Tigers should plea to nrl

P

Pedro_m

New member
Why can't the wests tigers negotiate a deal with the nrl to breach the salary cap this year and pay off their debts to make them actually competitive next season. It's not like we have a team even close to the salary cap we are just paying other teams salary caps for them e.g bronco Blair.
My opinion on the salary cap was to level the playing field so rich clubs couldn't just buy the best players and leave the poor clubs with the scraps, it's not really in the spirit of the cap for a 500k player(Blair ) to only make up 100k of brisbanes cap and 400k of ours, that is not even or fair.
If this is allowed what's stopping 2 nrl teams doing a dodgy deal and taking turns in coming last and coming first over a 4 year period?
 
@Pedro m said:
My opinion on the salary cap was to level the playing field so rich clubs couldn't just buy the best players and leave the poor clubs with the scraps, it's not really in the spirit of the cap for a 500k player(Blair ) to only make up 100k of brisbanes cap and 400k of ours, that is not even or fair.
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It is definitely not fair or even but even worse it was plain stupid for Wests Tigers to make such a non business savvy transaction like that. It definitely came to bite Wests tigers last weekend but unfortunately it will continue to bite them for the next couple of years.
 
1\. We probably can not afford the extra money to breach the cap and pay the fine.

2\. It would also be an intentional breach of the cap, most salary cap breaches are not intentional.

3\. The NRL would not allow it, the major reason we are in this position is the backloading of contracts. We deferred paying players their market value in previous seasons to unable us to stay under the cap for those years. We now need to pay those players the money they are owed.
 
I don't buy it. I remember yeaaaaars ago one of our execs coming out and saying we would not backloading deals anymore because of something just like this. Are we supposed to believe and accept that it has happened again?
 
@cochise said:
1\. We probably can not afford the extra money to breach the cap and pay the fine.

2\. It would also be an intentional breach of the cap, most salary cap breaches are not intentional.

3\. The NRL would not allow it, the major reason we are in this position is the backloading of contracts. We deferred paying players their market value in previous seasons to unable us to stay under the cap for those years. We now need to pay those players the money they are owed.
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In relation to your third point, I'm not sure whether there is a cap on third party payments to players but if there isn't and we had a rich benefactor then that's about the only way I can see of getting out of the current financial mess in the short term rather tha have to wait three years and not be able to buy experience.
 
@cunno said:
@cochise said:
1\. We probably can not afford the extra money to breach the cap and pay the fine.

2\. It would also be an intentional breach of the cap, most salary cap breaches are not intentional.

3\. The NRL would not allow it, the major reason we are in this position is the backloading of contracts. We deferred paying players their market value in previous seasons to unable us to stay under the cap for those years. We now need to pay those players the money they are owed.

In relation to your third point, I'm not sure whether there is a cap on third party payments to players but if there isn't and we had a rich benefactor then that's about the only way I can see of getting out of the current financial mess in the short term rather tha have to wait three years and not be able to buy experience.
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There isn't a cap on third party payments that come from companies not linked to the club. But that would also be difficult to fix this situation. For starters, the NRL can reject a contract that they feel is not meeting a certain standard for players. So signing new players under this proposal would be problematic. Also if we were to renegotiate existing contracts and have the players sign contracts for lesser value that would raise flags to a possible dodgy deal.

The only options I can see to try and free up some space would be to negotiate new deals with players and actually extend their deals.

For example Lawrance is on a reported $700k next season, the final year of his contract. It may be possible to negotiate with Chris that he gets paid $500K next season but we extend his deal for a further 2 or 3 years at a more reasonable $300K for those years. He may accept this deal as it gives greater long term security at a club he loves. Problem with this strategy is we would need a number of players to agree to similar deals to make it work.
 
@MacDougall said:
I don't buy it. I remember yeaaaaars ago one of our execs coming out and saying we would not backloading deals anymore because of something just like this. Are we supposed to believe and accept that it has happened again?
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I agree. It just sounds like palava to me.
 
@stevetiger said:
@MacDougall said:
I don't buy it. I remember yeaaaaars ago one of our execs coming out and saying we would not backloading deals anymore because of something just like this. Are we supposed to believe and accept that it has happened again?

I agree. It just sounds like palava to me.
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It definately happened again. Farah, Lawrance, Teddy, Moses and Brook (at least) are all on backloaded deals.

I would guess that Woods and Galloway are too
 
This is a tactic to get rid of Farah, Lawrence, Galloway. We are starting the PR war before getting rid of club stall warts. This inept club is very easy to read.
 
@MacDougall said:
It's bafflingly dumb. We haven't even had a good tear recently to justify it.
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It started around our good years in 09, 10, 11, 12\. That was the window that this strategy needed to pay off, it didnt, especially in 12.
 
