West Tigers cannot match it with top teams

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shano

New member
Good article from fox sports.. could not have said it better myself.. Any thoughts???

Wests Tigers are struggling to make the NRL top eight because they cannot match it with top teams

By David Weiner
FOX SPORTS
August 30, 2012 1:30PM

Wests Tigers, the NRL's pre-season premiership favourites, don't have their destiny in their hands on the weekend because they're not good enough to beat the competition's best teams –and that's a statistical fact.

The inquisition into the Tigers’ dismal season has only just started. Is Tim Sheens the right man to coach the club? Should Benji Marshall remain at No.7? Should the side even bother playing without Robbie Farah? Was Adam Blair the competition’s worst signing this season?

But simply, one of the most talented rosters in the NRL cannot shy away from the raw data.

It makes for embarrassing reading for a side boasting some of the game’s most high profile stars, a summary of season that Fox Sports rugby league expert Matthew Johns labelled "incredibly poor" and "unacceptable".

The bulk of the Tigers’ wins have come against Parramatta (twice), Penrith (twice), St George Illawarra, Gold Coast Titans and Melbourne Storm, without their State of Origin stars.

The only wins against top-eight sides, at full strength, have been: Cronulla in round one (17-16 at Leichhardt in a contentious golden point game), North Queensland in round 12 (at Campbelltown Stadium) and against Canberra the week after, in arguably the most entertaining showing of their season.

"Even if they made the eight, I don’t think they could trouble anyone this year," Greg Alexander said on NRL on FOX on Wednesday night. "They’re not the side they were last year and I don’t think they really worry sides. If they do sneak in somehow, they won’t do anything. But I don’t think they’ll make it."

Matthew Johns added: "They’re alibi was always: 'last year we managed to win eight in a row and we’ll manage to do that again'.

"But there’s an attitude that they are a hugely talented side - but that’s the problem.

"They believe their talent and trust it too much; it’s brought them undone and it’s why they find themselves in this position.

"To be beaten by 44-8, with 10 minutes to go, in a game they needed to win, you say: what’s going on."

Indeed, attitude and failing to complete the ‘one per cent’ plays have dogged the Tigers this term.

The NRL on FOX panel identified an example of the side’s lamentable approach to kick-chase, showing an incident against Canterbury-Bankstown in round 24, which Alexander says is symptomatic of poor attitude.

"I guess it’s alarming because all week Tim Sheens would’ve been talking about kick-chase on Ben Barba – that’s all you talk about when you’re up against him," he said. "Obviously there wasn’t enough effort there. "There was a 20m gap between Aaron Woods and the next player."

Will there be a fall guy for the poor season? News Limited rugby league journalist Paul Kent was the most critical of two of the club’s biggest names: Sheens and Benji Marshall.

"For years we said this was Benji Marshall’s team but it’s not, it’s Robbie Farah’s," Kent said during the Controversy Corner segment.

"Benji Marshall came out at the start of the year and said it was my year … where’s Benji been?

"Of course (Tim Sheens is under pressure); he’s made three semi-final series in 15 years.
 
@shano said:
Good article from fox sports.. could not have said it better myself.. Any thoughts???

Wests Tigers are struggling to make the NRL top eight because they cannot match it with top teams

By David Weiner
FOX SPORTS
August 30, 2012 1:30PM

Wests Tigers, the NRL's pre-season premiership favourites, don't have their destiny in their hands on the weekend because they're not good enough to beat the competition's best teams –and that's a statistical fact.

The inquisition into the Tigers’ dismal season has only just started. Is Tim Sheens the right man to coach the club? Should Benji Marshall remain at No.7? Should the side even bother playing without Robbie Farah? Was Adam Blair the competition’s worst signing this season?

But simply, one of the most talented rosters in the NRL cannot shy away from the raw data.

It makes for embarrassing reading for a side boasting some of the game’s most high profile stars, a summary of season that Fox Sports rugby league expert Matthew Johns labelled "incredibly poor" and "unacceptable".

