risky play by Labor.

You might see some people start to exit industries in anticipation and see the unemployment rate creep up.

Thoughts?

 

[Yossarian]

Their continued employment of him hardly helps their credability does it?

Agreed. Terrible paper. I only buy it on Saturday's because the SMH is still in that massive format that won't fit on a table…

How about the ETS today huh? I just hope the economy doesn't take a bigger jolt when this comes in next year. Very risky play by Labor.

You might see some people start to exit industries in anticipation and see the unemployment rate creep up.

Thoughts?

My personal thoughts are it will be like the GST - its application will have a minimal effect on all concerned and nowhere near the problems some expect. In any case, business being business, someone will be able to exploit the possibilities that the tax (or more correctly) not paying the tax will offer. If you can make your widget using less carbon than your competitor then you'll have a competitive advantage.
Companies will only leave industries that aren't profitable - the tax won't cause that. Plus new industries are likely to spring up to make a buck from it.

Anyway at least it is better policy than Abbott's direct action plan which is dopey. I'd have more respect for him he just came out and said he thought climate change was a crock and he wasn't going to spend dollar one on it.

 

[hammertime]

Well NZ have it and they aren't seeing too many adverse effects. I like it, we need it, but i am concerned about business. They are facing enough competition from direct international importing with the GST on the price of goods, let alone the cost that this might add to certain Australian consumables. This may be the final nail in the coffin of Australian manufacturing.

I don't know enough of the 500 companies effected, so I can't say that with any gusto.

It does anger me that there is wealth distribution component in this. I don't think anyone should be getting overcompensated. But that's typical labor. Help the unproductive, slow down the growth.

 

[system]

I much preferred the ETS to the Carbon Tax that will now pass through parliament.

I do find it amusing though that the majority of that convoy and protest group are comprised of the single most self absorbed generation (as a whole) that we have witnessed as a civilisation. Baby boomer's shifted us from an Australia where the whole mattered, we were a big picture nation who have been reduced to our current state of "me'ism"

If anything it positions us to reinvest the capital the tax will bring in back into renewable energy development and actually create jobs and get ahead of the curve. Unfortunately there is no enshrined directions the money must flow so there is a real chance the benefit will be negligible and it will turn into another slush fund.

It will be interesting to see where we go from here. Points worth noting are that repealing the tax is not a viable option because of the billions repealing any tax costs. So Abbott is merely bluster on that. Secondly it will be interesting to see if the populace is stupid enough to swallow the coal seam gas campaign being run now as they were about a mining tax costing jobs. Finally the next step forward is the most intriguing one.

 

[happy_tiger]

I much preferred the ETS to the Carbon Tax that will now pass through parliament.

I do find it amusing though that the majority of that convoy and protest group are comprised of the single most self absorbed generation (as a whole) that we have witnessed as a civilisation. Baby boomer's shifted us from an Australia where the whole mattered, we were a big picture nation who have been reduced to our current state of "me'ism"

If anything it positions us to reinvest the capital the tax will bring in back into renewable energy development and actually create jobs and get ahead of the curve. Unfortunately there is no enshrined directions the money must flow so there is a real chance the benefit will be negligible and it will turn into another slush fund.

It will be interesting to see where we go from here. Points worth noting are that repealing the tax is not a viable option because of the billions repealing any tax costs. So Abbott is merely bluster on that. Secondly it will be interesting to see if the populace is stupid enough to swallow the coal seam gas campaign being run now as they were about a mining tax costing jobs. Finally the next step forward is the most intriguing one.

I think until we see how much of the offset costs that will be charged to the consumer it will be hard to tell how much it will affect us in the short term or long term
The govt is assuming that all the extra costs that will be passed on to the consumer will be passed on with negligible on costs attached to it (meaning that they are not adding a margin onto the extra costs accrued to the Carbon tax )

It is a bit different from the GST in that way

I'm not going to hold m breath that this will go to plan once it is introduced

 

[stryker]

Labor are running it….how could it possibly be anything more than a complete balls up?

Oh this will help fix the environment...what a load of bull crap. At least have the guts to say that this will pay for their other ill considered idea - NBN rollout.

If any more than 10% of these "funds" are spent on renewable energy I'll stand rooting.....

 

[Original_Magpie]

The Libs wont get rid of it when they are in power

 

[stryker]

The Libs wont get rid of it when they are in power

Nah I doubt it….money for nothing and chicks for free.....

 

[Original_Magpie]

much like the anset levy, sugar levy and etc the libs brought in