Coronavirus Outbreak

[tigertye]

LOCK AUSTRALIA DOWN. Forget about the vaccinations and wait until we have a safe and approved vaccination until we consider reopening the country. The government pushing this lab rat vaccination agenda is an absolute disgrace.

Back to reality.

1. You can't shut the country down completely.
2. We vaccinate. We let it rip. People will die but it will save the vast majority of people. The ones who choose not to vaccinate will suffer from this much more than they need too but that is the cost of letting people make their own decisions.

It would have been good to have some special quarantine facility but the reality is we've kept it until control up until the home run and it's only the delta strain that is really giving it to us. I think by Christmas we will probably be in the let it rip phase.

Unfortunately, it’s this mentality of what reality should be is what I shake my head at. You’re literally saying you’re accepting people to die from this when it doesn’t have to be that way at all.

It actually does. You don't have a choice. Do we stop everyone from talking to each other to stop people dying from the flu ? Do we still drive cars ? Do we still fly in planes ?

Reality. You can't avoid it. People die. It sucks.

Get vaccinated. Don't eat too much meat and junk food. Exercise. Don't smoke. Put the odds in your favor.

That is all you get in this life.

“You don’t have a choice” We all have choices and a voice. People flock to much around an accepted version of what reality is. Look at the protesting overseas, people have had enough of their “reality”

The fact is though, Australia can stay safe from this virus for years if we have to. Simply by closing our borders and only reopening them once there is a safe and approved vaccine.

We’re basically doing it now, but just a band aid version.

There is no way we could stay locked down for years. It would be a disaster. You also didn't state what we should do about the flu and poor diet and smoking and cars and planes and millions of other things.

It isn’t a disaster already? What you see in the UK, India, US, etc isn’t a disaster? Australia will be no different if we keep the current path. A vaccine with side affects isn’t the answer either.

I didn’t mention anything about what else you said because it was just stupid and nothing to do with what we’re discussing.

Just answer me this? Is Australia impacted more by closing the international border permanently until there’s an approved and safe vaccine, which secured the safety of the majority or by vaccinating as many who choose and letting the virus in completely or living with a lockdown style nation for the next few decades?

That’s the 2 options I see Australia living with?

You have it wrong. There is an extremely low mortality rate amongst people who are vaccinated. The majority of people dying are not vaccinated.

There are massive costs to lockdowns and they are unsustainable over the long term. The country is already going broke. My grandkids are going to be paying back this debt and I don't have any yet.

So there isn't a disaster now in the UK because of the high vaccination rate. The US is improving as well.

Get vaccinated. It'll lower your risk profile significantly. You have to be rational.

You’re completely missing my point. Absolutely nobody needs to die or become ill from covid or a faulty vaccine whatsoever. But the only way to achieve that is by stopping international travel until there is a safer vaccination available. International travel isn’t a necessity if it saves lives. It sounds like you don’t care about those that’ll lose their lives. You said yourself “some people are going to die from it, it sucks but it happens”. Truth be told, they don’t have to die at all so I see that sort of comment as just completely humanely wrong.

Once this breakout is contained there’s no need to continually wind up in further lockdowns. We could technically live normally here. It’s the influx of new arrivals getting through the gaps. We’ve seen another 5 people die who didn’t need to, 100’s more sick, plenty with side affects from the current vaccination options.

There’s other ways, but it requires patience from the people (it won’t be decades like some claim), but instead people are selfish and care more about their future overseas holidays than they do their fellow Aussies.

People are just narrow-minded to an alternative way of dealing with the virus because you’ve all been psychologically prepped by the government to bend at the knees now if you’re told to like a pack of sheep. I’ve decided to form my own opinion on that involves no death or illness just an overseas inconvenience.

I’m sure there’s other alternatives or suggestions that others on here have out but I’m guessing many are scared to share because they just get shut down.

In the meantime though, I’ll just sit at home, unable to support my family with absolutely zero business support financially from the government and ponder how I’m going to keep my family fed thanks to this latest lockdown that never had to happen.

