Sheens Answer to Blowout scores

[Viking Warrior]

Man I miss a good short side scrum play..

You might get to see it lol we are probably just about crazy enough to bring him back.

 

[the_third]

Man I miss a good short side scrum play..

if they keep the scrum we should team the guys to push on every scrum. That will get you a short side play.... also keep the princesses - sorry backs - out of the scrum.

need a good off seasons training to do it properly though

 

[JC99]

I’d also like to see the defending team regain possession when the ball is held up in goal as it used to be ..

The current system where a player is held up but gets to have another shot from 10 out is a deadset farce ..

That would end up with some interacting tactics... teams dragging attackers into their own in goal on purpose to regain possession

 

[Geo]

Man I miss a good short side scrum play..

You might get to see it lol we are probably just about crazy enough to bring him back.

That is the thing though..Current Rugbeh League when you break it down is very predictable..All teams run the same plays..All teams pretty much try and defend the same..it's based on error free football and field position ..collapse the middle score on the edges..

The better teams just simply do it better than the others..

Not once in the last few years have I seen a team do something different and go wow ..never seen that before..

The short side scrum play when Rowdy burnt Slater was fantastic to watch cause it was different...

Sheens had flaws for sure but he changed the way the game was played....

 

[hobbo1]

I’d also like to see the defending team regain possession when the ball is held up in goal as it used to be ..

The current system where a player is held up but gets to have another shot from 10 out is a deadset farce ..

That would end up with some interacting tactics... teams dragging attackers into their own in goal on purpose to regain possession

I doubt it as it would be too risky especially for our mob

 

[Aesopian]

MASTER COACH URGES KICK-OFF RETHINK
Seven of the eight games last weekend finished with blow-out scores and the trend for runaway wins in the post-COVID NRL has officials very concerned.

But former Kangaroos and premiership-winning coach Tim Sheens has a simple solution that will fix the problem.

"Just make the team that scores kick off," Sheens told Wide World of Sports.

"In most major sports, the team that concedes points gets next use of the ball - except league.

"The game is so fast now that if a team scores and gets the ball back, they often get on a roll and the defending team can't stop it.

"Giving them next crack in attack would go a long way towards fixing that."

Yes - I think it is a good idea and one fans have talked about for sometime

V’landeys who?

I like it but don’t stop there.
Increase benchies to 8(21 man game day squad) but reduce interchange to 6. And once you’re off you can’t come back on. Some guys won’t be used but you could carry halves on the bench in case of key playmaker injuries, rather than playing nuffies out of position.

20 min quarters as well. Game speed is a joke. Games over in no time these days. It’s an injustice to the big fat lads. They’ve rubbed them out of the game.
#bringbackfatplodders

 

[JC99]

I’d also like to see the defending team regain possession when the ball is held up in goal as it used to be ..

The current system where a player is held up but gets to have another shot from 10 out is a deadset farce ..

That would end up with some interacting tactics... teams dragging attackers into their own in goal on purpose to regain possession

I doubt it as it would be too risky especially for our mob

They’re pretty smart nowadays they would keep them standing have guys holding the ball and drag them over.

 

[TieDye]

I’d also like to see the defending team regain possession when the ball is held up in goal as it used to be ..

The current system where a player is held up but gets to have another shot from 10 out is a deadset farce ..

That would end up with some interacting tactics... teams dragging attackers into their own in goal on purpose to regain possession

I doubt it as it would be too risky especially for our mob

They’re pretty smart nowadays they would keep them standing have guys holding the ball and drag them over.

Our Wests Tigers players got smarter ? That'll do me, Josh ?

 

[marzie]

Not a bad idea.
I also don't like the 7 tackle rule, should only apply if behind the 40 or halfway I reckon. Whos trying to kick the ball dead on purpose in good field position...

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Because it doesn’t reward the defensive side !

Why are you rewarding the defensive side for holding a player up? The reward is not conceding 4 points, what more do they need?

No it doesn’t how can it ?
It rewards the attacking side ...
They ain’t good enough to score but let’s give them several cracks at scoring .

And I’d rather watch a great defensive game than a 40- 26 game show

Isn’t what this thread is all about ?

Blow our score lines?

The repeat set is a deadset farce as well but that’s another thread on its own

Because you get six tackles to score. Why should that change because you don't score?

 

[mike]

It’s a terrible idea, it’s been tried before and has the exact opposite effect. The blowouts get bigger.

 

[hobbo1]

Because it doesn’t reward the defensive side !

Why are you rewarding the defensive side for holding a player up? The reward is not conceding 4 points, what more do they need?

No it doesn’t how can it ?
It rewards the attacking side ...
They ain’t good enough to score but let’s give them several cracks at scoring .

