What Does NSW Have To Do To Be Competitive?

[alien]

we havent won a series since joey johns left

 

[Jazza]

I think you've pretty much covered it all there Mighty Maggy.

NSW have the pride
NSW have the passion
NSW have the determination

NSW dont have the talent - at least not in every position. Hearin lies the problem. This QLD side has a freakish amount of talent. Theres Dally M winners, internationals, club captains etc….

NSW main problem has always been and continues to be at the selection table. Your selectors are no good...in fact they are terrible. This stupid notion of a player being "built for origin" which I'm sure was started by that moron Gould has led you astray.

They have to get this rotten notion out of their heads. Case in point Ennis. If you follow the guidelines for a built for origin prototype he fits the bill. He is seen as being a tough player who likes the rough/niggly stuff. However what does he offer the team? I dont think I've ever seen him play more than 40 minutes in an origin game. Thats pathetic for a hooker...he is taking up 2 interchanges. His primary task seems to be pressuring the kickers. After a few shots, they adapt, stand deeper, get the kick away, cop the belting and recieve a penalty. His value is now totally negated.

This 'built for origin' bs has also been seen by NSW to mean tough/borderline dirty. So we have seen the emergence of O'Donnell, Gallen and Bird...to name a few. Granted they are hard blokes who dont take a backward step...but they give far too many penalties away. At this level, these sorts of penalties kill you. This can be handled with good management. This year Gallen has reigned it in a bit and was very close to if not the player of the series.

Nsw also persist with great club players who cant hack the step up..i.e Creagh, Pearce, Morris etc...these types of players should have a red line run through their names. They start the year on fire for their club and everyone forgets how poor they are at state level and they are selected again. Historically the main culprits here have been your props. Ricky tried to combat this by not picking any..but this is also a mistake as QLD have two of the best in the world in their side.

All in all, the players NSW keep selecting arent working. You need new blood. As a superstar at club level doesnt always convert to a star at State level, the selectors need to broaden their search to include those who consistently return a solid game and have very little errors and penalties in them. These players may not be the obvious choice based upon club stats but as QLD has shown over the years, some people surprise you.

Theres about 8 out of the current side I would retain...which means that I would expect to see a few debutants next year. The problem is we may see 1 or 2....we really need to see 4 or 5 with the remainder being made up of guys who werent available this time around i.e Jennings.

I agree with your points there as well.
I think another issue with the selections is the fact that the selectors (Or as in the case of this year, the coach and his advisor, Bozo) seem to go back to older players who are past their prime.
Examples include Gasnier, Minichiello and Cooper (Sticky sent an SOS to Cooper to come out of retirement this year) as well as players in past years such as Lyon, Barrett, Kimmorley, Bailey and Buderus.
Gasnier did nothing of note in this series besides dropping the ball and being flatfooted in defence which lead to the match winning try in Origin 1.
The selectors seem to value 'experience' too much and when a young guy does have a poor game, they panic and select these older players past their prime.

 

[steve-o]

1\. Jaryd Hayne
2\. Michael Gordon
3\. Michael Jennings
4\. Chris Lawrence
5\. Aquila Uate
6\. Jamie Soward
7\. **No Idea** - can't find a decent halfback in NSW, all the good ones are QLDers
8\. Michael Weyman
9\. Robbie Farah
10\. Tom Learoyd Lars
11\. Beau Scott
12\. Anthony Watmough
13\. Paul Gallen

14\. Luke Lewis
15\. Aiden Tolman
16\. Keith Galloway - more than 10 bloody minutes!
17\. Tim Mannah

Cut off the 'deadwood' - Gasnier, Mini, **Bird**, Gidley, Ennis, Creagh, Pearce - they've had enough chances.
Although I guess Pearce can stay if no other half emerges throughout the year.
Get more big go forward guys in there, instead of having a whole pack full of back rowers trying to tire Qld's big men out, because that really worked, didn't it? :unamused:
Get Wayne Bennett to coach them and don't allow the influence of Daley or Bozo within a million kms of the team and we should be sweet! :smiley:

u kidding with bird. he was one of our best this yr

 

[tig_prmz]

1\. Stewart/Dugan (Dugan has talent, but you never know with this guy)
2\. Uate
3\. Gasnier/Idris (again, depends on Idris completely.)
4\. Lawrence
5\. Jennings
6\. Hayne
7\. Soward (Sticky said earlier Pearce is best 7 in the world, could this happen then? or is his ego too large?)
8\. Gallen
9\. Gidley
10\. Galloway
11\. Bird
12\. Stewart
13\. Lewis

14\. Farah (replace Gidley or can cover injury with Gidley moving to the injured position and Farah at half)
15\. TLL
16\. Tarig Sims (he looks the goods,)
17\. Watmough/ maybe Dwyer if he steps up.