 

[earl]

You’re completely missing my point. Absolutely nobody needs to die or become ill from covid or a faulty vaccine whatsoever. But the only way to achieve that is by stopping international travel until there is a safer vaccination available. International travel isn’t a necessity if it saves lives. It sounds like you don’t care about those that’ll lose their lives. You said yourself “some people are going to die from it, it sucks but it happens”. Truth be told, they don’t have to die at all so I see that sort of comment as just completely humanely wrong.

https://www.abs.gov.au/statistics/health/causes-death/provisional-mortality-statistics/latest-release

People die. As for your faulty vaccine that is complete nonsense. We have a vaccine. Go and get vaccinated.

Don't think that I don't care about people dying. I've lost my brother and it hurts every day.

We have to be rational and you are not viewing this situation rationally.

 

[earl]

In the meantime though, I’ll just sit at home, unable to support my family with absolutely zero business support financially from the government and ponder how I’m going to keep my family fed thanks to this latest lockdown that never had to happen.

Is this true ? My son is getting over $300 into his account each week and the most he has earned as a 17 yo would be say $50 per week.

I also don't mean to be a real pain in the backside but why not save money.

 

[earl]

People are just narrow-minded to an alternative way of dealing with the virus because you’ve all been psychologically prepped by the government to bend at the knees now if you’re told to like a pack of sheep. I’ve decided to form my own opinion on that involves no death or illness just an overseas inconvenience.

No offense but I'm no sheep.

 

[cochise]

LOCK AUSTRALIA DOWN. Forget about the vaccinations and wait until we have a safe and approved vaccination until we consider reopening the country. The government pushing this lab rat vaccination agenda is an absolute disgrace.

Back to reality.

1. You can't shut the country down completely.
2. We vaccinate. We let it rip. People will die but it will save the vast majority of people. The ones who choose not to vaccinate will suffer from this much more than they need too but that is the cost of letting people make their own decisions.

It would have been good to have some special quarantine facility but the reality is we've kept it until control up until the home run and it's only the delta strain that is really giving it to us. I think by Christmas we will probably be in the let it rip phase.

Unfortunately, it’s this mentality of what reality should be is what I shake my head at. You’re literally saying you’re accepting people to die from this when it doesn’t have to be that way at all.

It actually does. You don't have a choice. Do we stop everyone from talking to each other to stop people dying from the flu ? Do we still drive cars ? Do we still fly in planes ?

Reality. You can't avoid it. People die. It sucks.

Get vaccinated. Don't eat too much meat and junk food. Exercise. Don't smoke. Put the odds in your favor.

That is all you get in this life.

“You don’t have a choice” We all have choices and a voice. People flock to much around an accepted version of what reality is. Look at the protesting overseas, people have had enough of their “reality”

The fact is though, Australia can stay safe from this virus for years if we have to. Simply by closing our borders and only reopening them once there is a safe and approved vaccine.

We’re basically doing it now, but just a band aid version.

There is no way we could stay locked down for years. It would be a disaster. You also didn't state what we should do about the flu and poor diet and smoking and cars and planes and millions of other things.

It isn’t a disaster already? What you see in the UK, India, US, etc isn’t a disaster? Australia will be no different if we keep the current path. A vaccine with side affects isn’t the answer either.

I didn’t mention anything about what else you said because it was just stupid and nothing to do with what we’re discussing.

Just answer me this? Is Australia impacted more by closing the international border permanently until there’s an approved and safe vaccine, which secured the safety of the majority or by vaccinating as many who choose and letting the virus in completely or living with a lockdown style nation for the next few decades?

That’s the 2 options I see Australia living with?

You have it wrong. There is an extremely low mortality rate amongst people who are vaccinated. The majority of people dying are not vaccinated.

There are massive costs to lockdowns and they are unsustainable over the long term. The country is already going broke. My grandkids are going to be paying back this debt and I don't have any yet.

So there isn't a disaster now in the UK because of the high vaccination rate. The US is improving as well.

Get vaccinated. It'll lower your risk profile significantly. You have to be rational.

