Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[hammertime]

It's about time people start taking responsibility for their own actions. The government isnt there to wipe their backsides for them.

Ummm I think the 100's of 1000's of people on the dole or welfare might disagree with you there mate…

If the Government of the day don't..... who will.....

No one is saying it's not a problem. I think they need to come up with an effective solution if they do see it as a major issue. At the end of the day, this will just transfer money from pokies to online or other sport gambling, all while costing taxpayers several billion dollars, reducing tax income, sending money offshore and sending clubs who look after community services down the gurgler! The structure is bordering on retarded. This is one of those policies where the intent is right, but the plan was devised by someone with the foresight of an infant.

Honestly, the ONLY way to stop dole money going to the right causes is to control the dole spending at the source. Maybe a set account with Coles/Woolies to home deliver a certain spend on groceries each week? If we really think this is a problem, we just need to stop being so PC and do the only thing that will work.

 

[Chadman_s_Ghost]

Well, I just joined the Australian Democrats, hoping that as a party, the Dems can produce a genuine OPTION to the 2 major parties- both of whom I think we will agree- fall short of expectations too often. Don't hate on me for it- I'm just looking for options to support in the future. :laughing:

The new Pokie proposal is completely & utterly short-sighted & righteous.

As has been pointed out, if people can't use pokies, they'll find some new way to gamble their money.

AS IS THEIR RIGHT.

Who are the government to tell the people of Australia how to spend their own money? If people WANT to gamble- let them. Instead of prohibition, the Australian government should invest into education programs to help against things like gambling addiction, or invest more into gambling helplines & programs- THAT is their responsibility.

As for people on benefits using their government handouts to subsidise their gambling- if we are to prohibit them from that- where does it stop? Do we prohibit alcohol & cigarettes too? How about prohibiting their spending on any type of leisure purchase? Movie tickets, zoo passes etc? It can't be, and shouldn't be done. Hammertime does raise an interesting thought though- if you subsidise the dole or any other benefit with food stamps, public transport cards etc- you will stop the use of benefits being WHOLLY used on items that are not essential. Perhaps a mix of the two- some 'cash in hand' combined with tokens/stamps for essential goods gives a better chance of your tax money will not be 'wasted' by those who rely on government handouts.

 

[hammertime]

As for people on benefits using their government handouts to subsidise their gambling- if we are to prohibit them from that- where does it stop? Do we prohibit alcohol & cigarettes too? How about prohibiting their spending on any type of leisure purchase? Movie tickets, zoo passes etc? It can't be, and shouldn't be done. Hammertime does raise an interesting thought though- if you subsidise the dole or any other benefit with food stamps, public transport cards etc- you will stop the use of benefits being WHOLLY used on items that are not essential. Perhaps a mix of the two- some 'cash in hand' combined with tokens/stamps for essential goods gives a better chance of your tax money will not be 'wasted' by those who rely on government handouts.

What doesn't bode well with me is that there can be children or spouses who can be hurt by an one parents selfishness. If a portion of the dole and child support is directly spent on the essentials of life, we will ensure that there is at least dinner on the table for the kiddies and a roof over their head.

Isn't that the purpose of these reforms? Demonizing just one form of gambling is so far off the point. Add that to the amazing monetary waste from the utterly ineffective policy (we are talking billions..) and you have Labor back to their best. :deadhorse: :brick:

Block it with everything you have Tony!!! I don't care if you have to ridicule another asbestos laden pensioner, just do it!

 

[hammertime]

Well, I just joined the Australian Democrats, hoping that as a party, the Dems can produce a genuine OPTION to the 2 major parties- both of whom I think we will agree- fall short of expectations too often. Don't hate on me for it- I'm just looking for options to support in the future. :laughing:

I'm with you on that one buddy…. would love to see the Dems rise from the ashes to offer a decent alternative.

 

[wests4ever]

All I can add in this thread is that the Govt was elected and they should do what they see as the right policy changes and be allowed to implement them whether this upsets certain voters is "too bad".
The facts are that quite a surprisingly large number of the population have addictions to many "vices" which create problems for their families as well as the Australian Taxpayer. Let them fix them hopefully one at a time regardless & "despite the criticism" of greedy/hopeless individuals who may be affected adversely.
Get over it u morts and move on with your lives and be happy. Life is so short to be carrying-on like little "spoilt brats" who should be back in "pre=school" for life.