The bulk of the Tigers’ wins have come against Parramatta (twice), Penrith (twice), St George Illawarra, Gold Coast Titans and Melbourne Storm, without their State of Origin stars.

The only wins against top-eight sides, at full strength, have been: Cronulla in round one (17-16 at Leichhardt in a contentious golden point game), North Queensland in round 12 (at Campbelltown Stadium) and against Canberra the week after, in arguably the most entertaining showing of their season.

"Even if they made the eight, I don’t think they could trouble anyone this year," Greg Alexander said on NRL on FOX on Wednesday night. "They’re not the side they were last year and I don’t think they really worry sides. If they do sneak in somehow, they won’t do anything. But I don’t think they’ll make it."

Matthew Johns added: "They’re alibi was always: 'last year we managed to win eight in a row and we’ll manage to do that again'.

"But there’s an attitude that they are a hugely talented side - but that’s the problem.

"They believe their talent and trust it too much; it’s brought them undone and it’s why they find themselves in this position.

"To be beaten by 44-8, with 10 minutes to go, in a game they needed to win, you say: what’s going on."

Indeed, attitude and failing to complete the ‘one per cent’ plays have dogged the Tigers this term.

The NRL on FOX panel identified an example of the side’s lamentable approach to kick-chase, showing an incident against Canterbury-Bankstown in round 24, which Alexander says is symptomatic of poor attitude.

"I guess it’s alarming because all week Tim Sheens would’ve been talking about kick-chase on Ben Barba – that’s all you talk about when you’re up against him," he said. "Obviously there wasn’t enough effort there. "There was a 20m gap between Aaron Woods and the next player."

Will there be a fall guy for the poor season? News Limited rugby league journalist Paul Kent was the most critical of two of the club’s biggest names: Sheens and Benji Marshall.

"For years we said this was Benji Marshall’s team but it’s not, it’s Robbie Farah’s," Kent said during the Controversy Corner segment.

"Benji Marshall came out at the start of the year and said it was my year … where’s Benji been?

"Of course (Tim Sheens is under pressure); he’s made three semi-final series in 15 years.
Click to expand...

I always hate it when journos bag us, but EVERYTHING highlighted is fact. Sadly, they got it right.
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Yeah i read this a moment ago. It's really hard to find fault in the article. You get the feeling the club is going to feel a lot more pressure of this sort in the coming weeks and into next season. Regardless of what happens saturday night. We are learning the fact that when you put together a good package, results are a must. Expectations are large. When they are not met, this is the downside. The pressure increases.
 
It's also interesting to note the comments of Matt Johns. I know a lot of people don't have him in their good books for ambushing Farah but from where i sit. He's not said anything that wasn't true. Yes, it may've been hard to hear and particularly earlier in the season, but sitting here at the end of season looking back, his comments have been well and truly backed up.

Again here Johns has touched on a good point when he talks about their attitude. They know they can score the points, and yes cool heads should prevail and the game plan kept to. But that IS the very problem. The attitude is too focused on scoring points. I can't understand why when we have as much natural attacking flair as we do in the likes of Marshall, Farah, Lawrence and now Koroibete for example, why we spend so much time focusing on our attack. Defence should be the foundation. We haven't been able to consistently defend under Sheens. If i'm right, the best defence we've ever ever managed is about middle of the field over a season, no higher.
 
We can barely match it with the bottom sides

How did anyone expect we would match it with the top sides

Find out what Melbourne is paying 19+ and get on it
 
This is a good sign for the club if you ask me. I wanted him gone at the end of 08 after he had missed the finals for three years running after clinching the title. 4 more seasons on and another 2 years of missed finals, it is well and truly time.

Many fans have commented on our poor game plans, preparations, selections and form for years now. This is very rarely reflected in the media. However the tide is changing. Articles are starting to appear, comments are being made on radio and tv….the ball is in motion people. It has taken a long time but the views of us disgruntled supporters are becoming the voices of the media.

This has to happen. 2013 will be another write off unless we install a new coaching regime....it is about the only thing that will get me excited about season 2013 unless there are some marque signings coming....
 