You’re completely missing my point. Absolutely nobody needs to die or become ill from covid or a faulty vaccine whatsoever. But the only way to achieve that is by stopping international travel until there is a safer vaccination available. International travel isn’t a necessity if it saves lives. It sounds like you don’t care about those that’ll lose their lives. You said yourself “some people are going to die from it, it sucks but it happens”. Truth be told, they don’t have to die at all so I see that sort of comment as just completely humanely wrong.

Once this breakout is contained there’s no need to continually wind up in further lockdowns. We could technically live normally here. It’s the influx of new arrivals getting through the gaps. We’ve seen another 5 people die who didn’t need to, 100’s more sick, plenty with side affects from the current vaccination options.

There’s other ways, but it requires patience from the people (it won’t be decades like some claim), but instead people are selfish and care more about their future overseas holidays than they do their fellow Aussies.

People are just narrow-minded to an alternative way of dealing with the virus because you’ve all been psychologically prepped by the government to bend at the knees now if you’re told to like a pack of sheep. I’ve decided to form my own opinion on that involves no death or illness just an overseas inconvenience.

I’m sure there’s other alternatives or suggestions that others on here have out but I’m guessing many are scared to share because they just get shut down.

In the meantime though, I’ll just sit at home, unable to support my family with absolutely zero business support financially from the government and ponder how I’m going to keep my family fed thanks to this latest lockdown that never had to happen.

Of course it would be decades and it would be a disaster for the country economically.

 

[Jedi_Tiger]

I wonder if there might be more to this story. I don't mean to be tasteless in speculating on a recent death, but the family only just got positive results the other day, seems very fast for a death compared to typical covid deaths, and she was only in her 50s too.

She may not have realised how sick she was or 'didn't want to make a fuss'. 🙁

I can recall reading a (chilling) article from a NYC paramedic very early into the pandemic - just into their 'first wave'. Lots of people around that age bracket dropped dead suddenly at home due to cardiac arrest within a few days of contracting the virus.

Extremely low (near zero) chances of surviving that (cardiac arrest) outside a hospital unless you're next to a defibrillator and have someone there able to use it, and even then poor outcomes can be expected.

Terrible situation all round, and sympathies to the young blokes (yes I acknowledge they did the wrong thing) who've lost their mum unexpectedly.

Now Orange, Blayney and Cabonne are going into lockdown as from midnight.
I just wonder how long before Bathurst follows as an infected truck driver stopped at BP in Raglan (just on the Sydney side of Bathurst).


But but but Gladys is GOLD standard just ask the "liar from the shire".Sooner or later his lies/ misdirections will be exposed on all his failings,the Glasgow conferance on climate change later this year could expose this charlatan completely though i have no doubt his owners in the Murdoch media will cover his rear end as well they can.it will be interesting to see how the fact that we as a nation pay more taxes and tariffs to export to rest of the world than anybody else will be painted by him and his backers(reason is lack of action on climate change).
Mods please feel free to transfer this to the politics thread where it belongs.

Each way Albo says hello same mistakes as Bill shorten try to back both sides all the time.
Thank God Labor are not in charge during this pandemic thank you voters

I don't believe this at all. Scomo hasn't done well at all. I think Gladys has been a star. It's not a political side that is the concern but how competent they are.

Morrison does not control the states with border closures etc NSW has done all the heavy lifting with returned travellers etc.
Though job keeper a good initiative from Feds and roll-out will pick up

 

[earl]

Though job keeper a good initiative from Feds and roll-out will pick up

It's going to cost us though isn't it. I feel it's required but we are going to be in debt for a long time. Then we have the Brisbane Olympics coming up. That'll be another big hit to the back pocket.

I know it's off topic but I wonder if they are going to keep pumping money into the economy especially in the US.

 

[Jedi_Tiger]

Though job keeper a good initiative from Feds and roll-out will pick up

It's going to cost us though isn't it. I feel it's required but we are going to be in debt for a long time. Then we have the Brisbane Olympics coming up. That'll be another big hit to the back pocket.

I know it's off topic but I wonder if they are going to keep pumping money into the economy especially in the US.

absolutely it will cost us, we need to lift the lockdowns at some point we can't get to zero. I f

 

[Sco77y]

In the meantime though, I’ll just sit at home, unable to support my family with absolutely zero business support financially from the government and ponder how I’m going to keep my family fed thanks to this latest lockdown that never had to happen.