 

[Flippedy]

1\. Jaryd Hayne
2\. Michael Gordon
3\. Michael Jennings
4\. Chris Lawrence
5\. Aquila Uate
6\. Jamie Soward
7\. **No Idea** - can't find a decent halfback in NSW, all the good ones are QLDers
8\. Michael Weyman
9\. Robbie Farah
10\. Tom Learoyd Lars
11\. Beau Scott
12\. Anthony Watmough
13\. Paul Gallen

14\. Luke Lewis
15\. Aiden Tolman
16\. Keith Galloway - more than 10 bloody minutes!
17\. Tim Mannah

Cut off the 'deadwood' - Gasnier, Mini, **Bird**, Gidley, Ennis, Creagh, Pearce - they've had enough chances.
Although I guess Pearce can stay if no other half emerges throughout the year.
Get more big go forward guys in there, instead of having a whole pack full of back rowers trying to tire Qld's big men out, because that really worked, didn't it? :unamused:
Get Wayne Bennett to coach them and don't allow the influence of Daley or Bozo within a million kms of the team and we should be sweet! :smiley:

u kidding with bird. he was one of our best this yr

Yeah, I'm probably being a bit harsh on Bird, but his club form has been well below par and it annoys me that he always get a walk up start in Origin because of his supposed tough guy reputation. It hasn't won us a series yet, and I still believe we can put together a more effective back row.

 

[pacey]

Mullen as halfback for 2012.

Another very average halfback, imo. NSW don't have a halfback who is good enough for Origin at the moment. Even the next best up and coming half (Cherry-Evans) is a damn Queenslander!

Mullen average, please

 

[tig_prmz]

Yeah, I'm probably being a bit harsh on Bird, but his club form has been well below par and it annoys me that he always get a walk up start in Origin because of his supposed tough guy reputation. It hasn't won us a series yet, and I still believe we can put together a more effective back row.

No way,
Bird, Gallen, Lewis and to some extent Watmough, Creagh and Stewart are some of the best backrowers in the comp.
They run good lines,
tackle and hit hard
can break lines on their own
and have moderate ball playing skills.

I hate Bird coz everytime he gets up trying to milk a penalty and is an all out grub
but unlike other grubs like Ennis, Tahu etc.
BIRD HAS IMMENSE TALENT
he is a very smart player, but needs to know when to get a quick PTB and when to milk.

 

[stryker]

I like Bird as a player…he is a competitor who isnt afraid to mix it with anyone.

However I really can not stand the way he tries to milk penalties. The refs have been on to him for years and usually tell him to stop mucking around and get up and play the ball.

He needs to get that crap out of his game.

 

[mtd]

i dont know how anyone can suggest robbie as nsw hooker right now, his form this year has been average…

dont get me wrong, i love the guy, but right now he doesnt deserve the sky blue

 

[claws]

Just look at how many NSW players have made or will make the Aussie team. Qld then daylight. Perhaps they should have a series Qld v's The World, they would still win but it would be more competetive. They strangled NSW.

 

[Marshall_magic]

Just look at how many NSW players have made or will make the Aussie team. Qld then daylight. Perhaps they should have a series Qld v's The World, they would still win but it would be more competetive. They strangled NSW.

Considering pretty much every single international final between Australia and New Zealand the kiwis seem to win (2005, 2008, 2010, lost in extra time in 2006), I highly doubt Qld would beat a world 17\. Throw Ellis, Burgess, maybe Widdop and a handful of NSW players into the kiwi side they'd be unbeatable.

 

[stryker]

No team in the world would have beat the maroons in game 3.

The boys clocked off twice in that game and still got home in a canter.

 

[happy_tiger]

I think if NSW put more money in those brown bags they keep leaving outside the referees rooms to start with that would help . Find a few more players who actually have a heartbeat . Man up big time in general

 

[mtd]

By simplistic, I meant that Queensland played a far superior game last night to NSW. It was a huge improvement on game 1 and definitely game 2.

The maroons forcing of repeat sets added to the fumbling bumbling way the blues started the match had very little to do with the refs. The lions share of field position and ball posession was largely due to QLDs tactical brilliance where all the big guns were on fire at the same time and NSWs ineptitude with the ball in hand.

I agree that the ruck was a mess all night long but it was well and truly a 2 way street. Rather than the blues playing themselves back into the game I thought they were allowed back in by 2 factors.

