Uncoached

@ said:
@ said:
We haven't got the cattle. Plain and simple.

Same cattle as last year, that cant be an answer when comparing what Cleary had done since taking over. Im asking what has the new coach done to improve this squad? The same squad Taylor had has gone backwards in a big way under Cleary
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How is it the same cattle as last year? Moses gone, Simona gone, Farah gone, JAC gone, Halatau gone, Sironen gone.

Tedesco and Woods and Ava going, that never helps form in a struggling side.

Lawrence long-term injury, Aloiai long-term injury, Brooks recurring injury, Idris gone for season. Tedesco misses 3 out of the last 5 games.

The starting backline this evening Naiqama-Nofo-Marsters-Suli-MWZ-Lolohea-Brooks, super inexperienced. 3 of those blokes haven't played first grade before, 2 of them weren't even at the club a few weeks ago and there's little argument that there are not better options available in reserve grade or 20s.

I don't know if Cleary can do the job long-term but this is not a good side right now, and Gould highlighted it, possibly half the current roster won't be there next year and they know it.

And frankly KS your OP, "5/8th doesn't touch the ball all game"? Serious? He touched it too often, how often did Brooks pass to Lolo on tackle 5?
 
@ said:
Umm..I started this 2 weeks ago and got howled down..so good luck Sirro..

It's the roster..

I don't think Cleary has done much with the current squad and left it to the assistants as he is concentrating on…'Next Year'
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Are you suggesting Cleary doesn't have the 'ticker' to be able to concentrate on more than just 'Next Year'?? If so, bit of a worry as Gus let him go because he felt he was in need of a rest when things fell apart at the Panthers and Cleary wasn't coping too well.
 
@ said:
We haven't got the cattle. Plain and simple.
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It's largely the same cattle as last year and that team should've taken us into the semis….so I disagree we don't have the cattle ... they are just not coached right
 
@ said:
@ said:
We haven't got the cattle. Plain and simple.

Same cattle as last year, that cant be an answer when comparing what Cleary had done since taking over. Im asking what has the new coach done to improve this squad? The same squad Taylor had has gone backwards in a big way under Cleary
Click to expand...
Click to expand...

X2
 
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@ said:
Brooks is so out of form he cant even run to the line without falling over!

It is a huge worry that he is going to be our halfback for next season. He has the odd good game where it looks like he is finally going to hit his straps, but then goes straight back to playing like a rookie again. Overall he is a bog average halfback and this is who we are relying on to guide us around the park. And I don't think the addition of Reynolds will do much to help the situation either, just look how well he is going with the bog average Mbye now!
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I can only hope when the prima donnas are gone that and the new recruits arrive, that Brooks will find his feet. Otherwise we have another problem for 2018 we dont need.
 
Someone made a good point earlier about half of them not being there next year and they know it. I'm talking about your Naiqama's and your Lovett's. Wouldn't surprise me if Cleary has told the remaining unsigned players that they won't be required. There's no incentive to perform. A season that started out with so much optimism has turned into a nightmare. Going to be a long summer.
 
@ said:
@ said:
@ said:
We haven't got the cattle. Plain and simple.

Same cattle as last year, that cant be an answer when comparing what Cleary had done since taking over. Im asking what has the new coach done to improve this squad? The same squad Taylor had has gone backwards in a big way under Cleary

How is it the same cattle as last year? Moses gone, Simona gone, Farah gone, JAC gone, Halatau gone, Sironen gone.

Tedesco and Woods and Ava going, that never helps form in a struggling side.

Lawrence long-term injury, Aloiai long-term injury, Brooks recurring injury, Idris gone for season. Tedesco misses 3 out of the last 5 games.

The starting backline this evening Naiqama-Nofo-Marsters-Suli-MWZ-Lolohea-Brooks, super inexperienced. 3 of those blokes haven't played first grade before, 2 of them weren't even at the club a few weeks ago and there's little argument that there are not better options available in reserve grade or 20s.

I don't know if Cleary can do the job long-term but this is not a good side right now, and Gould highlighted it, possibly half the current roster won't be there next year and they know it.

And frankly KS your OP, "5/8th doesn't touch the ball all game"? Serious? He touched it too often, how often did Brooks pass to Lolo on tackle 5?
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Yep I agree jirskyr. Attack the full strength side when it gets beat all you like but slamming tonights and last week's 17 is futile, they are what they are and most are trying.
 