Is this true ? My son is getting over $300 into his account each week and the most he has earned as a 17 yo would be say $50 per week.

I also don't mean to be a real pain in the backside but why not save money.

There doesn't seem to be a lot of support for newly established businesses. To qualify for the larger grants and assistance you need to demonstrate the impact on your business through a comparison with financial details from the previous financial year - something a new business obviously doesn't have.

There's definitely some unfair situations, and perhaps some things overlooked (although I haven't looked into all of the assistance available - perhaps there is something for new businesses). My brother just opened a restaurant though and I can tell you at this stage there is nothing in the way of assistance readily available to him.

 

[earl]

In the meantime though, I’ll just sit at home, unable to support my family with absolutely zero business support financially from the government and ponder how I’m going to keep my family fed thanks to this latest lockdown that never had to happen.

Is this true ? My son is getting over $300 into his account each week and the most he has earned as a 17 yo would be say $50 per week.

I also don't mean to be a real pain in the backside but why not save money.

There doesn't seem to be a lot of support for newly established businesses. To qualify for the larger grants and assistance you need to demonstrate the impact on your business through a comparison with financial details from the previous financial year - something a new business obviously doesn't have.

There's definitely some unfair situations, and perhaps some things overlooked (although I haven't looked into all of the assistance available - perhaps there is something for new businesses). My brother just opened a restaurant though and I can tell you at this stage there is nothing in the way of assistance readily available to him.

So it's not perfect but what do you expect. I think it's unfair my son is getting paid a good wage for doing nothing. He is in year 12.

Starting a new business today takes a set. Good luck to him.

 

[nuggetron]

disregard what he said and stood for, he wasn’t just another name/face running a country

He was a fool. Incompetent, corrupt and scum. I had no opinion on him at all until he screwed everything up.

Your logic to me is so wrong. All I'm hearing is that it doesn't matter if you are incompetent and millions die and the world goes to hell. All that matters is if you are a loud ignorant fool.

Sorry mate that doesn't cut it with me.

I want calm, rational, logical competent politicians who run the country well. I'd prefer them to be quiet and not to have to listen to them.

If I want drama or action I watch the footy and TV shows.

so you're happy with the PMs rolling over every few years, lasting long enough to get their life time pension, rather than have one who has a vision for the country, sticks to their sales pitch that got them the gig and sees it through.
Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon is a terrible person but he tried to accomplish what he said he would in his campaign. at the very start i said ignore what your feelings are for him and see that he was a better leader than the mob we have suffered through since howard.
i'm not here to convert you into a Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon lover, just to recognise that a PM needs to be a leader and we haven't had one is ages on either side, both will promise you the voters whatever it takes to get the numbers rather than having a vision for a future and sticking to that even if it upsets a group of people

 

[earl]

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon is a terrible person but he tried to accomplish what he said he would in his campaign. at the very start i said ignore what your feelings are for him and see that he was a better leader than the mob we have suffered through since howard

You've used a terrible example.

I'm going to explain it to you again. I am not a tribal voter. I believe in calm, constructive rational decision making. I don't believe that loud stupid people are good leaders.

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon to me is the worst leader I have ever seen. I have no personal feelings about him. I judge him on his performance.

I also think your premise is wrong.

 

[nuggetron]

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon is a terrible person but he tried to accomplish what he said he would in his campaign. at the very start i said ignore what your feelings are for him and see that he was a better leader than the mob we have suffered through since howard

You've used a terrible example.

I'm going to explain it to you again. I am not a tribal voter. I believe in calm, constructive rational decision making. I don't believe that loud stupid people are good leaders.

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon to me is the worst leader I have ever seen. I have no personal feelings about him. I judge him on his performance.

I also think your premise is wrong.

calm constructive rational decision making, none of the last 5 or 6 or however many we have had have been decision makers, thats my point. they fluff around and weigh up whatever option will keep them in power for the next week

 

[cochise]

This is not the politics thread, politics come into this issue but a lot of the current discussion is not about covid.

