Wests Tigers have an identity crisis
- Thread starter Gary_Bakerloo
- Start date
@Goose said:
We used to play teams in the Manly comp (this is in the late 80s/early 90s). They didn't have a lot of teams but some of them were very good. Narrabeen and Manly Cove (aka Christian Brothers Manly in our comp) were good teams. Forrestville Ferrets were crap, Belrose and Naraweena (from memory) were average. They are the teams I recall anyway.
Tiger_Watto
New member
I feel Keebra Park offers a great transition for the kids from across the ditch, as the lifestyle is no where as congested/fast-paced as in Sydney, plus it has close links with the QAS Rugby League Program….
happy_tiger
Well-known member
@Tiger Watto said:
And they can become Qlders most importantly :wink:
Gary_Bakerloo
New member
@Goose said:
Every NRL club has juniors, the difference is size. The Manly junior area is one of the smallest. In saying that, the Manly area has close to the largest junior football (aka soccer) areas in the state.
@happy tiger said:
You don't need to have lived in Queensland to play SOO for Queensland! You should know that by now Happy!!
Junior talent pools are still important part of an NRL club, however I think engaging with the public in our traditional areas is a far more serious issue. I am all for WT spending time and money on juniors, but I think they should be spending the same if not more resources on engaging the kids in our heartland communities.
The last thing I want is to see kids in Balmain or Campbelltown following teams like Pawwa or Easts.
The last thing I want is to see kids in Balmain or Campbelltown following teams like Pawwa or Easts.
jirskyr
Well-known member
@Alf Duguid said:
Not necessarily, if we maintain close links and funding with Keebra. The arrangement is reciprocal - both Tigers and the school identify talent to enrol and develop in the school. We would have to actively remove support for Keebra or be "outbid" by the Titans. They can just set up their own school arrangements.
innsaneink
Well-known member
@Goose said:
More clubs than Balmain & Noths and the same size as Cronullas JL, and 2 short of the Dogs
happy_tiger
Well-known member
@Yossarian said:
It stops the incessant bleating from you Mexicans south of the border Yoss
If you can't beat em join em
Your more than welcome Yoss and any other of you Mexicans who want to be winners and grinners
The only initiation involved is kissing the feet of the Wally Lewis and Darren Lockyer statues
Gary_Bakerloo
New member
Follow up article:
**What’s really happening in Sydney’s south west?**
Last Monday, I sat down with Wests Tigers Chief Executive Officer Stephen Humphreys and Senior Manager for Communications and Membership, Robyn Danzey.
It was never going to be anything more than a chat and a chance for the Tigers to explain themselves after a story of mine got their attention.
To say the Tigers are in a tight spot regarding the management of rugby league in south-west Sydney is an understatement. After speaking with Mr. Humphreys, I can honestly say that I believe him when he says they are doing all they can right now to help the district. Their hands are well and truly tied.
Mr. Humphreys is obviously an intelligent man and his heart is in the right place. And considering the great contribution his father made to the game, I wouldn’t doubt that for a second. I could tell on Monday that he was frustrated with the view some in the Macarthur region had taken against the Wests Tigers.
Hence the invitation they sent me.
“There should be no doubt in anyone’s mind that the management of our game in south-west Sydney needs to be the top priority – from grassroots through to the elite level,” Humphreys said.
“In a strategic sense, the area is just too important to receive anything other than top billing. At the moment, there are a number of separate bodies involved in managing the interests of the game and its participants across south west Sydney and despite all of their best endeavours, the efforts are uncoordinated and rather dysfunctional.
“I understand that there is an expectation for Wests Tigers to play the lead role as the strong NRL brand in the region. While we are ready to take on this additional responsibility, there would need to be a significant change to the structures and processes that are currently in place to allow this to happen.”
Therein lies the problem. Currently we have the Wests Magpies, the Wests Junior League, the NSWRL, the Country Rugby League and Group Six (juniors and seniors) all involved in the management of rugby league in south-west Sydney. Clearly there is a case for change and streamlining of the game’s administration across the region.
