Signings, Suggestions & Rumours Discussion

[Love_the_WestsTigers]

We need to sign Jesus to play fullback and Thor as an edge back rower

Still leaves 11 spots to fill and the bench too ..

Throw in the gladiator in there and thats one less position

 

[TigersDenNZ]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

I can see the exact thing happening with our 2018 squad.

No game breakers, just a bunch of ex slash borderline rep players, neither of them are anywhere near the best in their position.

We need like 2 major names eg hayne and dugan. Not just an entire team of decent performers.

Funny though, few years back we were excited about the future with all our young stars, teddy brooks moses nofoaluma simona etc around the time penrith had a club full of ringg ins, now penrith are the team full of young stars and were bringing in players left right and centre.

 

[Harvey]

We need to focus on:
1\. Signing established very good players in key positions (spine, go forward)
2\. Identify young talent and lock them up (who was JAC before he came to our club on a 2nd tier deal)
3\. Have players with the right attitude to round out the squad (much like melbourne)
4\. Look for fringe players and youngsters looking for an opportunity on minimum deals to add depth to the roster.

 

[Harvey]

This thread has very much focused on signing players. I think another area to consider is the coaching staff. Ivan is a great head coach, but should Sandercock, Webster and the ISP/NYC coaches remain next year? What about the strength and conditioning department?
I would say based on the early season displays (and ability to only play 30 mins) the S&C needs an overhaul and would not be sad to see the back of other coaches in the club.

 

[HabboTiger]

Flush will happen there too

 

[Nelson]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

I can see the exact thing happening with our 2018 squad.

No game breakers, just a bunch of ex slash borderline rep players, neither of them are anywhere near the best in their position.

We need like 2 major names eg hayne and dugan. Not just an entire team of decent performers.

Funny though, few years back we were excited about the future with all our young stars, teddy brooks moses nofoaluma simona etc around the time penrith had a club full of ringg ins, now penrith are the team full of young stars and were bringing in players left right and centre.

Did you think Paul Vaughn was a game breaker when the Dragons signed him? Did you think Tim Lafai would be a game breaker coming into this season? Both of those players have been far more valuable for the Dragons this season than Dugan.

Jarrod Wallace and Tyrone Roberts have been more valuable for the Titans this season than Jarryd Hayne.

There's no point just trying to recruit the "best" players in a few positions if you don't surround them with a competent team.

 

[Harvey]

Why are we after players from the only club that has a worse culture than ours? We need to get players that will bring a culture of effort and hard work and apart from reynolds, not sure we have that in any of our new recruits.

 

[TigersDenNZ]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

I can see the exact thing happening with our 2018 squad.

No game breakers, just a bunch of ex slash borderline rep players, neither of them are anywhere near the best in their position.

We need like 2 major names eg hayne and dugan. Not just an entire team of decent performers.

Funny though, few years back we were excited about the future with all our young stars, teddy brooks moses nofoaluma simona etc around the time penrith had a club full of ringg ins, now penrith are the team full of young stars and were bringing in players left right and centre.

Did you think Paul Vaughn was a game breaker when the Dragons signed him? Did you think Tim Lafai would be a game breaker coming into this season? Both of those players have been far more valuable for the Dragons this season than Dugan.

Jarrod Wallace and Tyrone Roberts have been more valuable for the Titans this season than Jarryd Hayne.

There's no point just trying to recruit the "best" players in a few positions if you don't surround them with a competent team.

Yeah fair point mate.

Paul vaughn was always gonna be a star, i rated lafai pretty highly at the dogs, same as roberts i always thought hed flourish at any other club besides newcastle. All 3 are definitely exceeding my expectations, im not saying i read the future and knew theyd all be stars, but they definitely showed they had the capacity, lafais probably exceeded expecttions the most out of that lot.

But i still maintain that a team that is just solid across the park with no outstanding players can not be genuine contenders.

I remember growing up everytime i played against a team from aussie they would always thrash us cos they were just hell bent on winning, whereas nz is all about having a go and trying hard. Thats the biggest thing ive admired about aussie sports its that you guys play to win.

Tigers seem like they are getting too swept up in good attitudes, nice guys and making sure everyone gets along.