I think its worth remembering ….

Round 2 - 36-2 Penrith
Round 3 - 46-6 Raiders
Round 4 - 22-14 Storm
Round 5 - 28-6 Dragon's

This was all before the super 3 got a bee under their bonnet.

Essentially I see no evidence that Cleary has taken the club backwards. I can think of 4 games now we could of won. Why didn't Moses take the kick in front when we were 12 up against Parra is a good example.

I see a lot of young players going pretty good and a bunch of seasoned players about to join them next year with close to $3m still to spend in our cap.

Hang in there ....
 
You know it makes sense now.
Why IC got moved on from Penrith.
And then Gus's comments prior to our appointment about how IC would be perfect for us but not necessarily the other way around.
Gus suggested that IC should coach a well established side.
Could that have been a hint that for IC to be successful as a coach that he needs a team that has already established players and instead of being a technically sound coach his more of a man manager.
In comparison to successful coaches, IC could be more of a Wayne Bennett than a Des Hasler.
That being said it comes as no surprise that the bulk of our recruitment has been for experienced proven players not talented up and comers.
Ivan will be focusing one would think on trying to improve the attitudes and temperaments of these players.
And would be starting on that since his appointment.
As far a tactically coaching we'll maybe we should wait and see the team that we have finally assembled next year.
If we finish this year with managing to go at least more than 2 repeat sets on our line without having our line breached than that would be a huge improvment.
And no tactical coaching is going to get that result. A bit of fitness and a lot of belief bestowed upon the side will get us there.
 
@ said:
It's quite simply the cattle that we have. Cleary has said from the beginning that he wasn't planning on making his mark on the team during this year, instead he would tweak a few of Taylor's tactics i.e Rushing Defence, positional changes etc. The cattle that Jason Taylor assembled were to suit his tactics and they simply were not good enough, and Cleary has his eyes set on long term success and culture change, which isn't going to happen in 3 months. As well as this, the win against the cowboys, the game against Parra that we let go, as well as the game against Cronulla where we were in the game for 60 minutes at Leichhardt were all signs that under Cleary that we are an improved side, it's just going to take time.

As for Brooks the boy is going to have a rough time this season. Woods was really the only forward that stood up tonight and we have a pathetic bench that lacks both experience and power that will change next year. He's being relied on to kick on last every time down that left corridor which is killing him and making him look one dimensional and would look better roving across the field, especially with Tui's best game being when he takes the line on. Next year with a partner in Reynolds as well as a superior forward pack and a pre season under IC the boy will thrive. No one came close to him in Junior ranks, and both his representative honours as well as his debut shows that he has the talent, but he will be guided. Once we have Matulino, Packer, McQueen and hopefully another backrower and front rower punching through the middle Brooks will be the halfback that not only takes control, but becomes the source of our points for years to come.

It's going to take time, it always was. Cleary has only put the broom through the kitchen, he's got plenty of the house to go. WTTID.
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I don't share your optimism in regards to Brooks, how is having different players around him going to improve his last tackle options and execution of kicks? He's a dud and other players aren't going to change that, it's not current players fault that Brooks can't finish a set with a decent kick, it's Brooks inability to.
 
Brooks is fast running out of excuses. I'm optimistic more than I am expecting that having Reynolds next to him next year will be the tonic he needs. If he's still struggling this time next year then it's time to pull the plug.
 
BREAKING BAD HERE: I think Cleary is Smart. He is telling the players he is keeping to stay solid. He is telling those that are going to do their thing …or be wasted. I think that he got Twal here mid season is cool. Our forwards lack size this year! 2018 Might be closer than you think!
 
Cleary will get his first trophy next week - Longest Losing Streak for Wests Tigers

He is very intelligent though. Apparently he completed the NY Times Crossword by the 72nd minute this week up in the box.

"Next Year" Sirro, Next Year.
 
@ said:
Say what you want…if things don't improve next year, I'm out.

No finals series in 8 years is a joke and I don't want any part of it. Done with the game.
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You may not find that as easy as you think
 
@ said:
Say what you want…if things don't improve next year, I'm out.

No finals series in 8 years is a joke and I don't want any part of it. Done with the game.
Click to expand...

You may not find that as easy as you think
 
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