And I’d rather watch a great defensive game than a 40- 26 game show

Isn’t what this thread is all about ?

Blow our score lines?

The repeat set is a deadset farce as well but that’s another thread on its own

Because you get six tackles to score. Why should that change because you don't score?

Omg that’s the point ....
The game has gone way too far in favour of the attacking team and that’s my argument..

Held up in goal ..go back and try again
7 tackle sets
Corner posts don’t matter
40/20’s
Repeat sets

So they bring in a 20/40 to try and square up the ledger lmao !

The games turned to ? imo

 

[Pbulk]

Scoring team kicking off just gives them good field position to start. The whole reason they get the ball back on their goal line is so they have to start with poor field position.

If we are going to change rules re: held up in goal, you could get held up and the reward be a line drop out. You get 6 more, but you start back on halfway. Also drop the 7 tackle set it is such much too big a reward for missing a kick or dropping the ball over the line.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

I’d also like to see the defending team regain possession when the ball is held up in goal as it used to be ..

The current system where a player is held up but gets to have another shot from 10 out is a deadset farce ..

It’s a better rule than it used to be. Once upon a time it used to be a scrum 10 out for the side that was held up.

 

[tiger_scott]

How about a week after the grand final the coaches do a draft that includes all players, a redraft league for those that play fantasy. We'll use snake format and the team that finishes last gets first pick in round 1. We'll spread the talent around and should have a different top 8 each year.


(* the above post was made with tongue firmly planted in cheek, before you get all excited)

 

[jirskyr]

Scoring team kicking off just gives them good field position to start. The whole reason they get the ball back on their goal line is so they have to start with poor field position.

If we are going to change rules re: held up in goal, you could get held up and the reward be a line drop out. You get 6 more, but you start back on halfway. Also drop the 7 tackle set it is such much too big a reward for missing a kick or dropping the ball over the line.

Don't agree. League is about possession, not position. Union is about position, not possession.

In the old days, yes, it was about getting the ball down the other end and tackling them to death until a mistake occurred. Kickers couldn't hoist the leather balls 50m on the full. Halfbacks couldn't throw 20m cut-outs.

Games are broken in two nowadays by teams that get an avalanche of possession, camp down the other end, score, then get the ball back. They then march upfield from the kickoff and put in a kick that gets them potentially into another attacking position.

Compare the two scenarios:
(a) concede a try, get the ball back from a kickoff, work out of your end. Entire team is set, first hitup generally taken by a forward. Team gets a set break from defending. This is the Sheens suggestion.
(b) concede a try, kickoff, have to defend another set. Opposition typically gets to half-way and puts in an attacking kick, you now have to both defend the kick and work it out of your own end, first hitup by a fullback or winger.

In (a), even if their kickoff goes into the in-goal, you have a forward bringing it out tackle #1 and typically can get to at least 20m line if not further. In (b), it's very conceivable that a decent kicker puts a bomb onto your tryline, and if you get possession back, tackle #1 is on or at the goal-line. Your entire team has to retreat behind the tackle and you expend at least 2 tackles, typically 3, with backs taking hitups.

The major advantage of defending the next kickoff is chance of error. Secondary advantage, potentially, is if you can defend well or pressure the kick you might get better field position and the kick-chase may be worse than for a kickoff. It would be interesting and fairly simple for the NRL to look at average yardage from kickoffs to see how often teams turn over cheap possession and where the ball gets returned in a post-points kick return.

Drop-outs for held up is interesting, but one might argue that it's a greater disadvantage for the defensive side, because although they have a breather and an attempt to kick back out into mid-field, they'll have to defend another entire set, including running up over half a pitch to meet the first tackle. There's a reason why line dropouts (repeat sets) are so desirable as set-end outcomes.

Totally agree with you re the seven-tackle set. No idea why teams get a special reward for the attackers missing drop-goals, knock-ons in the act of scoring in the in-goal, slightly over-cooked grubbers. It dis-incentivises creative attack. It should be 7-tackles only for kicks that go dead from outside 30m.

 

[Lauren]

I've often seen a few of posts duscussing Warren Ryan(and some with Jack Gibson) so thought I'd share the link of an article I just read. Sheens is also mentioned in the article.

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/the-godfathers-of-coaching-and-how-they-shaped-the-modern-game-20200709-p55adh.html

 

[twentyforty]

Lauren, thanks for that article. You must be a mind reader hehe. I was recently thinking about Bellamy’s coaching and wondering if it was Bennett or Sheens who had more influence on his style. It’s clear now that it was Sheens. The article does illustrate the profound influence of thinking outside the box. Or even forgetting that there is a box. It appears all the great coaches are students of the rules and how they impact positively or negatively on players.