 

[hammertime]

All I can add in this thread is that the Govt was elected and they should do what they see as the right policy changes and be allowed to implement them whether this upsets certain voters is "too bad".
The facts are that quite a surprisingly large number of the population have addictions to many "vices" which create problems for their families as well as the Australian Taxpayer. Let them fix them hopefully one at a time regardless & "despite the criticism" of greedy/hopeless individuals who may be affected adversely.
Get over it u morts and move on with your lives and be happy. Life is so short to be carrying-on like little "spoilt brats" who should be back in "pre=school" for life.

Wests4ever - I think you have to take on board that people are passionate enough to attempt to understand and debate government actions so that this country keeps powering ahead. Appathy has never lead to sucesss in any business or a great nation. Do you think the Mexican billionaire had anything to gain by commenting on our govt recently? No. He did so because he wanted to make sure they did the right thing. As does every commentator out there.

You are kidding yourself if you think anyone is commenting on pokies policy for self interest mate. It won't effect me directly what so ever. Most just want the right thing for this nation.

But have you even connected the dots how this can hurt our beloved team? I'm sure you haven't.

P.s. You use a lot of uncesssesary "quotes". Are you sure we are the ones who need to go back to school?

 

[Chadman_s_Ghost]

All I can add in this thread is that the Govt was elected and they should do what they see as the right policy changes and be allowed to implement them whether this upsets certain voters is "too bad".
The facts are that quite a surprisingly large number of the population have addictions to many "vices" which create problems for their families as well as the Australian Taxpayer. Let them fix them hopefully one at a time regardless & "despite the criticism" of greedy/hopeless individuals who may be affected adversely.
Get over it u morts and move on with your lives and be happy. Life is so short to be carrying-on like little "spoilt brats" who should be back in "pre=school" for life.

If the government decided that Rugby League was bad for people's health- and decided to limit your access to it- would you support that too?

You talk of 'vices' creating problems in families- but these 'vices' don't effect every family. Why should every person suffer a 'gambling limit' as the government proposes, when it is the minority that have a problem? Remember- gambling, smoking & drinking are not ILLEGAL.

If a government can take away a person's right to 'have a vice', what else can they take away? Do you like fast food? Oops- sorry- we are a fat nation. You have a KFC Ban.

As I said earlier- it's the government's responsibility to provide suitable avenues for those that do have a problem to find help- not take away everyone's access to that which is not illegal and is in fact, a person's choice.

As for the government doing 'as they see fit'- let's just hope they can 'see fit' to follow through with their election promises for a change.

I suggest that the next time you want to play the morally superior role, you look at the issue from both angles first you, (how did you put it again?)…oh- 'Mort'.

 

[Chadman_s_Ghost]

Well, I just joined the Australian Democrats, hoping that as a party, the Dems can produce a genuine OPTION to the 2 major parties- both of whom I think we will agree- fall short of expectations too often. Don't hate on me for it- I'm just looking for options to support in the future. :laughing:

I'm with you on that one buddy…. would love to see the Dems rise from the ashes to offer a decent alternative.

Well, if you ever want a 'push' to join, just PM me.. :slight_smile:

 

[hammertime]

All I can add in this thread is that the Govt was elected and they should do what they see as the right policy changes and be allowed to implement them whether this upsets certain voters is "too bad".
The facts are that quite a surprisingly large number of the population have addictions to many "vices" which create problems for their families as well as the Australian Taxpayer. Let them fix them hopefully one at a time regardless & "despite the criticism" of greedy/hopeless individuals who may be affected adversely.
Get over it u morts and move on with your lives and be happy. Life is so short to be carrying-on like little "spoilt brats" who should be back in "pre=school" for life.

p.s. Wests4Ever - the government in power was not elected and this policy was one of the bargaining chips by a crackpot independent (Wilkie). This policy was conceived by one man as a dot point on a sheet of A4 and agreed to because someone was desperate to cling to power.

… maybe you just need to know that this policy could bankrupt the Wests Tigers. Are you any less apathetic now?

Or maybe the government haven't proved to you enough already that they can get things completely wrong? I'm sure they could burn down a few more houses and kill a few more people from bar napkin policy if that will help you care?