We need a bit of arrogance in there, i suppose reynolds kind of brings that, but hes just about the only one. Similar to when benji was at his best. You cant play with that sort of cockiness without earning it through victories and we are far from earning that…. IMO

 

[tig_prmz]

I have generally stayed quiet in this thread as I have very few sources in the club these days and prefer to comment on players at our club rather than prognosticate on whether a certain player may join our a club.

However, I have been reflecting on Cleary's recruitment choices over the past week. His approach reminds me of comments he made in an interview a few weeks ago about how the Wests Tigers style of footy (flash and brilliance but with a soft underbelly) has been very different to the Balmain and Magpies styles. He spoke with fondness about the tough and rugged styles of Balmain and Magpies. Sides that weren't the prettiest but that turn up each week to play footy and who the opposition knew would make them work for a win and hurt them.

This seems to be the team he wants to win. I suspect that is why he withdrew the offer from Moses. The style he wants is a style that is the exact opposite of what Moses represents - rocks and diamonds.

I suspect with Woods and Teddy, he took a similar approach. Great players but replaceable.

Woods is the biggest loss for me. Whilst he has is flaws, both as a player and as a person, he is a very good prop forward and, whilst he isn't as tough as the image he likes to portray, he could have been the player that Clearly built the 'new' style Wests Tigers around.

I understand why many see Teddy as a massive loss. He can do things others can't. However, I have felt over the last two years that Teddy has been a limiting element in our team. Whenever the ball goes to our backline, it gets thrown to Teddy playing as a second five-eighth and he either dies with the ball or makes a break (rarely). Very predictable and pedestrian. Sure he still does the freakish things but Im not sure they make up for the drawbacks (which include his defensive frailties).

Admittedly when Cleary was first appointed, it looked like he tried to get Teddy to limit his involvement. However, last week and against Cronulla (before Teddy got injured) we went back to going to Teddy almost every backline move. I am not convinced that was a tactical decision and that it was more about players not following directions.

I'm excited.

good post but disagree re teddy.

any half decent coach would be able to play teddy the way he wants to play him. he can set up tries, break tackles and score tries. he's a freakish player but more importantly he's natrually gifted in turning 3 vs 3 into 3 on 2\. at the same time, he can execute a 3 on 2 with perfection as well.

teddy is no rocks and diamonds, he's a consistenly good player. he has his deficiencies in defense definitely which wouldn't be that hard to improve given his talent.

 

[momo_amp_medo]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

I can see the exact thing happening with our 2018 squad.

No game breakers, just a bunch of ex slash borderline rep players, neither of them are anywhere near the best in their position.

We need like 2 major names eg hayne and dugan. Not just an entire team of decent performers.

Funny though, few years back we were excited about the future with all our young stars, teddy brooks moses nofoaluma simona etc around the time penrith had a club full of ringg ins, now penrith are the team full of young stars and were bringing in players left right and centre.

You are a real ray of sunshine!

 

[momo_amp_medo]

This thread has very much focused on signing players. I think another area to consider is the coaching staff. Ivan is a great head coach, but should Sandercock, Webster and the ISP/NYC coaches remain next year? What about the strength and conditioning department?
I would say based on the early season displays (and ability to only play 30 mins) the S&C needs an overhaul and would not be sad to see the back of other coaches in the club.

No I think he will bring in is own crew.

 

[hodgo]

Anyone that thinks we will turn anything around this year is delusional. Cleary will play all his fringe first graders and see if any are worthy of being around next year.

You can see from his buys that he is trying to develop depth and a total culture change. This imo will not lead to a title in a year or two. What it will do is develop a culture that will attracked the RIGHT talented players and make us finals worthy consistently.

This will be a process don't look for a quick fix.

 

[Roar_Power]

Anyone that thinks we will turn anything around this year is delusional. Cleary will play all his fringe first graders and see if any are worthy of being around next year.

You can see from his buys that he is trying to develop depth and a total culture change. This imo will not lead to a title in a year or two. What it will do is develop a culture that will attracked the RIGHT talented players and make us finals worthy consistently.

This will be a process don't look for a quick fix.

Agreed.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

No, I remember Penrith signing those players and making the top 4 and reaching a pre lim final.

 

[Nelson]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

I can see the exact thing happening with our 2018 squad.

No game breakers, just a bunch of ex slash borderline rep players, neither of them are anywhere near the best in their position.

