Tigers must make the most of 2017

[foreveratiger]

They didn't beat anyone good.

Except the defending premiers.

I knew when I wrote that sentence that someone would mention the Cowboys game. Put your hand on your heart and tell me that beating the Cowboys, at Leichhardt, when they're in the middle of their flattest spell of the season, gives you the confidence that this Tigers side has what it takes to go with the real contenders when they step up their game.

Here's our 2016 results against teams that made the finals:
Storm: two defeats, one genuinely close.
Raiders: two absolute floggings.
Sharks: one defeat, respectable but not close.
Cowboys: one win, comfortable.
Broncos: one win, very close, Origin affected (both sides, TBF).
Panthers: one win, one absolute flogging.
Bulldogs: one absolute flogging, one comfortable defeat.
Titans: two defeats, one genuinely close.

We had 11 wins, of which three came against top-eight sides. These are not the results of a team that is about to go to the next level.

We need to really hope that we are not affected by injuries to any of our key players cause if we are it's going to be a Longgggg Season

 

[happy_tiger]

In the end it came down to winning the games we should have won and won comfortably and not getting flogged 3-4 times a season

That Knights game …...........cost us Top 8

 

[Cosimo_Zaretti]

I had thought JT was trying to get team structure and kicked Farah because he kept trying to do everything. Am I wrong?

JT was very diplomatic about it, but the general gist was that they wanted quick service off the deck to get Moses, Brooks and Tedesco more involved. It's not that taking options out of dummy half is a bad idea per se, it's that Farah isn't all that effective any more.

Referees got sick of him trying to catch the markers, but he still tried to milk the penalties. His two steps forward before offloading just slowed down the service. The 7 tackle restart killed off the 5th tackle ingoal grubber from the play the ball. Robbie's a Tigers legend, but in the end it just wasn't working.

In 2017 Mitch Moses is a much better footballer than Robbie Farah, that's the reality. Out of our available options you want the ball in Moses' hands pronto. Now if Jacob Liddle turns out to be a genuine running threat at number 9, you might see Taylor's system become a whole lot more accomodating.

 

[2041]

In the end it came down to winning the games we should have won and won comfortably and not getting flogged 3-4 times a season

That Knights game …...........cost us Top 8

If you could somehow put together a side that never lost against bottom eight sides and had our record against the top eight it still wouldn't be a recipe for success. In fact we only dropped three games against the bottom eight in 2016 - win them all and we'd still only have come eighth (maybe seventh, if we'd overturned a 166 f/a gap to the Bulldogs). That would have left us needing to play four consecutive opponents away from home and having quite significant off days: the Broncos in Brisbane, Cowboys in Townsville, Sharks in Sydney and then the Storm in the grand final.

Ok, this is all totally hypothetical. But there is a point: is this club's ambition to scrape into the finals and extend the season by a week or maybe two, or is it to build a genuine contender? If it's the latter (and it damn well should be) they have to find a way to live with, and occasionally beat, good teams even when those teams aren't wildly off their game or denuded by Origin/injury.

 

[ricksen]

I read that as more like 'time to put up or shut up' - as if the players know that they need to perform or they won't be getting re-signed. No more looking to gain experience - time to get results.
IMO this attitude should have been in place last year.

 

[2041]

They didn't beat anyone good.

Except the defending premiers.

I knew when I wrote that sentence that someone would mention the Cowboys game. Put your hand on your heart and tell me that beating the Cowboys, at Leichhardt, when they're in the middle of their flattest spell of the season, gives you the confidence that this Tigers side has what it takes to go with the real contenders when they step up their game.

Here's our 2016 results against teams that made the finals:
Storm: two defeats, one genuinely close.
Raiders: two absolute floggings.
Sharks: one defeat, respectable but not close.
Cowboys: one win, comfortable.
Broncos: one win, very close, Origin affected (both sides, TBF).
Panthers: one win, one absolute flogging.
Bulldogs: one absolute flogging, one comfortable defeat.
Titans: two defeats, one genuinely close.