Surely, his career will be talked about over the Summer. Somethings will change for next year, we can be sure of that. The media are in on it, the board are in on it. It'll be time that tells this story.
 
I read this at work earlier and like most here I thought it was an accurate depiction. I only hope that all the negative media attention lately translates into some drastic changes otherwise my jerseys will be staying in the cupboard next year.
 
This is music to my ears, this constant press must be hitting home with the people who count. Why has it taken so long, the writing has been on the wall for years. Every year since Sheens has been in charge we have had a very poor record against the top six sides and most of our wins have been against the minows
 
Great article and good posts..
Yeh, even if at the very least the coach makes changes… Im sure most Of us would have been ok if at least things were put in place. It's just it's now at the point where it's too late... Changes won't happen and thus we need a change of coach.
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Statistics will paint an alarming picture at the end of the season. For starters the Tiger miss far too many tackles and concede far too many line breaks. This is turn regularly puts the defence on the backfoot as they are always scrambling to try and get back in position. And the Tigers have played side-to-side far too often this year, making little yardage and continually doing it tough out of their own end.

Benji may well lead the comp in try assists and line break assists, he's also lacked a lot of options outside of him this season too, with a lack of pace out wide being a notable concern. Take a look at the backend of the season when Koroibete was given a shot, and surprise surprise, he has 7 tries in 5 games.

Then there's the lack of aggression in the forward pack. Blair was supposed to bring that with him from the Storm. I guess it was lost in transit. Woods has been excellent, as has Farah. Galloway has been solid when not injured, as has Fulton. Heighno had a poor start to the season but his form towards the backend has picked up, while the team has definitely missed Ellis for a large part of the season. The forward pack can only be described as workmanlike.

The backline, well it has also failed to deliver. Benji has had some good games, and quite a few poor ones. His ballplaying may have improved, but his running game has diminished and he's always good for an error or two each game. Lawrence and Ayshford, who were one of the stronger centre pairings last season have both gone backwards - Lawrence due to injury and playing injured for most of the season, while Ayshford just looks half asleep at times. Tuqiri has once again had an injury plagued season, while Utai has been good, offering great punch on kick returns, but still susceptible to cross-field kicks and bombs. Beau Ryan has had a good season overall while Moltzen has been disappointing, failing to re-capture his form of 2009, as well as the backend of 2011, offering little in the way of kick returns and general support play. When played in the halves he has offered very little in attack, with no kicking game to write home about.

The bench is always contentious and has been hit and miss. Ben Murdoch-Masila deserves more game time as he offers genuine impact and is a great wide running option close to the line. Matt Bell has been excellent defensively but needs to work more on hitting the ball up, as he's actually not bad. Junior Moors has been given few opportunities but has shown promise in some games, while Ray Cashmere is decent in defence, but has not offered much in the way of go forward. Tom Humble, Joel Reddy and Masda Iosefa have all shown glimpses, but are anything but consistent and have turned in some absolute howlers, particularly in defence.
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Some big decisions need to be made at the end of this season, which I suspect is just a couple of day away, and some major overhauls are required if the Tigers are to improve next season. Right now we are watching a side on a downward spiral after showing genuine promise over the last 2 seasons, and changes need to be made, both in the coaching and performance staff, down to the players. The Tigers need a brand new attitude.

As it currently stands, I think we'll struggle to make the 8 next year, and my expectations will certainly be curbed after witnessing what can only be described as some completely inept performances this season.
 
@stryker said:
This is a good sign for the club if you ask me. I wanted him gone at the end of 08 after he had missed the finals for three years running after clinching the title. 4 more seasons on and another 2 years of missed finals, it is well and truly time.

Many fans have commented on our poor game plans, preparations, selections and form for years now. This is very rarely reflected in the media. However the tide is changing. Articles are starting to appear, comments are being made on radio and tv….the ball is in motion people. It has taken a long time but the views of us disgruntled supporters are becoming the voices of the media.

