Tim Sheens Returns to Tigers

[happy_tiger]

IF sheens has been brought back to spot talent all good and well

But if he has brought out to attract talent ...you will need to print out Tim Sheens Wiki page

Most kids wouldn't have a clue who he is .....

It think it is to develop talent and put the process in place for development once players gets here.

He can be very useful in the right position

I agree

My only problem will be if Madge and the boys go on a losing spree .....having a heap of fans calling for Sheens to come back won't help club unity and might tear the place apart ....again

Yeah that’s my only concern as well. It would be nice though, if we do have another losing spree, Sheens says something positive about Maguire and the process we are going through to quell any unrest.

Day 1
Sheens walks into Madge’s office..
Reaches up to the top shelf ..
Takes down the little black book which has been sitting there for 9 years ..
Dusts off the cover and throws it to Madge and says “ my work is done “
?

Why would the rugby league coaching for dummies help ....

 

[TheDaBoss]

IF sheens has been brought back to spot talent all good and well

But if he has brought out to attract talent ...you will need to print out Tim Sheens Wiki page

Most kids wouldn't have a clue who he is .....

It think it is to develop talent and put the process in place for development once players gets here.

He can be very useful in the right position

I agree

My only problem will be if Madge and the boys go on a losing spree .....having a heap of fans calling for Sheens to come back won't help club unity and might tear the place apart ....again

Yeah that’s my only concern as well. It would be nice though, if we do have another losing spree, Sheens says something positive about Maguire and the process we are going through to quell any unrest.

Day 1
Sheens walks into Madge’s office..
Reaches up to the top shelf ..
Takes down the little black book which has been sitting there for 9 years ..
Dusts off the cover and throws it to Madge and says “ my work is done “
?

Why would the rugby league coaching for dummies help ....

Wouldnt get past the index

 

[BZN]

Over thinking this.

Sheens back in Australia hookong up with one of his old clubs as a consultant and heavyweight in the statesman/ Recruitment area.

This is still the Madge and Hartigan show.

I believe Sheens' influence on the players, especially the younger ones, will be noticeable. His football was always built around positivity, which cannot always be said about Maguire's coaching.

"his football was always built around positivity, which cannot always be said about Maguire's coaching" .
It seems to me that you genuinely know more than the average fan, so I'm interested to know why you say that.

I don't know more than the average supporter. But Sheens was and no doubt still is an innovator. His style of free flowing football could be adapted to the game today. Maguire has struggled to adapt his coaching to the pace of the game today.

Pascoe is a winner and has achieved outstanding results off the field. What is to say he doesn't want to help WTs achieve outstanding results on field? It will improve the bottom line as a business. Certainly the appointment of Sheens has been well received. A winner recognises another winner!

Most of all, I cannot wait until Sheens has a chat with our players, especially our youngsters. He from all accounts is an excellent communicator, an area in which we have been lacking.

I dont know if Madge is a good communicator or not.
What makes you say he is not a good communicator?
And it may well be that Madge was the main man in getting Sheens back to Us.
From what I have heard there has been plenty of instances both here in Oz as well as o/s that the best coaches have sought help in coaching or motivating their **team**.
And that to me suggests a sign of a very good coach ie he is not afraid to ask for the best help available to get the best out of his players.
So I agree with you when you say "a winner recognises another winner" :+1: .

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/tigers-to-re-sign-maguire-but-reynolds-packer-drama-highlights-issues-20200905-p55sre.html

I think the term is 'its behind a paywall'.

Apologies Magpies I didn't realise it was behind a paywall.

[/QUOTE]

You were trying to help.

 

[Russell]

Surprise surprise Buzz on 360 predicting the Sheens signing to be a failure. Kenty and Hoops calling it a good move. Kenty seems to be more reasonable when discussing WT this year. Still gives it to us when it’s deserving which I’m okay with.

Appointing Sheens is wise. The challenge will be listening to him. He was calling the Tigers out for not having a West’s Tigers brand from the ground up. He like many understand that MacArthur - Group 6 area is where the players will come from for the next 20 years. Demographics change and the inner west won’t have many league players in 20 years.

We are always battling this issue due to the nature of the Tigers Magpies merger. Someone at some stage has to throw it all out the window as a footy club it’s obvious where we need to focus. It’s the South Western corridor the place will have a huge population with land subdivisions, new airport etc.

Not sure it can be done without West’s Cambo involvement but it has to be.

Can you point me to the current site/article where Sheens was calling us out please, must have missed that.