 

[Sco77y]

In the meantime though, I’ll just sit at home, unable to support my family with absolutely zero business support financially from the government and ponder how I’m going to keep my family fed thanks to this latest lockdown that never had to happen.

Is this true ? My son is getting over $300 into his account each week and the most he has earned as a 17 yo would be say $50 per week.

I also don't mean to be a real pain in the backside but why not save money.

There doesn't seem to be a lot of support for newly established businesses. To qualify for the larger grants and assistance you need to demonstrate the impact on your business through a comparison with financial details from the previous financial year - something a new business obviously doesn't have.

There's definitely some unfair situations, and perhaps some things overlooked (although I haven't looked into all of the assistance available - perhaps there is something for new businesses). My brother just opened a restaurant though and I can tell you at this stage there is nothing in the way of assistance readily available to him.

So it's not perfect but what do you expect. I think it's unfair my son is getting paid a good wage for doing nothing. He is in year 12.

Starting a new business today takes a set. Good luck to him.

Thanks mate. They opened it around 3 months ago and were doing great before this latest lockdown threw a spanner in the works. They're still ok at the moment, building for the future with a completely new menu, drinks and takeaway options that they're currently selling. I don't think there's a lot of profit at all, but at least with that experience (and some new customers) they'll come out stronger on the other end.

Yes (and no offence to your son - not his fault), but I can't believe some people are actually doing better out of this situation than they were before. Some obvious flaws when you can be earning more than you were outside of the pandemic, for doing less or even nothing.

 

[mike]

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon is a terrible person but he tried to accomplish what he said he would in his campaign. at the very start i said ignore what your feelings are for him and see that he was a better leader than the mob we have suffered through since howard

You've used a terrible example.

I'm going to explain it to you again. I am not a tribal voter. I believe in calm, constructive rational decision making. I don't believe that loud stupid people are good leaders.

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon to me is the worst leader I have ever seen. I have no personal feelings about him. I judge him on his performance.

I also think your premise is wrong.

Check out Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon's ranking as President.

1- Lincoln
2- Washington
3-Franklin D. Roosevelt
......
10-Barack Obama
......
......
41-Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon
42-Franklin Pierce
43-Andrew Johnson
44-James Buchanan (last)

 

[Pascoes_barber]

The Vaccines are approved?

Not too sure what your question is here. There’s no approved vaccine currently?

Antivax nonsense. Good luck with that next year when we open up.

@cochise is correct. Both Pfizer and Astra Zeneca granted provisional approval by the TGA at the start of this year. Moderna more recently (25 June).

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

LOCK AUSTRALIA DOWN. Forget about the vaccinations and wait until we have a safe and approved vaccination until we consider reopening the country. The government pushing this lab rat vaccination agenda is an absolute disgrace.

Back to reality.

1. You can't shut the country down completely.
2. We vaccinate. We let it rip. People will die but it will save the vast majority of people. The ones who choose not to vaccinate will suffer from this much more than they need too but that is the cost of letting people make their own decisions.

It would have been good to have some special quarantine facility but the reality is we've kept it until control up until the home run and it's only the delta strain that is really giving it to us. I think by Christmas we will probably be in the let it rip phase.

Unfortunately, it’s this mentality of what reality should be is what I shake my head at. You’re literally saying you’re accepting people to die from this when it doesn’t have to be that way at all.

It actually does. You don't have a choice. Do we stop everyone from talking to each other to stop people dying from the flu ? Do we still drive cars ? Do we still fly in planes ?

Reality. You can't avoid it. People die. It sucks.

Get vaccinated. Don't eat too much meat and junk food. Exercise. Don't smoke. Put the odds in your favor.

That is all you get in this life.

“You don’t have a choice” We all have choices and a voice. People flock to much around an accepted version of what reality is. Look at the protesting overseas, people have had enough of their “reality”

The fact is though, Australia can stay safe from this virus for years if we have to. Simply by closing our borders and only reopening them once there is a safe and approved vaccine.

We’re basically doing it now, but just a band aid version.