This has to happen. 2013 will be another write off unless we install a new coaching regime....it is about the only thing that will get me excited about season 2013 unless there are some marque signings coming....
Click to expand...

I, also wanted Sheens gone back then..What people are seeing now, with Sheens and his selections and decision making, was happening in those years.

I agree with everything you say..but , as I have said elsewhere on this Forum today, sadly I dont see changes next year.
 
@willow said:
Statistics will paint an alarming picture at the end of the season. For starters the Tiger miss far too many tackles and concede far too many line breaks. This is turn regularly puts the defence on the backfoot as they are always scrambling to try and get back in position. And the Tigers have played side-to-side far too often this year, making little yardage and continually doing it tough out of their own end.

Benji may well lead the comp in try assists and line break assists, he's also lacked a lot of options outside of him this season too, with a lack of pace out wide being a notable concern. Take a look at the backend of the season when Koroibete was given a shot, and surprise surprise, he has 7 tries in 5 games.

Then there's the lack of aggression in the forward pack. Blair was supposed to bring that with him from the Storm. I guess it was lost in transit. Woods has been excellent, as has Farah. Galloway has been solid when not injured, as has Fulton. Heighno had a poor start to the season but his form towards the backend has picked up, while the team has definitely missed Ellis for a large part of the season. The forward pack can only be described as workmanlike.

The backline, well it has also failed to deliver. Benji has had some good games, and quite a few poor ones. His ballplaying may have improved, but his running game has diminished and he's always good for an error or two each game. Lawrence and Ayshford, who were one of the stronger centre pairings last season have both gone backwards - Lawrence due to injury and playing injured for most of the season, while Ayshford just looks half asleep at times. Tuqiri has once again had an injury plagued season, while Utai has been good, offering great punch on kick returns, but still susceptible to cross-field kicks and bombs. Beau Ryan has had a good season overall while Moltzen has been disappointing, failing to re-capture his form of 2009, as well as the backend of 2011, offering little in the way of kick returns and general support play. When played in the halves he has offered very little in attack, with no kicking game to write home about.

The bench is always contentious and has been hit and miss. Ben Murdoch-Masila deserves more game time as he offers genuine impact and is a great wide running option close to the line. Matt Bell has been excellent defensively but needs to work more on hitting the ball up, as he's actually not bad. Junior Moors has been given few opportunities but has shown promise in some games, while Ray Cashmere is decent in defence, but has not offered much in the way of go forward. Tom Humble, Joel Reddy and Masda Iosefa have all shown glimpses, but are anything but consistent and have turned in some absolute howlers, particularly in defence.
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Some big decisions need to be made at the end of this season, which I suspect is just a couple of day away, and some major overhauls are required if the Tigers are to improve next season. Right now we are watching a side on a downward spiral after showing genuine promise over the last 2 seasons, and changes need to be made, both in the coaching and performance staff, down to the players. The Tigers need a brand new attitude.

As it currently stands, I think we'll struggle to make the 8 next year, and my expectations will certainly be curbed after witnessing what can only be described as some completely inept performances this season.
Click to expand...

Mate, that's a fantastic summary! You should send it into the daily rags and get it published - it's better than most of what they write.
 
Only 2/3 more days and we'll be forgotten for 2012, Sheens and the boys can get smashed on Mon, go for a holiday, breath easy…relax like theyve done all year then brush up on the gunna articles round November or so.
 
There'll be a bit more media interest about the disappointing Tigers after Saturday and then you won't hear a thing about the Tigers as all the attention goes to the finals. We'll hear about the token effort by management in restructuring the coaching regime (bringing Royce Simmons back into the fold) and then we'll start to see interviews with players saying how they have "unfinished business" from 2012, how this is is the toughest pre-season training any of them have ever encountered and how excited they are to have our new signings on board (more forwards) and away we go again. I really like and respect Sheens but alas, without a new coach, a specialist halfback and 2 aggressive mongrel front rowers that love smashing people, alas, nothing will change.
 
So happy to finally see these articles… Would love to see our defence fixed!!!
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