Lets get one thing clear. Over the year my stance on the Wests Magpies has changed. For the sake of the Wests Tigers and growth as a club, there is no place for the Magpies at a senior level in 2012.
That is very hard to say for an old Magpie supporter like myself.
The Wests Magpies NSW Cup side is being run this season at a cost of $500,000 which is funded by Wests Ashfield Leagues Club. The Magpies are 0-16 with a for and against of 172-910\. That’s half a million dollars for the people playing at home.
An overhaul is required and loyalties need to die for business to prosper. It is the coldest truth, but that’s what has to happen. In this modern world, good business is loyalty.
My problem is with growth of the game in Macarthur. I told Mr. Humphreys that I felt that the massive nursery in sydney south-west was being left behind and there wasn’t enough work being done in the area. That the Wests Tigers shouldn’t be content in being number one in the region, but to “take it by the balls”.
What people may not know is that the Western Suburbs Magpies actually have no ties with the junior league. The junior league runs itself. When the Magpies came to Campbelltown in the 1980s, they didn’t align themselves with the junior league. So the junior league got themselves an ABN. To my knowledge this is the only junior league in Sydney that runs as a public company.
WSDJRL don’t answer to anyone. They are a law unto themselves. Who decided these people have the honour of running the game our kids play?
While we don’t agree on everything, Mr. Humphreys and I did agree that the junior system and its programmes needed to be streamlined so that the kids and administrators alike had a simple understanding of what the future holds. That can’t happen under the current structure.
The Wests Tigers continue to do good things for the Macarthur through their charity programmes and continued construction around the Campbelltown Stadium precinct. The club has declared its intention to base the under-20s youth side in the Macarthur area. This is a big step in the right direction and signals the commitment to continually grow the profile and presence of the Club in the region.
But the problem is the continued erosion of what should be a juggernaut. Rugby league in Macarthur will never die, but people sure are trying to hurt it. The Wests Tigers need total control to make this work.
Geographically, the Wests Tigers are blessed and cursed to have the supporter boundaries they have. The sooner people are educated about who and what is happening, the quicker they will side with the Wests Tigers.
**What’s really happening in Sydney’s south west?**
Last Monday, I sat down with Wests Tigers Chief Executive Officer Stephen Humphreys and Senior Manager for Communications and Membership, Robyn Danzey.
It was never going to be anything more than a chat and a chance for the Tigers to explain themselves after a story of mine got their attention.
To say the Tigers are in a tight spot regarding the management of rugby league in south-west Sydney is an understatement. After speaking with Mr. Humphreys, I can honestly say that I believe him when he says they are doing all they can right now to help the district. Their hands are well and truly tied.
Mr. Humphreys is obviously an intelligent man and his heart is in the right place. And considering the great contribution his father made to the game, I wouldn’t doubt that for a second. I could tell on Monday that he was frustrated with the view some in the Macarthur region had taken against the Wests Tigers.
Hence the invitation they sent me.
“There should be no doubt in anyone’s mind that the management of our game in south-west Sydney needs to be the top priority – from grassroots through to the elite level,” Humphreys said.
“In a strategic sense, the area is just too important to receive anything other than top billing. At the moment, there are a number of separate bodies involved in managing the interests of the game and its participants across south west Sydney and despite all of their best endeavours, the efforts are uncoordinated and rather dysfunctional.
“I understand that there is an expectation for Wests Tigers to play the lead role as the strong NRL brand in the region. While we are ready to take on this additional responsibility, there would need to be a significant change to the structures and processes that are currently in place to allow this to happen.”
Therein lies the problem. Currently we have the Wests Magpies, the Wests Junior League, the NSWRL, the Country Rugby League and Group Six (juniors and seniors) all involved in the management of rugby league in south-west Sydney. Clearly there is a case for change and streamlining of the game’s administration across the region.
Lets get one thing clear. Over the year my stance on the Wests Magpies has changed. For the sake of the Wests Tigers and growth as a club, there is no place for the Magpies at a senior level in 2012.