@TYGA said:
This is a tactic to get rid of Farah, Lawrence, Galloway. We are starting the PR war before getting rid of club stall warts. This inept club is very easy to read.
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We should just have the guts to copy manly and get rid of whoever is standing in the way and get on with it. The club showed heighno (was current most capped WT at the time) and gibbs etc the same method and although it sucked we all moved on so lets just rip the bandaid off quickly

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i think people here are really confusing what backloading is and what used to happen with our club (and may still be happening).

A backloaded deal simply says, we pay brooks 200k this year, 300k 2016, 500k in 2017\. keeping in mind the salary cap is also going up as should his worth/ability as a player.

what happened with players lik fifita, gibbs and beau ryan is we had a contract to pay them (for example) 200k in 2013 and 2014\. if in 2012 we decide no we don't want them, they look for another club. they found the sharks who lets say are prepared to pay 100k. The players MUST receive 200k from somewhere because they have been guarunteed that in the contract. this means we have to now pay 100k out of our cap + 100k will be paid by the sharks from their cap to give them 200k.

now, i dont know whether this is what happened with blair. If a player asks for a release then we don't have to pay them anything.

as for this 'deal' with the NRL. will never happen, simply ridiculous. can you imagine the outcry if we were allowed to breach the cap??? fans would go into meltdown here if it was revealed the sharks were allowed to have a 7 million dollar cap next year and the rest of the NRL get 6.5 million. its our own fault for not managing the cap properly. seems like there have been knock on effects, it should be better in a couple years..i hope.
 
@pHyR3 said:
i think people here are really confusing what backloading is and what used to happen with our club (and may still be happening).

A backloaded deal simply says, we pay brooks 200k this year, 300k 2016, 500k in 2017\. keeping in mind the salary cap is also going up as should his worth/ability as a player.

what happened with players lik fifita, gibbs and beau ryan is we had a contract to pay them (for example) 200k in 2013 and 2014\. if in 2012 we decide no we don't want them, they look for another club. they found the sharks who lets say are prepared to pay 100k. The players MUST receive 200k from somewhere because they have been guarunteed that in the contract. this means we have to now pay 100k out of our cap + 100k will be paid by the sharks from their cap to give them 200k.

now, i dont know whether this is what happened with blair. If a player asks for a release then we don't have to pay them anything.

as for this 'deal' with the NRL. will never happen, simply ridiculous. can you imagine the outcry if we were allowed to breach the cap??? fans would go into meltdown here if it was revealed the sharks were allowed to have a 7 million dollar cap next year and the rest of the NRL get 6.5 million. its our own fault for not managing the cap properly. seems like there have been knock on effects, it should be better in a couple years..i hope.
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You are right in your definition, problem is we did both these things.

Just because a player ask for a release does not mean you won't be paying for part of his contract. If Blair knew the position we were in (i.e desperate to create room in the cap) it would be him in a stronger position when negotiating a release. He could go to the ceo and state that he has found a club that is willing to sign him for next year and he will take the deal as long as the Wests Tigers top up his contract. In Blairs case I actually think the club told him he could look for a deal elsewhere which means we would have had to top up his contact anyway.
 
Riddle me this Salary Cap connoisseurs…Even if we are dim enough to still be paying Blair when he was the one who requested the release ...he was off contract with the WT at the end of this year...Logic tells me we are 600K better off for 2016 right there...

I still maintain if we weren't on the bottom of the ladder we wouldn't be hearing a peep about the Salary Cap...
 
@Geo. said:
Riddle me this Salary Cap connoisseurs…Even if we are dim enough to still be paying Blair when he was the one who requested the release ...he was off contract with the WT at the end of this year...Logic tells me we are 600K better off for 2016 right there...
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Problem being that there seems to be several deals that are increasing (i.e. the aforementioned backloaded deals) from 2015 to 2016, thus negating any overall cap savings.
 
@TYGA said:
This is a tactic to get rid of Farah, Lawrence, Galloway. We are starting the PR war before getting rid of club stall warts. This inept club is very easy to read.
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This makes sense. Its just a PR stunt to spin it. The only players that I think who would be on a tonne with regards to backloaded contracts would be Lawrence, Woods and Robbie.
 
@pHyR3 said:
now, i dont know whether this is what happened with blair. If a player asks for a release then we don't have to pay them anything.
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Everyone though seems to be stating that we are paying out Blair's contract. Why would we be doing that ? It makes no sense to me. Is there any record from the club stating that this is what is occurring.
 
@Geo. said:
Riddle me this Salary Cap connoisseurs…Even if we are dim enough to still be paying Blair when he was the one who requested the release ...he was off contract with the WT at the end of this year...Logic tells me we are 600K better off for 2016 right there...

I still maintain if we weren't on the bottom of the ladder we wouldn't be hearing a peep about the Salary Cap...
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I reckon that this is 100% spot on. I think all this talk is just spin. Plus there is the rumour that the salary cap will be increased.

Are we really in a bad spot or are we in a good spot ?
 
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