We had 11 wins, of which three came against top-eight sides. These are not the results of a team that is about to go to the next level.

We need to really hope that we are not affected by injuries to any of our key players cause if we are it's going to be a Longgggg Season

Indeed. That's the other thing we don't mention enough - after two or three awful injury seasons we've been pretty lucky the last year or two. Having said that, my guess is that 'staying relatively injury free' is one of the most important ingredients of success in any given year and also one of the least discussed - the Sharks' run of injury luck in 2016 was absolutely incredible, as was the Cowboys' the year before and, if memory serves, Souths' in 2014.

Again, if a mostly injury-free year puts the Tigers in 9th it's hardly a good sign of improvement ahead.

 

[Tim Sheens]

They didn't beat anyone good.

Except the defending premiers.

I knew when I wrote that sentence that someone would mention the Cowboys game. Put your hand on your heart and tell me that beating the Cowboys, at Leichhardt, when they're in the middle of their flattest spell of the season, gives you the confidence that this Tigers side has what it takes to go with the real contenders when they step up their game.

Here's our 2016 results against teams that made the finals:
Storm: two defeats, one genuinely close.
Raiders: two absolute floggings.
Sharks: one defeat, respectable but not close.
Cowboys: one win, comfortable.
Broncos: one win, very close, Origin affected (both sides, TBF).
Panthers: one win, one absolute flogging.
Bulldogs: one absolute flogging, one comfortable defeat.
Titans: two defeats, one genuinely close.

We had 11 wins, of which three came against top-eight sides. These are not the results of a team that is about to go to the next level.

I feel you are selling us a bit short on that cows performance. We set and carried out the template to shutdown Thurston, by in turn shutting down his minder and go to man in
Taumalolo. Others followed our lead and whilst the Cowboys tried to adjust their game a little to compensate, it was not enough and they will have to make more adjustments over the off season.

I expect more similarly specific game plans from WT this year and am looking hopefully to seeing them carried out. No escaping that we copped a couple of pastings this year, but for mine a decent part of those was associated with a certain path the club was heading and was heartened by improvement in many areas. Having been remodeled and shaped, the framework is now in place for the team to go to the next level and maybe even a step further if we get some of that luck alluded to, plodders and all.

 

[Newtown]

Tigers must make the most of 2017

"I think it's getting to that stage now where all of us boys have been together for a while and we know how we play.

"We might not be here next year – a lot of boys might move on – so we've really got to seize this year, seize this opportunity and give it everything for next year."
\
\
Oh god, what is that supposed to mean??

Probably the fact we have 21 players off contract.

I hope it's not because it is likely that Tedesco, Woods and Brooks will in 2018 be snared away from Wests Tigers by fat contracts offered by other clubs.

 

[tsjonathan]

Never in my life have I been this comfortable knowing that there is no footy.

 

[tsjonathan]

They didn't beat anyone good.

Except the defending premiers.

I knew when I wrote that sentence that someone would mention the Cowboys game. Put your hand on your heart and tell me that beating the Cowboys, at Leichhardt, when they're in the middle of their flattest spell of the season, gives you the confidence that this Tigers side has what it takes to go with the real contenders when they step up their game.

Here's our 2016 results against teams that made the finals:
Storm: two defeats, one genuinely close.
Raiders: two absolute floggings.
Sharks: one defeat, respectable but not close.
Cowboys: one win, comfortable.
Broncos: one win, very close, Origin affected (both sides, TBF).
Panthers: one win, one absolute flogging.
Bulldogs: one absolute flogging, one comfortable defeat.
Titans: two defeats, one genuinely close.

We had 11 wins, of which three came against top-eight sides. These are not the results of a team that is about to go to the next level.