There is no way we could stay locked down for years. It would be a disaster. You also didn't state what we should do about the flu and poor diet and smoking and cars and planes and millions of other things.

It isn’t a disaster already? What you see in the UK, India, US, etc isn’t a disaster? Australia will be no different if we keep the current path. A vaccine with side affects isn’t the answer either.

I didn’t mention anything about what else you said because it was just stupid and nothing to do with what we’re discussing.

Just answer me this? Is Australia impacted more by closing the international border permanently until there’s an approved and safe vaccine, which secured the safety of the majority or by vaccinating as many who choose and letting the virus in completely or living with a lockdown style nation for the next few decades?

That’s the 2 options I see Australia living with?

***Every*** medicine comes with side effects. Contraceptive pills have a risk of stroke. Warfarin can cause liver problems, Sotalol increases your LDL cholesterol. Got a headache? Don't take paracetemol, they can cause liver complications and create bleed risks. Everyday people take medication without questioning the risks of it.

The flu vaccination has side effects. Tetanus shots, triple antigen boosters, whooping cough vaccines. Why is it all of a sudden a problem with the COVID vaccines? The medical experts are all still saying get vaccinated. There is obviously overwhelming evidence to support that being vaccinated is overwhelmingly better than contracting COVID without any immunity, especially now that the virus has mutated to the point where it is no longer just picking off the infirm and elderly. It's making younger people sick. They are ending up in the ICU.

The general scientific consensus is that the vaccines are safe. We have someone on this forum whose specialty is in drug analysis and they are saying there's nothing to indicate that the vaccines are any more dangerous than any other vaccine.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

I remember reading a study a while back that showed correlation between men who take fish oil supplements and the increased risk of prostate cancer. I want to say it was something like 60% increase in risk, but I'd have to find the study again to confirm.

That's not even medication, it's a health supplement and it could be causing harm to people.

 

[nuggetron]

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon is a terrible person but he tried to accomplish what he said he would in his campaign. at the very start i said ignore what your feelings are for him and see that he was a better leader than the mob we have suffered through since howard

You've used a terrible example.

I'm going to explain it to you again. I am not a tribal voter. I believe in calm, constructive rational decision making. I don't believe that loud stupid people are good leaders.

Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon to me is the worst leader I have ever seen. I have no personal feelings about him. I judge him on his performance.

I also think your premise is wrong.

Check out Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon's ranking as President.

1- Lincoln
2- Washington
3-Franklin D. Roosevelt
......
10-Barack Obama
......
......
41-Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon
42-Franklin Pierce
43-Andrew Johnson
44-James Buchanan (last)

yeh but thats cause he was a moron, my point is he had a mindset for the country; bring manufacturing back, mexican wall, reduce reliance on china rah rah rah, and made moves to achieve that.
you don't get people like that as a leader here in aus, where they have a belief and regardless of how many parties it upsets sticks with it.
the bloke is a moron, the people who voted for him are morons, the people who rioted cause the election was stolen are morons, but the way he said this is what we are doing, and then went about it to me easily makes him better than the mob we have endured for the last 10 years who just get rotated. back to the original post, whether they are labor or liberal they stand for the same thing now; if not in power say anything and everything to get in power and when in power do as little as possible to rock the ship

back on track to covid; scomo sitting on his hands and passing the buck for the poor vaccine supply side of the roll out just exemplifies the point. if we had someone who said no vaccine lock down only until the virus dies out naturally and does it, sweet! if we had someone who said build quarantine stations, build 3 different vaccine manufacturing plants to facilitate the roll out and offer people the choice and then funded and built those, sweet! even better if it goes bad and they say "you know what, i stuffed up and this is how we will get through it" all we get is guys and gals just rolling with it counting down the days until that lifetime benefit kicks in, disappears for a week when half the country is in lockdown, on holidays when the country is burning etc.

because some people take things literally, I'm not saying no vaccine is the way to go, I'm pro vaccines, haven't had a covid shot yet, awaiting novavax. but the lack of a backbone from Scomo annoys the hell out of me, we had multiple opportunities to set Aus up for a better response and he has sat back time and time again.