That is very hard to say for an old Magpie supporter like myself.
The Wests Magpies NSW Cup side is being run this season at a cost of $500,000 which is funded by Wests Ashfield Leagues Club. The Magpies are 0-16 with a for and against of 172-910\. That’s half a million dollars for the people playing at home.
An overhaul is required and loyalties need to die for business to prosper. It is the coldest truth, but that’s what has to happen. In this modern world, good business is loyalty.
My problem is with growth of the game in Macarthur. I told Mr. Humphreys that I felt that the massive nursery in sydney south-west was being left behind and there wasn’t enough work being done in the area. That the Wests Tigers shouldn’t be content in being number one in the region, but to “take it by the balls”.
What people may not know is that the Western Suburbs Magpies actually have no ties with the junior league. The junior league runs itself. When the Magpies came to Campbelltown in the 1980s, they didn’t align themselves with the junior league. So the junior league got themselves an ABN. To my knowledge this is the only junior league in Sydney that runs as a public company.
WSDJRL don’t answer to anyone. They are a law unto themselves. Who decided these people have the honour of running the game our kids play?
While we don’t agree on everything, Mr. Humphreys and I did agree that the junior system and its programmes needed to be streamlined so that the kids and administrators alike had a simple understanding of what the future holds. That can’t happen under the current structure.
The Wests Tigers continue to do good things for the Macarthur through their charity programmes and continued construction around the Campbelltown Stadium precinct. The club has declared its intention to base the under-20s youth side in the Macarthur area. This is a big step in the right direction and signals the commitment to continually grow the profile and presence of the Club in the region.
But the problem is the continued erosion of what should be a juggernaut. Rugby league in Macarthur will never die, but people sure are trying to hurt it. The Wests Tigers need total control to make this work.
Geographically, the Wests Tigers are blessed and cursed to have the supporter boundaries they have. The sooner people are educated about who and what is happening, the quicker they will side with the Wests Tigers.
Tiger_Watto
New member
Thanks Gary… A well thought out article and its good to have actual quotes from Humpty on this subject.
Cheers
Cheers
G
Guest
Guest
@Tiger Watto said:
The article raises some good points, certainly a streamlining of the various factions in the south-west needs to be looked at if progress is to be made. It's one thing for people to want the Wests Tigers to have more of a presence in the area, but logistically it becomes a problem when they have no control or say over how various aspects such as the junior league are run.
Gary_Bakerloo
New member
@Tiger Watto said:
It is interesting for a couple of reasons:
1\. The author after speaking with Humpty has changed his view (not completely, but close enough).
2\. How much circulation does "The Roar" achieve? Sufficient enough for Humpty to pull the guy in
3\. A thread was placed on this forum and subsequently removed of an article in the Macarthur Advertiser. Perhaps Humpty should write to the Campbelltown papers and explain the situation and how Wests Tigers plans to improve rugby league in the area.
S
system
Guest
The streamlining is one of the few points I out and out agree with.
I didn't feel his original article was an accurate representation of the facts and I feel this one swings too far the other way.
The author seems too keen to serve two sides of a debate in seperate articles without ever appraching it considering and weighing both perspectives.
I didn't feel his original article was an accurate representation of the facts and I feel this one swings too far the other way.
The author seems too keen to serve two sides of a debate in seperate articles without ever appraching it considering and weighing both perspectives.
This was my reply to the article.
Mr Humphreys has put a nice spin on the actual situation…. mess he's helped create.
>
The reality is the Wests Junior League refused to be affiliated to the Westsern Suburbs Magpies district club. The NSWRL allowed this to happen and I believe this alone is the number one cause for all the issues in the area. The NSWRL should have dismissed their board, put in an administrator. You cannot have a body running the game that isn't accountable to anybody.
>
The 2nd major issue is that Wests Leagues Club Campbelltown has voted with Balmain at the Wests Tigers Board Room to fullfill Tim Sheens wish of having all Wests Tigers contracted players moved to Concord. This has resulted in Magpie juniors having to play for Balmain Ryde Eastwood Tigers if they ever dare dream of playing for the Wests Tigers in the NRL. This first happened under the radar after we were all wrapped up in the Wests Tigers 2005 premiership win.