2006- 11th
2007 9th
2008 10th
2009 9th
**2010 3rd
2011 4th**
2012 10th
2013 15th
2014 13th
2015 15th
2016 9th

2/11= 18%

 

[Telltails]

Comparing rosters man for man against the top eight sides and add Parramatta Roosters and the under performing Warriors - just can't see us as a top eight side unless Idris performs like four men and JT miraculously rectifies the glaring problems that he hasn't been able to do to in the past two seasons.
Where is the significant improvement coming from to make us overtake the improvement in the other sides already above us and some below us?
I see us in a similar position this year as last year depending largely on our injury toll. Hope they prove me wrong.

 

[WestsBenTigers]

The only sentence that means anything in here is "We might not be here next year – a lot of boys might move on".

If 2017 is the last year for this team's window they might as well give up now and start planning for the next time they might dream of being competitive. I saw absolutely nothing in 2016 to convince me that this side will be a contender this year. They didn't beat anyone good, they folded at the first sign of real intensity, the defence was barely improved if at all, and they haven't subsequently made transformative signings.

If even more of the club's cap money is going to be locked up in players that are already on the books, ie there will be even less available for the supporting cast, then I'm afraid we're knackered unless we somehow get inspired coaching (which = a new coach, in my view) or find TPA cash the likes of which were previously unimagined.

The squad as currently set up and coached can dream of 7th-8th and an early finals exit, or more plausibly 10th-12th and avoiding embarrassment. I believe it was Einstein who defined insanity as "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results". That's the Tigers right now - hoping that the halves somehow step up to a new level while simultaneously giving them a pack of nuffies, a slow back line and a mediocre at best coach. And it's going nowhere fast.

Find myself agreeing with your mind thought 2041.

Have no doubt that they will try hard but we are short on quality to Compete with the real sides Competing for the Title .
I don't think we will make the 8 but would be a Confidence booster for the following year for the players that are retained.

There is plenty of " Hype the fans " type Articles this time of the year and it's easy to get your hopes up before a ball has kicked of but i think Ava knows there is many that are simply not up to 1st Grade Standard and if we are serious of convincing players such as Woods , Teddy , Moses that there future lies here well there is plenty of dead wood at our Club that we need to get rid of and bring in real quality .

Must go :
Naiqama , Lovett , Ballin , Joel Edwards , Rankin

under pressure :
Brooks , Idris , Simona

**Players such as Michael Chee Cam , Rod Griffin , Justin Hunt , Jack Little John need to be given more of a go**when some players are not performing as we can not make proper decisions on these guys when they are not given a proper go , there is no room for rewarding Complacency .

They're no better than the players you think should be let go. Every one of them are in the 24-25 age bracket and are yet to cement a regular first grade gig anywhere. They're fringe first graders and always will be. Putting them in the side will do nothing to change the teams fortunes.

People just have to ride this year out. The reason why hardly anyone gets dropped is because we have no one to replace them with.

I tend to agree with FT

2041 is right, Tigers are doing the same thing over and over again and expecting results to change. Nothing is going to change with dead wood still in our side.

We've seen that some players aren't up to 1st grade standard, so the should me moved on and give some experience to players with potential. At least that gives us a chance for results to go our way

It is up to the coaches what our 17 looks like, but I like the path FT is going down

 

[GNR4LIFE]

2041 is right, Tigers are doing the same thing over and over again and expecting results to change. Nothing is going to change with dead wood still in our side.

No, nothing is going to change till we untie our hands from the noose that is the salary cap restraints at the end of this year. There's a reason why we persist with deadwood. It's all we can afford.

We've seen that some players aren't up to 1st grade standard, **so the should me moved on and give some experience to players with potential.** At least that gives us a chance for results to go our way

Like who? The guys in the first grade squad are the best the club has. If they're not getting results, the depth players won't either.

It is up to the coaches what our 17 looks like, but I like the path FT is going down

Well thanks to previous management their hands are tied till the end of the year. They are doing a commendable job with what they have to work with though.

 

[Newtown]

The only sentence that means anything in here is "We might not be here next year – a lot of boys might move on".