 

[TigerWest]

MADGE WELCOMES OLD FRIEND IN TIGERS CAMP
One coach who has no trouble with a new face is the Tigers' Michael Maguire, who will welcome highly-respected veteran Tim Sheens onto his staff with open arms.

The pair go way back - Sheens handed Maguire his top-grade debut as a player way back in 1992 and the pair have always been close.

Sheens won't be a threat to Maguire - his role will be mainly in pathways and development.

The former Kangaroos coach has been working in England for several years but will forever remain a part of Tigers folklore, having delivered the club its lone premiership in such rousing style in 2005.

Sheens won't be back for nearly a month however - he has committed to coaching the 'Exiles' team that plays England in a one-off international in three weeks.

 

[TheDaBoss]

MADGE WELCOMES OLD FRIEND IN TIGERS CAMP
One coach who has no trouble with a new face is the Tigers' Michael Maguire, who will welcome highly-respected veteran Tim Sheens onto his staff with open arms.

The pair go way back - Sheens handed Maguire his top-grade debut as a player way back in 1992 and the pair have always been close.

Sheens won't be a threat to Maguire - his role will be mainly in pathways and development.

The former Kangaroos coach has been working in England for several years but will forever remain a part of Tigers folklore, having delivered the club its lone premiership in such rousing style in 2005.

Sheens won't be back for nearly a month however - he has committed to coaching the 'Exiles' team that plays England in a one-off international in three weeks.

Would be a bit more than month if u count self quarantine

 

[GCfan]

IF sheens has been brought back to spot talent all good and well

But if he has brought out to attract talent ...you will need to print out Tim Sheens Wiki page

Most kids wouldn't have a clue who he is .....

It think it is to develop talent and put the process in place for development once players gets here.

He can be very useful in the right position

I agree

My only problem will be if Madge and the boys go on a losing spree .....having a heap of fans calling for Sheens to come back won't help club unity and might tear the place apart ....again

Yeah that’s my only concern as well. It would be nice though, if we do have another losing spree, Sheens says something positive about Maguire and the process we are going through to quell any unrest.

The key to this rebuild is stability. If Madge, Hartigan and Sheens stick around for another 3+ years, we will see the full effect of what Hartigan and Madge have started.

Agree 100%

X 2

 

[DJG]

Over thinking this.

Sheens back in Australia hookong up with one of his old clubs as a consultant and heavyweight in the statesman/ Recruitment area.

This is still the Madge and Hartigan show.

I believe Sheens' influence on the players, especially the younger ones, will be noticeable. His football was always built around positivity, which cannot always be said about Maguire's coaching.

"his football was always built around positivity, which cannot always be said about Maguire's coaching" .
It seems to me that you genuinely know more than the average fan, so I'm interested to know why you say that.

I don't know more than the average supporter. But Sheens was and no doubt still is an innovator. His style of free flowing football could be adapted to the game today. Maguire has struggled to adapt his coaching to the pace of the game today.

Pascoe is a winner and has achieved outstanding results off the field. What is to say he doesn't want to help WTs achieve outstanding results on field? It will improve the bottom line as a business. Certainly the appointment of Sheens has been well received. A winner recognises another winner!

Most of all, I cannot wait until Sheens has a chat with our players, especially our youngsters. He from all accounts is an excellent communicator, an area in which we have been lacking.

I dont know if Madge is a good communicator or not.
What makes you say he is not a good communicator?
And it may well be that Madge was the main man in getting Sheens back to Us.
From what I have heard there has been plenty of instances both here in Oz as well as o/s that the best coaches have sought help in coaching or motivating their **team**.
And that to me suggests a sign of a very good coach ie he is not afraid to ask for the best help available to get the best out of his players.
So I agree with you when you say "a winner recognises another winner" :+1: .

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/tigers-to-re-sign-maguire-but-reynolds-packer-drama-highlights-issues-20200905-p55sre.html

I think the term is 'its behind a paywall'.

Tigers to re-sign Maguire but Reynolds, Packer drama highlights issues
Michael Chammas
By Michael Chammas
Updated September 6, 2020 — 8.37pmfirst published at 8.12pm
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The Wests Tigers are moving to silence the deafening noise surrounding the tenure of their coach, set to hand Michael Maguire a one year contract extension despite more cause for concern emerging on Sunday.

A week of conjecture around the coach's relationship with his players ended with revelations out-of-favour duo Josh Reynolds and Russell Packer left Saturday night's game against Manly at half time.