>
This policy has all but crushed the Magpies NSW Cup team, and the local area.
>
Ex Magpies Chairman Kevin Hammond opposed this decision and in 2008 threatened to become Canberra Raiders NSW Cup feeder team. This was shouted down by the Wests Tigers as being against the spirit of the joint venture,
but when has it been in the spirit of this supposed 50:50 joint venture that Balmain gets all the Wests Tigers contracted players whilst Wests Magpies gets none???
>
Under duress from Mr Hammonds threat, the Magpies got their players back in 2008, 2009 and 2010 and in each of these years under coach Leo Epifania, the team made the semi finals and each year was 1 game away from reaching the grand final.
>
The Magpies junior reps and development squads also flourished, kids were proud to be playing for a team with 100+ years of history. A team that truly represented their area.
>
Kevin's strong stance had now made some strong enemies and the knives were out. Members of the Wests Tigers, Magpies and Ashfield board basically stabbed him in the back making it impossible for him to continue. Kevin resigned, holding back tears at the Magpies AGM.
>
Without a strong leader, Wests Tigers were again to go on their merry way.
>
The Magpies NSW Cup side again lost all players to Balmain, and this time Wests Tigers took over running the Magpies Junior Reps.
>
Wests Tigers thought they had finally killed off the Magpies, but thanks to the diehard support of the Magpies members who organised a protest rally in the streets of Campbelltown, the Magpies again took to the field in the 2012 NSW Cup.
>
Wests Ashfield who was now swaying towards the Wests Tigers demands, were on again off again with the Magpies funding. This indesiciveness meant they were unable to sign a team up until late January. Way too late to get quality players, and way too late to have a decent off season.
>
Wests Tigers were furious, and went out of their way to make sure the Magpies wouldn't be successful, so they removed all support and even went as far as relieving the Wests Magpies of their training gear, ice machine and freezer.
>
Does this sound like the Wests Tigers are really concerned about the district they claim to care about?
>
We now have local Macarthur players who are at school, university or in low paying jobs from Campbelltown having to travel all the way to Concord to fill the Balmain ranks, when they used to be able to have quality local opportunities pulling on the Magpies jerseys.
>
Now we find out Balmain Leagues club is broke. It makes me wonder is the real reason behind this push to ensure the Magpies are dead and buried before Balmain falls on its own sword. They couldn't dare have the Magpies survive when they can't.
>
We have asked time and time again. If the Wests Tigers want a single NSW Cup side, and they claim the area is so important... then why can't the Western Suburbs Magpies be the Wests Tigers NSW Cup feeder team?
>
Balmain are broke, the Magpies team can focus on looking after the South West Sydney area from Under 16's to Reserve grade whilst bringing these players up under a coaching management and structure provided by the Wests Tigers.
>
No no no. Not acceptable! Is the reply from Camp Concord. I ask.... why?
>
Instead the area is meant to be happy about far off plans about some pretend centre of excellence that will be built somewhere, sometime in the future.
>
What! They want us to abandon the area completely until they can get their act together to try and do something out there?
>
They can't even give us more than 4 NRL games a year, can we trust them that these promised centres of excellence, and moving the under 20's to Campbelltown will come true?
>
Where's the business plans, where's the time lines, where's the budget. Its all pie in the sky stuff.
>
Until what the Wests Tigers provide, not propose... is better than what the Wests Magpies are providing the area.... I can't support their proposal of one NSW Cup team to be based at Concord and as a member of the Magpies football club, I will be voting against it and strongly urging other members to do the same.
Mr Humphreys has put a nice spin on the actual situation…. mess he's helped create.
>
The reality is the Wests Junior League refused to be affiliated to the Westsern Suburbs Magpies district club. The NSWRL allowed this to happen and I believe this alone is the number one cause for all the issues in the area. The NSWRL should have dismissed their board, put in an administrator. You cannot have a body running the game that isn't accountable to anybody.