I'm really holding back here, your comments honestly infuriate me. Dumbed down comments like that are the reason why we have catchphrase governments at the moment.
:deadhorse:

 

[system]

Well, I just joined the Australian Democrats, hoping that as a party, the Dems can produce a genuine OPTION to the 2 major parties- both of whom I think we will agree- fall short of expectations too often. Don't hate on me for it- I'm just looking for options to support in the future. :laughing:

I'm with you on that one buddy…. would love to see the Dems rise from the ashes to offer a decent alternative.

Problem with the Dems is that they blew their real chance at being a legitimate alternativew and those opportunities rarely present again. Instead of offering an alternative they were sold out by leaders for personal gain and than shifted to the lunatic left fringe under Bartlett.

Now they have zero funding for elections and they no longer have the kick start financially that Don Chip provided.

I was a member of the party for years and left the party as soon as Bartlett was made leader.

The Greens have filled the power vacuum left by smart central positioning and one issue focus. Scarily they now hold the balance of power in the senate and do so solely on their lonesome

 

[Geo]

I agree with your :deadhorse: about apathy Hammertime..

but to set the record straight Wests Tigers will never go bankrupt because of this policy….the fact that the reliance on leagues club grants from Balmain and Wests is minimal these days compared to some other clubs...

Wests Tigers in term of corporate sponsorship, marketing and benefactor support would be right up their competing with the Broncos now IMO...if the GF luncheon was any indication..

One bloke paid 40K just to be the No. 1 ticket holder for 2011...If they didn't make close to a Mill with all the various autions and raffles then I wasn't there.... 30K for the bit of dirt the Lortay 1st game 1st touch 1st try was cheap though...

So far the Government is doing fine....It's GF season anyway...Julia will be up for a huge weekend I reckon..

 

[Chadman_s_Ghost]

Well, I just joined the Australian Democrats, hoping that as a party, the Dems can produce a genuine OPTION to the 2 major parties- both of whom I think we will agree- fall short of expectations too often. Don't hate on me for it- I'm just looking for options to support in the future. :laughing:

I'm with you on that one buddy…. would love to see the Dems rise from the ashes to offer a decent alternative.

Problem with the Dems is that they blew their real chance at being a legitimate alternativew and those opportunities rarely present again. Instead of offering an alternative they were sold out by leaders for personal gain and than shifted to the lunatic left fringe under Bartlett.

Now they have zero funding for elections and they no longer have the kick start financially that Don Chip provided.

I was a member of the party for years and left the party as soon as Bartlett was made leader.

The Greens have filled the power vacuum left by smart central positioning and one issue focus. Scarily they now hold the balance of power in the senate and do so solely on their lonesome

The time for change has come. If nothing else- the Green vote shows Australia is open to options. With some smart campaigning, the rebirth of the Dems, while not easy, is not impossible either.

 

[system]

It requires money as they get nothing from the AEC since their capitulation

 

[Chadman_s_Ghost]

It requires money as they get nothing from the AEC since their capitulation

Completely agree.

It won't be an easy three or so years, but don't write the Dems off just yet…

 

[system]

I haven't written them off as an entity. However I have written off those currently in control. Alot can change in a few years though

 

[Chadman_s_Ghost]

I haven't written them off as an entity. However I have written off those currently in control. Alot can change in a few years though

Given my early experience so far with the party- you're judgement of it's 'leaders' may be spot on. But there are rumblings- so you never know- change might actually be coming.

 

[hammertime]

Guys, thought I might resurrect this lively thread since we are in the off-season and there is a bit happening in politics at the moment.

Wanted to hear peoples thoughts on the latest flood levy and what they think about Obama going with Wireless rather than a FTTH setup like we are?

 

[Guest]

Regarding the flood levy, well the Govt needs to come up with the money from somewhere. The cleanup and rebuilding costs are still going to outweigh the cash injection the Medicare levy increase will provide. As long as it is a once off as Gillard promises, then I don't have any real dramas with it.

Can't wait for Kristina Keneally to end up back on the street where she belongs.

 

[Blackpearl]

if as expected state labor are flogged in 7 weeks time maybe kristina might appear again as fed member … don't be surprised

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

I'm all for the flood levy, as long as it's percentage based on what you earn (I assume it will be, haven't read much about it TBH.) I did hear Keneally sooking about it on the news last night though and am pretty disgusted that she would carry on about the cost of living in Sydney at a time when people are homeless and have had their liveihood destroyed (even with insurance it won't be fixed overnight.) A cheap attempt to look like she's looking out for the people of NSW.

I'm tipping a record thrashing at the March state election, and just quietly, it's rightfully deserved.