Tigers coach Michael Maguire.
Tigers coach Michael Maguire.CREDIT:GETTY

When contacted by the Herald on Sunday night, Reynolds declined to comment. However sources close to the club said Reynolds, whose behaviour was out of character given his reputation as the ultimate team player, was privately fuming over suggestions that he walked out because he couldn't handle the cold.

The five-eighth, despite being told to find a new home on half a dozen occasions, wasn't required to attend the match but turned up to support his teammates, before leaving at half time.

"It's not a good look for two of our players to leave at half time," chairman Lee Hagipantelis told the Herald.

"Strictly speaking, they weren't required to be there. Russell had to warm up with the team as 19th man but Josh didn't even warm up with the team. Both players have acknowledged their action creates a perception, but perception is not reality.

"I have spoken to both of them and they've acknowledge it wasn't a good look. There was no intention on their part to show disrespect or a lack of unity. Russell suffers from an arthritic condition and had multiple surgeries in his foot to try and help him play again. Sitting there in the cold does affect him, that is true."

The players' inability to see out the match in the stands reflects poorly, but again highlights the disconnect that the club wants addressed in the offseason when it sits down with Maguire to map out its plan for the future.

Russell Packer charges into the Eels defence earlier in the year.
Russell Packer charges into the Eels defence earlier in the year.CREDIT:GETTY IMAGES

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The Wests Tigers has been a revolving door of coaches in recent years and the club is determined to make sure Maguire isn't added to the list, with the former South Sydney premiership-winning mentor to be given an extension on his contract despite already being locked in at the joint venture until the end of 2021.

It's an incredible show of faith when you consider the noise surrounding Maguire's tenure at the club. The murmurs of discontent in the playing ranks keep bubbling along, not to mention the fact the Tigers are likely to miss the finals for a second straight year under his watch despite a miraculous come-from-behind win against Manly on Saturday night.

The Tigers would be well within their rights to sit back and see how next year unfolds before making a decision. That's the safe play considering he still has another year to run on his deal and, to put it bluntly, rival clubs are not exactly lining up for his services.

But in a strong message to the players, some of whom are privately questioning whether he is in fact the right man to lead them out of a decade-long finals slumber, the board and executives will in the coming months add another year to Maguire's incumbency.

The Tigers and, for the large part, their success-starved fans, believe Maguire is the right man. They are behind his no-nonsense approach and want him to add a hard edge to a club long regarded for its soft underbelly.

They also know where there's smoke, there's fire. The issue involving Packer and Reynolds is evidence of that. Packer and Reynolds didn't break any rules when they left the game. Some of their teammates who weren't playing didn't even show up at all, but it's a bad look nonetheless.

The players must take responsibility for their poor choices, but there's also an onus on Maguire to evolve in the off-season and address some of the issues with his coaching style that has affected his relationship with several players at his last two clubs.

Task master: Michael Maguire is known for pushing his players hard.
Task master: Michael Maguire is known for pushing his players hard.CREDIT:GETTY

There's a misconception that the issues arise from how hard Maguire trains his players, that they can't stomach his military-like regime. The real problem stems around his communication skills, and a feeling he avoids the tough conversations.

Like when he asked Benji Marshall and Robbie Farah to approach Moses Mbye about stepping away from the captaincy last year, instead of having the conversation himself. Or, just last week, when he struggled to tell Marshall he wasn't required in 2021, asking the veteran playmaker to "give him 24 hours" despite already reaching a decision with the club he wasn't part of their plans going forward.

Maguire has the runs on the board. No one is questioning his rugby league IQ or his ability to prepare a football team. But a generational transition in players has prompted debate over how compatible his philosophies are with the modern-day footballer.

It was evident last year in how he handled Ryan Matterson, a player who came to the club from the Sydney Roosters with a reputation for requiring a cuddle - or three - to get the best out of him. Maguire is from a different school. The type that brings baseball bats and boa constrictors into dressing rooms to get his point across. Mollycoddling delicate footballers is not in his nature.

The Tigers possess a roster built by Ivan Cleary with personalities that suit an Ivan Cleary-coached team. Maguire will get his team in 2022, when the salary cap frees up in the first season of his forthcoming extension, but what he does between now and then will have a huge impact on whether he can attract Maguire-type footballers to the club.

Tigers powerbrokers know the club is not in a position to let quality footballers walk out the door, or turn players off joining, if it can be avoided by the coach learning to relate on a different level. Sometimes a teaspoon of cement isn't the only remedy.