If 2017 is the last year for this team's window they might as well give up now and start planning for the next time they might dream of being competitive. I saw absolutely nothing in 2016 to convince me that this side will be a contender this year. They didn't beat anyone good, they folded at the first sign of real intensity, the defence was barely improved if at all, and they haven't subsequently made transformative signings.

If even more of the club's cap money is going to be locked up in players that are already on the books, ie there will be even less available for the supporting cast, then I'm afraid we're knackered unless we somehow get inspired coaching (which = a new coach, in my view) or find TPA cash the likes of which were previously unimagined.

The squad as currently set up and coached can dream of 7th-8th and an early finals exit, or more plausibly 10th-12th and avoiding embarrassment. I believe it was Einstein who defined insanity as "doing the same thing over and over again and expecting different results". That's the Tigers right now - hoping that the halves somehow step up to a new level while simultaneously giving them a pack of nuffies, a slow back line and a mediocre at best coach. And it's going nowhere fast.

Find myself agreeing with your mind thought 2041.

Have no doubt that they will try hard but we are short on quality to Compete with the real sides Competing for the Title .
I don't think we will make the 8 but would be a Confidence booster for the following year for the players that are retained.

There is plenty of " Hype the fans " type Articles this time of the year and it's easy to get your hopes up before a ball has kicked of but i think Ava knows there is many that are simply not up to 1st Grade Standard and if we are serious of convincing players such as Woods , Teddy , Moses that there future lies here well there is plenty of dead wood at our Club that we need to get rid of and bring in real quality .

Must go :
Naiqama , Lovett , Ballin , Joel Edwards , Rankin

under pressure :
Brooks , Idris , Simona

Players such as Michael Chee Cam , Rod Griffin , Justin Hunt , Jack Little John need to be given more of a go when some players are not performing as we can not make proper decisions on these guys when they are not given a proper go , there is no room for rewarding Complacency .

I think you forgot to put Chris Lawrence on the must go list. Surely the club is not going to keep him on in 2018 for old times sake. Currently he is not even first grade standard playing second row.

 

[Born_tiger]

TT was going to give us a New Years update.. I have an ill feeling about the club, I need it more than ever.

 

[2041]

I should say, I don't really blame the club for this situation - or at least not the current administration - apart from possibly their seemingly unshakable faith in Jason Taylor. What I would say is that they might need to apply some unconventional thinking, which doesn't seem to be a great strength, shall we say.

Clubs with limited outside the cap money are never going to be able to compete without having real contributors playing for unders. That window has already closed when it comes to Woods and mayber has one more season when it comes to Brooks, Moses and Tedesco. If we re-sign all four at market rate there is no way there will ever be anything else in the squad but kids, clubmen and retreads - it's just the reality of a salary capped league where only some have the ability to, let's say, stretch the cap.

Some teams have made a speciality of the stars and scrubs approach (Melbourne), others have been able to supplement stars with cheap young players and specialists to create windows (Cowboys, Souths, Cronulla). And then there are the cheats.

Unfortunately I think the Tigers are at a point where they have to decide what they're going to be in a way that either requires some really different thinking (paying full whack for the halves and fullback and working out a radical new plan to build around them without spending, for instance) or acknowledge that they've already missed their chance with this 'big four' and resign themselves to letting at least two, if not three, go.

Put it this way: I bet the Raiders aren't missing Dugan, Ferguson and Carney as much as they thought they might when they lost them.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

TT was going to give us a New Years update.. I have an ill feeling about the club, I need it more than ever.

You seem to be jumping at shadows. Take a breath.

 

[stryker]

"People just have to ride this year out". Lol…

I cant wait til 2018 when we can begin another 3 years of rebuilding.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

"People just have to ride this year out". Lol…

I cant wait til 2018 when we can begin another 3 years of rebuilding.

What's to rebuild in 2018 with our whole cap to spend?

 

[stryker]

If we dont play finals this year and do well then we wont attract quality to the club and will be forced to spend that whole cap on juniors and existing talent thus starting the cycle again.