We need like 2 major names eg hayne and dugan. Not just an entire team of decent performers.

Funny though, few years back we were excited about the future with all our young stars, teddy brooks moses nofoaluma simona etc around the time penrith had a club full of ringg ins, now penrith are the team full of young stars and were bringing in players left right and centre.

Did you think Paul Vaughn was a game breaker when the Dragons signed him? Did you think Tim Lafai would be a game breaker coming into this season? Both of those players have been far more valuable for the Dragons this season than Dugan.

Jarrod Wallace and Tyrone Roberts have been more valuable for the Titans this season than Jarryd Hayne.

There's no point just trying to recruit the "best" players in a few positions if you don't surround them with a competent team.

Yeah fair point mate.

Paul vaughn was always gonna be a star, i rated lafai pretty highly at the dogs, same as roberts i always thought hed flourish at any other club besides newcastle. All 3 are definitely exceeding my expectations, im not saying i read the future and knew theyd all be stars, but they definitely showed they had the capacity, lafais probably exceeded expecttions the most out of that lot.

But i still maintain that a team that is just solid across the park with no outstanding players can not be genuine contenders.

I remember growing up everytime i played against a team from aussie they would always thrash us cos they were just hell bent on winning, whereas nz is all about having a go and trying hard. Thats the biggest thing ive admired about aussie sports its that you guys play to win.

Tigers seem like they are getting too swept up in good attitudes, nice guys and making sure everyone gets along.

We need a bit of arrogance in there, i suppose reynolds kind of brings that, but hes just about the only one. Similar to when benji was at his best. You cant play with that sort of cockiness without earning it through victories and we are far from earning that…. IMO

I don't think it's an Aussie/Kiwi thing - just look at the All Blacks vs the Wallabies and the roles are completely reversed. All four of our major signings so far seem like competitors to me and that's what we need. Guys who at least play like it's their job to win, not just to go out there and have fun with their mates. Guys who treat is like an actual job and not an entitlement because they happen to have some skill.

Reynolds gets away with his arrogance because everyone can see he's busting a gut out there. That attitude is fine and we can recruit as many of those players as we can find as far as I'm concerned. The destructive attitude comes from a player like Hayne who coasts along on his own talent while earning a massive pay packet and looking down on others. Players like that put a lot of noses out of joint.

 

[WT2K]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

No, I remember Penrith signing those players and making the top 4 and reaching a pre lim final.

Yep, perfectly said GNR4LIFE

 

[TigersDenNZ]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

No, I remember Penrith signing those players and making the top 4 and reaching a pre lim final.

Yep, perfectly said GNR4LIFE

Oh wow apologies guys, didnt do my research i thought they made top 4 the year before the player overhaul, ma bad :/

 

[tsjonathan]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

I can see the exact thing happening with our 2018 squad.

No game breakers, just a bunch of ex slash borderline rep players, neither of them are anywhere near the best in their position.

We need like 2 major names eg hayne and dugan. Not just an entire team of decent performers.

Funny though, few years back we were excited about the future with all our young stars, teddy brooks moses nofoaluma simona etc around the time penrith had a club full of ringg ins, now penrith are the team full of young stars and were bringing in players left right and centre.

in 2003/2004 Balmain had Robbie Farah, Halatau coming through; Keebra had Benji and Wests Magpies won the SG BaLL with Hoffman; Fulton; Gibbs and signed Scott Prince; Brett Hodgson. Good times.

 

[Milky]

Dugan confirmed to Sharks on a 4 year deal….Poor Dragons fans, just when things start to look good.

Hope they can find a replacement for him and Packer.

 

[VanillaThunder]

Remember when penrith went and signed Dean Whare, Jamal Idris, Jamie Soward, Peter Wallace, Peta Hiku etc, a hole bunch of rep players and they were still terrible?

No, I remember Penrith signing those players and making the top 4 and reaching a pre lim final.

And on top of that, Idris was already struggling at the Gold Coast, Soward was coming back from England and Wallace was pushed out of Brisbane. Whare and Hiku were the only ones with form but that was literally one season's worth with Manly (Whare also left for an opportunity with Matai and Lyon ahead of him).
Neither he or Hiku were established rep players, and the other three had their best days behind them.
I get what you're saying, but although there's similarities, they were hardly the marquee signings that you suggest.