The Tigers possess a roster built by Ivan Cleary with personalities that suit an Ivan Cleary-coached team. Maguire will get his team in 2022, when the salary cap frees up in the first season of his forthcoming extension, but what he does between now and then will have a huge impact on whether he can attract Maguire-type footballers to the club.

There we have it.. 2022 is the year!

 

[Geo]

Over thinking this.

Sheens back in Australia hookong up with one of his old clubs as a consultant and heavyweight in the statesman/ Recruitment area.

This is still the Madge and Hartigan show.

I believe Sheens' influence on the players, especially the younger ones, will be noticeable. His football was always built around positivity, which cannot always be said about Maguire's coaching.

"his football was always built around positivity, which cannot always be said about Maguire's coaching" .
It seems to me that you genuinely know more than the average fan, so I'm interested to know why you say that.

I don't know more than the average supporter. But Sheens was and no doubt still is an innovator. His style of free flowing football could be adapted to the game today. Maguire has struggled to adapt his coaching to the pace of the game today.

Pascoe is a winner and has achieved outstanding results off the field. What is to say he doesn't want to help WTs achieve outstanding results on field? It will improve the bottom line as a business. Certainly the appointment of Sheens has been well received. A winner recognises another winner!

Most of all, I cannot wait until Sheens has a chat with our players, especially our youngsters. He from all accounts is an excellent communicator, an area in which we have been lacking.

I dont know if Madge is a good communicator or not.
What makes you say he is not a good communicator?
And it may well be that Madge was the main man in getting Sheens back to Us.
From what I have heard there has been plenty of instances both here in Oz as well as o/s that the best coaches have sought help in coaching or motivating their **team**.
And that to me suggests a sign of a very good coach ie he is not afraid to ask for the best help available to get the best out of his players.
So I agree with you when you say "a winner recognises another winner" :+1: .

https://www.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/tigers-to-re-sign-maguire-but-reynolds-packer-drama-highlights-issues-20200905-p55sre.html

Packer and Reynolds..Is that it ..with issues in the Dressing Room..the same two blokes who went home cold at half-time..gee if they have a problem with a Coach no matter who.would be rightly pissed off about that and let them know..even if it hurt their feelings..well surprise

 

[TYGA]

Surprise surprise Buzz on 360 predicting the Sheens signing to be a failure. Kenty and Hoops calling it a good move. Kenty seems to be more reasonable when discussing WT this year. Still gives it to us when it’s deserving which I’m okay with.

Appointing Sheens is wise. The challenge will be listening to him. He was calling the Tigers out for not having a West’s Tigers brand from the ground up. He like many understand that MacArthur - Group 6 area is where the players will come from for the next 20 years. Demographics change and the inner west won’t have many league players in 20 years.

We are always battling this issue due to the nature of the Tigers Magpies merger. Someone at some stage has to throw it all out the window as a footy club it’s obvious where we need to focus. It’s the South Western corridor the place will have a huge population with land subdivisions, new airport etc.

Not sure it can be done without West’s Cambo involvement but it has to be.

Doueihi, Seyfarth and Brooks are three examples of our inner west local juniors in the NRL. Nofoaluma is from the South West. We cannot give up on the inner west as it is a gold mine of talent. We move out, Roosters move right in.

Have to cover all areas. You are highlighting the exact issue. We have to develop players from the south west they aren’t just being lost to the Tigers but rugby league. The fact we have juniors kick on from the inner west probably to a greater proportion than the south west tells you that with a bigger nursery we develop fewer players. Has zero to do with where current players came from just shows little to no effort has been made.

 

[cochise]

Surprise surprise Buzz on 360 predicting the Sheens signing to be a failure. Kenty and Hoops calling it a good move. Kenty seems to be more reasonable when discussing WT this year. Still gives it to us when it’s deserving which I’m okay with.

Appointing Sheens is wise. The challenge will be listening to him. He was calling the Tigers out for not having a West’s Tigers brand from the ground up. He like many understand that MacArthur - Group 6 area is where the players will come from for the next 20 years. Demographics change and the inner west won’t have many league players in 20 years.

We are always battling this issue due to the nature of the Tigers Magpies merger. Someone at some stage has to throw it all out the window as a footy club it’s obvious where we need to focus. It’s the South Western corridor the place will have a huge population with land subdivisions, new airport etc.

Not sure it can be done without West’s Cambo involvement but it has to be.

Doueihi, Seyfarth and Brooks are three examples of our inner west local juniors in the NRL. Nofoaluma is from the South West. We cannot give up on the inner west as it is a gold mine of talent. We move out, Roosters move right in.