>
The 2nd major issue is that Wests Leagues Club Campbelltown has voted with Balmain at the Wests Tigers Board Room to fullfill Tim Sheens wish of having all Wests Tigers contracted players moved to Concord. This has resulted in Magpie juniors having to play for Balmain Ryde Eastwood Tigers if they ever dare dream of playing for the Wests Tigers in the NRL. This first happened under the radar after we were all wrapped up in the Wests Tigers 2005 premiership win.
>
This policy has all but crushed the Magpies NSW Cup team, and the local area.
>
Ex Magpies Chairman Kevin Hammond opposed this decision and in 2008 threatened to become Canberra Raiders NSW Cup feeder team. This was shouted down by the Wests Tigers as being against the spirit of the joint venture,
but when has it been in the spirit of this supposed 50:50 joint venture that Balmain gets all the Wests Tigers contracted players whilst Wests Magpies gets none???
>
Under duress from Mr Hammonds threat, the Magpies got their players back in 2008, 2009 and 2010 and in each of these years under coach Leo Epifania, the team made the semi finals and each year was 1 game away from reaching the grand final.
>
The Magpies junior reps and development squads also flourished, kids were proud to be playing for a team with 100+ years of history. A team that truly represented their area.
>
Kevin's strong stance had now made some strong enemies and the knives were out. Members of the Wests Tigers, Magpies and Ashfield board basically stabbed him in the back making it impossible for him to continue. Kevin resigned, holding back tears at the Magpies AGM.
>
Without a strong leader, Wests Tigers were again to go on their merry way.
>
The Magpies NSW Cup side again lost all players to Balmain, and this time Wests Tigers took over running the Magpies Junior Reps.
>
Wests Tigers thought they had finally killed off the Magpies, but thanks to the diehard support of the Magpies members who organised a protest rally in the streets of Campbelltown, the Magpies again took to the field in the 2012 NSW Cup.
>
Wests Ashfield who was now swaying towards the Wests Tigers demands, were on again off again with the Magpies funding. This indesiciveness meant they were unable to sign a team up until late January. Way too late to get quality players, and way too late to have a decent off season.
>
Wests Tigers were furious, and went out of their way to make sure the Magpies wouldn't be successful, so they removed all support and even went as far as relieving the Wests Magpies of their training gear, ice machine and freezer.
>
Does this sound like the Wests Tigers are really concerned about the district they claim to care about?
>
We now have local Macarthur players who are at school, university or in low paying jobs from Campbelltown having to travel all the way to Concord to fill the Balmain ranks, when they used to be able to have quality local opportunities pulling on the Magpies jerseys.
>
Now we find out Balmain Leagues club is broke. It makes me wonder is the real reason behind this push to ensure the Magpies are dead and buried before Balmain falls on its own sword. They couldn't dare have the Magpies survive when they can't.
>
We have asked time and time again. If the Wests Tigers want a single NSW Cup side, and they claim the area is so important... then why can't the Western Suburbs Magpies be the Wests Tigers NSW Cup feeder team?
>
Balmain are broke, the Magpies team can focus on looking after the South West Sydney area from Under 16's to Reserve grade whilst bringing these players up under a coaching management and structure provided by the Wests Tigers.
>
No no no. Not acceptable! Is the reply from Camp Concord. I ask.... why?
>
Instead the area is meant to be happy about far off plans about some pretend centre of excellence that will be built somewhere, sometime in the future.
>
What! They want us to abandon the area completely until they can get their act together to try and do something out there?
>
They can't even give us more than 4 NRL games a year, can we trust them that these promised centres of excellence, and moving the under 20's to Campbelltown will come true?
>
Where's the business plans, where's the time lines, where's the budget. Its all pie in the sky stuff.
>
Until what the Wests Tigers provide, not propose... is better than what the Wests Magpies are providing the area.... I can't support their proposal of one NSW Cup team to be based at Concord and as a member of the Magpies football club, I will be voting against it and strongly urging other members to do the same.
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