No.1 was the refs became more lenient towards their plight with penalties that had been let go all night previously, starting to be pulled up in their favour,

No.2 when it became apparent that the maroons were well and truly on top, the QLD players moved away from their game plan and concentrated on getting Locky over the stripe. This created some messy play that left gaps outwide that NSW, to their credit, exploited.

i'm not disagreeing that qld weren't brilliant, they played well…

however;
the only way qld were ever going to win was for it to be a slow game... i think we all went into game 3 expecting a match refereed similar to that of origin 2, which wasn't incredibly fast, but still gave the more agile guys the edge. based on that i think we picked close to the right team. qlders were nervous, and for good reason. NSW had the edge this time.

now in game 3, NSW made 351 tackles, QLD made 261.
individually NSW's top defenders were:
- gallen 47
- gidley 47
- stewart 39
- bird 37
- lewis 29
- creagh 25
- gasnier 23

Compound that with the fact that NSW defended 6 sets of defence on our line without QLD going over, it was phenomenal.. Given the pressure and work that NSW were required to do, to only lose by 10 points, there is no way I believe you can claim NSW are not competitive. I still believe if game 3 was refereed the same as origin 2, NSW win the series.

Rep footy has always been the domain of the 'get square' penalty and it was in evidence again last night. There was most deinitely different rules interpretations between all 3 games which was frustrating **but I dont think that faster play the balls would have been the deciding factor**. NSW were just outgunned by a more professional rugby league machine.
>
I still maintane that NSW are not selecting the correct players and that is the difference between the two sides.

different teams perform better under different play the balls;
slow play the balls are better for big packs because there is alot more emphasis on the go forward.
fast play the balls are better for smaller packs because the games faster and it gives them more of an opportunity to play attacking footy.

melbourne are so good because they adapt to the play the ball. bellamy even mentioned in a post match press conference that he received the memo from the refs so he created their game plan around that. the speed of the play the ball changes everything.

 

[happy_tiger]

By simplistic, I meant that Queensland played a far superior game last night to NSW. It was a huge improvement on game 1 and definitely game 2.

The maroons forcing of repeat sets added to the fumbling bumbling way the blues started the match had very little to do with the refs. The lions share of field position and ball posession was largely due to QLDs tactical brilliance where all the big guns were on fire at the same time and NSWs ineptitude with the ball in hand.

I agree that the ruck was a mess all night long but it was well and truly a 2 way street. Rather than the blues playing themselves back into the game I thought they were allowed back in by 2 factors.

No.1 was the refs became more lenient towards their plight with penalties that had been let go all night previously, starting to be pulled up in their favour,

No.2 when it became apparent that the maroons were well and truly on top, the QLD players moved away from their game plan and concentrated on getting Locky over the stripe. This created some messy play that left gaps outwide that NSW, to their credit, exploited.

i'm not disagreeing that qld weren't brilliant, they played well…

however;
the only way qld were ever going to win was for it to be a slow game... i think we all went into game 3 expecting a match refereed similar to that of origin 2, which wasn't incredibly fast, but still gave the more agile guys the edge. based on that i think we picked close to the right team. qlders were nervous, and for good reason. NSW had the edge this time.

now in game 3, NSW made 351 tackles, QLD made 261.
individually NSW's top defenders were:
- gallen 47
- gidley 47
- stewart 39
- bird 37
- lewis 29
- creagh 25
- gasnier 23

Compound that with the fact that NSW defended 6 sets of defence on our line without QLD going over, it was phenomenal.. Given the pressure and work that NSW were required to do, to only lose by 10 points, there is no way I believe you can claim NSW are not competitive. I still believe if game 3 was refereed the same as origin 2, NSW win the series.

Rep footy has always been the domain of the 'get square' penalty and it was in evidence again last night. There was most deinitely different rules interpretations between all 3 games which was frustrating **but I dont think that faster play the balls would have been the deciding factor**. NSW were just outgunned by a more professional rugby league machine.
>
I still maintane that NSW are not selecting the correct players and that is the difference between the two sides.

different teams perform better under different play the balls;
slow play the balls are better for big packs because there is alot more emphasis on the go forward.
fast play the balls are better for smaller packs because the games faster and it gives them more of an opportunity to play attacking footy.

melbourne are so good because they adapt to the play the ball. bellamy even mentioned in a post match press conference that he received the memo from the refs so he created their game plan around that. the speed of the play the ball changes everything.

MTD the scoreline flattered NSW Qld were a 30 point better team on the night And we took the foot off your throat at times Like a cat plays with a half dead mouse before it gets bored