Have to cover all areas. You are highlighting the exact issue. We have to develop players from the south west they aren’t just being lost to the Tigers but rugby league. The fact we have juniors kick on from the inner west probably to a greater proportion than the south west tells you that with a bigger nursery we develop fewer players. Has zero to do with where current players came from just shows little to no effort has been made.

We have made 3 major appointments to our pathways programs in the last 2 weeks, I am sure that will be addressed.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Surprise surprise Buzz on 360 predicting the Sheens signing to be a failure. Kenty and Hoops calling it a good move. Kenty seems to be more reasonable when discussing WT this year. Still gives it to us when it’s deserving which I’m okay with.

Appointing Sheens is wise. The challenge will be listening to him. He was calling the Tigers out for not having a West’s Tigers brand from the ground up. He like many understand that MacArthur - Group 6 area is where the players will come from for the next 20 years. Demographics change and the inner west won’t have many league players in 20 years.

We are always battling this issue due to the nature of the Tigers Magpies merger. Someone at some stage has to throw it all out the window as a footy club it’s obvious where we need to focus. It’s the South Western corridor the place will have a huge population with land subdivisions, new airport etc.

Not sure it can be done without West’s Cambo involvement but it has to be.

Doueihi, Seyfarth and Brooks are three examples of our inner west local juniors in the NRL. Nofoaluma is from the South West. We cannot give up on the inner west as it is a gold mine of talent. We move out, Roosters move right in.

Have to cover all areas. You are highlighting the exact issue. We have to develop players from the south west they aren’t just being lost to the Tigers but rugby league. The fact we have juniors kick on from the inner west probably to a greater proportion than the south west tells you that with a bigger nursery we develop fewer players. Has zero to do with where current players came from just shows little to no effort has been made.

I remember reading an informative post concerning dysfunction in the Campbelltown juniors. I read our new junior development and recruitment team are making significant improvements in the Campbelltown and Macarthur junior district. If anyone has more information I am interested to learn of our initiatives. As for the inner west, it's important we keep up the hard work in the former Magpie and Balmain junior districts.

 

[Geo]

‘‘There’s been a lot of focus on young Tedesco, **but I’ll be surprised if I start him first game,**’’ Sheens said. ‘‘If he’s a young prize-fighter, you wouldn’t want to throw him into the deep end to any great degree. We just have to be careful there with him but I am impressed with him.’’

Well Sheens did surprise himself because he in fact did Select Tedesco in that 1st Round 2012...Teddy lasted 20mins so the deep end part is true also..

 

[Tragic_Tiger_Fan]

Teddy lasted 20mins so the deep end part is true also…

Deep end?

He did his ACL without a player near him. It was just bad luck.

 

[Lauren]

‘‘There’s been a lot of focus on young Tedesco, **but I’ll be surprised if I start him first game,**’’ Sheens said. ‘‘If he’s a young prize-fighter, you wouldn’t want to throw him into the deep end to any great degree. We just have to be careful there with him but I am impressed with him.’’



Well Sheens did surprise himself because he in fact did Select Tedesco in that 1st Round 2012...Teddy lasted 20mins so the deep end part is true also..

Haha @Geo....wasn't the only irony that wasn't lost on me either.

I've noticed a few of you have always closely followed the junior divisions and while I personally knew none of this - about the longevity of success, or how Sheens was fundamental to it.
( I remember discussions in the preseason with @cochise @pawsandclaws and a few others about this particular subject).
So it highly fascinates me.
And especially as we're currently seeing Penrith reap the rewards for something we'd similarly shared in vision.
These articles confirm that the club was once the biggest talent hotbed in the NRL and seeing how things are going now, it looks promising we can back there.

 

[Shubert]

:grinning:

 

[cochise]

‘‘There’s been a lot of focus on young Tedesco, **but I’ll be surprised if I start him first game,**’’ Sheens said. ‘‘If he’s a young prize-fighter, you wouldn’t want to throw him into the deep end to any great degree. We just have to be careful there with him but I am impressed with him.’’



Well Sheens did surprise himself because he in fact did Select Tedesco in that 1st Round 2012...Teddy lasted 20mins so the deep end part is true also..

Haha @Geo....wasn't the only irony that wasn't lost on me either.

I've noticed a few of you have always closely followed the junior divisions and while I personally knew none of this - about the longevity of success, or how Sheens was fundamental to it.
( I remember discussions in the preseason with @cochise @pawsandclaws and a few others about this particular subject).
So it highly fascinates me.
And especially as we're currently seeing Penrith reap the rewards for something we'd similarly shared in vision.
These articles confirm that the club was once the biggest talent hotbed in the NRL and seeing how things are going now, it looks promising we can back there.

We threw the baby out with the bathwater after the "Big 4" debacle.

 

[tony soprano]

Hopefully they give him some media time would love to hear from him again

 

[TYGA]

Surprise surprise Buzz on 360 predicting the Sheens signing to be a failure. Kenty and Hoops calling it a good move. Kenty seems to be more reasonable when discussing WT this year. Still gives it to us when it’s deserving which I’m okay with.

Appointing Sheens is wise. The challenge will be listening to him. He was calling the Tigers out for not having a West’s Tigers brand from the ground up. He like many understand that MacArthur - Group 6 area is where the players will come from for the next 20 years. Demographics change and the inner west won’t have many league players in 20 years.

We are always battling this issue due to the nature of the Tigers Magpies merger. Someone at some stage has to throw it all out the window as a footy club it’s obvious where we need to focus. It’s the South Western corridor the place will have a huge population with land subdivisions, new airport etc.

Not sure it can be done without West’s Cambo involvement but it has to be.

Doueihi, Seyfarth and Brooks are three examples of our inner west local juniors in the NRL. Nofoaluma is from the South West. We cannot give up on the inner west as it is a gold mine of talent. We move out, Roosters move right in.

Have to cover all areas. You are highlighting the exact issue. We have to develop players from the south west they aren’t just being lost to the Tigers but rugby league. The fact we have juniors kick on from the inner west probably to a greater proportion than the south west tells you that with a bigger nursery we develop fewer players. Has zero to do with where current players came from just shows little to no effort has been made.

We have made 3 major appointments to our pathways programs in the last 2 weeks, I am sure that will be addressed.

Hope we do make progress with pathways it looks positive.

 

[jirskyr]

Surprise surprise Buzz on 360 predicting the Sheens signing to be a failure. Kenty and Hoops calling it a good move. Kenty seems to be more reasonable when discussing WT this year. Still gives it to us when it’s deserving which I’m okay with.

Appointing Sheens is wise. The challenge will be listening to him. He was calling the Tigers out for not having a West’s Tigers brand from the ground up. He like many understand that MacArthur - Group 6 area is where the players will come from for the next 20 years. Demographics change and the inner west won’t have many league players in 20 years.

We are always battling this issue due to the nature of the Tigers Magpies merger. Someone at some stage has to throw it all out the window as a footy club it’s obvious where we need to focus. It’s the South Western corridor the place will have a huge population with land subdivisions, new airport etc.

Not sure it can be done without West’s Cambo involvement but it has to be.

Doueihi, Seyfarth and Brooks are three examples of our inner west local juniors in the NRL. Nofoaluma is from the South West. We cannot give up on the inner west as it is a gold mine of talent. We move out, Roosters move right in.

Have to cover all areas. You are highlighting the exact issue. We have to develop players from the south west they aren’t just being lost to the Tigers but rugby league. The fact we have juniors kick on from the inner west probably to a greater proportion than the south west tells you that with a bigger nursery we develop fewer players. Has zero to do with where current players came from just shows little to no effort has been made.

I don't think it follows that because we have more Balmain juniors "kicking on" (for example in first grade (3) vs Macarthur (1)) that we necessarily have a lack of development or loss of footballers in Macarthur. Pretty long bow to draw and you'd need far more data over time.

According to SMH last month, Western Suburbs in 2021 has less registered male tackle league participants (they don't break down by age group) than Penrith, Parramatta, Cronulla and Canterbury districts (currently about 2500 registered). Balmain has ~1800 registered. Penrith has ~7400 registered.

So despite what anyone might say about "boom nurseries", the numbers of actual players in the Wests Suburbs district is Top 5 in Sydney at best, and **very** substantially less than Penrith and Parramatta.

I honestly think, without actually having oversight or direct involvement in top-level Wests Juniors region, it's very hard to speculate about what Tigers and Magpies are / are not doing right, especially compared to Balmain.

I can tell you I asked Pascoe a few months ago how he would respond to a hypothetical argument that Wests Tigers aren't doing enough to engage / support the Macarthur. He proceeded to rattle off a number of initiatives they'd done (I don't recall the list in detail, the conversation moved on, but he had stats e.g. number of schools visited) and asked if I wanted a larger list. I really should have said yes, but I instead I made a point that Tigers and Magpies should probably advertise their activities more aggressively so people were informed about what the club was actually doing.