Madge Maguire - Mega Thread

[Harvey]

At the moment we simply don’t have enough players who want to win.
That is clear from their performances and their whinging when they are called out for it.
It’s easy to say that Madge has signed the majority of these guys but he has done so with very few options available to him with the club seemingly on the nose and self imposed salary cap issues.
The club doesn’t need to make a decision about Madge, they need to make a decision from the board down throughout the organisation as to how serious they are about winning a competition.
If the answer is yes we are serious, then they need to identify who is willing to roll up the sleeves and get there and who isn’t.
To this end, as a fan, I would like to see them tell a few of these guys they won’t be at the WT next year.
But in reality it is not that simple.
I believe Hartigan is working towards this but it’s a long game as has been seen with the focus on development players.
I believe this intent has also been shown through our recent and well documented attempts to sign some prized targets - we have been selective with who we have approached, looking for specific skill sets to fill identified gaps in the roster.
Hopefully we can have some wins in this area soon.

Just as well we did not get Lattrell, Arrow, JAC or any other big name we have tried to sign with all these salary cap issues

 

[wonka]

Penrith sacked Griffen right before the finals & they were running 5th at the time.

 

[BalmainJnr]

At the moment we simply don’t have enough players who want to win.
That is clear from their performances and their whinging when they are called out for it.
It’s easy to say that Madge has signed the majority of these guys but he has done so with very few options available to him with the club seemingly on the nose and self imposed salary cap issues.
The club doesn’t need to make a decision about Madge, they need to make a decision from the board down throughout the organisation as to how serious they are about winning a competition.
If the answer is yes we are serious, then they need to identify who is willing to roll up the sleeves and get there and who isn’t.
To this end, as a fan, I would like to see them tell a few of these guys they won’t be at the WT next year.
But in reality it is not that simple.
I believe Hartigan is working towards this but it’s a long game as has been seen with the focus on development players.
I believe this intent has also been shown through our recent and well documented attempts to sign some prized targets - we have been selective with who we have approached, looking for specific skill sets to fill identified gaps in the roster.
Hopefully we can have some wins in this area soon.

Just as well we did not get Lattrell, Arrow, JAC or any other big name we have tried to sign with all these salary cap issues

We have just about come out the other side of those issues now. We were hamstrung until this year really.

 

[Telltails]

Reading a fair bit on WT sacking coaches and players only knowing such that just doesn't add up. Sheens was sacked in 2012 after nine seasons when no current players were in the squad and only two players were here when Taylor got the boot around Easter in 2017.

Those are the only sackings of a coach in about the time that one ages to be able to vote and drink alcohol, so there is no routine sacking of coaches and it certainly isn't normal practice at WT.

Yep we sacked Sheens after 10 years, didn’t renew Potter, sacked Taylor and Cleary left. That’s 2 sackings (in contract) in 18 years? It’s in the press so much everyone’s started to believe it.

We have not backed a coach through a rebuild starting with Sheens. Potter was not sacked but he was not given an option to continue after two seasons.JT two seasons and Cleary who knows. The fact remains that there are players who have not had any longevity and or no level of success and have become accustom to a new coach every couple of years with very little growth or accountability.

 

[BAGNF05]

Reading a fair bit on WT sacking coaches and players only knowing such that just doesn't add up. Sheens was sacked in 2012 after nine seasons when no current players were in the squad and only two players were here when Taylor got the boot around Easter in 2017.

Those are the only sackings of a coach in about the time that one ages to be able to vote and drink alcohol, so there is no routine sacking of coaches and it certainly isn't normal practice at WT.

Yep we sacked Sheens after 10 years, didn’t renew Potter, sacked Taylor and Cleary left. That’s 2 sackings (in contract) in 18 years? It’s in the press so much everyone’s started to believe it.

However you spin it we are churning through coaches every 2-3 years without giving them a squad good enough to win. It’s a pattern and the people doing it are failures.

 

[tony soprano]

Penrith sacked Griffen right before the finals & they were running 5th at the time.

Yep smart move to keep Nathan and other good players

 

[avocadoontoast]

Reading a fair bit on WT sacking coaches and players only knowing such that just doesn't add up. Sheens was sacked in 2012 after nine seasons when no current players were in the squad and only two players were here when Taylor got the boot around Easter in 2017.

Those are the only sackings of a coach in about the time that one ages to be able to vote and drink alcohol, so there is no routine sacking of coaches and it certainly isn't normal practice at WT.

Yep we sacked Sheens after 10 years, didn’t renew Potter, sacked Taylor and Cleary left. That’s 2 sackings (in contract) in 18 years? It’s in the press so much everyone’s started to believe it.

However you spin it we are churning through coaches every 2-3 years without giving them a squad good enough to win. It’s a pattern and the people doing it are failures.

I was just saying we don’t sack coaches like it’s reported

 

[GCfan]

Reading a fair bit on WT sacking coaches and players only knowing such that just doesn't add up. Sheens was sacked in 2012 after nine seasons when no current players were in the squad and only two players were here when Taylor got the boot around Easter in 2017.

Those are the only sackings of a coach in about the time that one ages to be able to vote and drink alcohol, so there is no routine sacking of coaches and it certainly isn't normal practice at WT.

Yep we sacked Sheens after 10 years, didn’t renew Potter, sacked Taylor and Cleary left. That’s 2 sackings (in contract) in 18 years? It’s in the press so much everyone’s started to believe it.

Guess it depends how you look at it. One could say we’ve had 4 coaches (and even 5 if Madge gets punted and a new coach comes in) in 8 or 9 years. That doesn’t sound good either. And The whole Potter situation is semantics really. Not being renewed is the same as being sacked. Or put it this way, if the club was happy with Potter do you think they would have not renewed his contract?

 

[BAGNF05]

Reading a fair bit on WT sacking coaches and players only knowing such that just doesn't add up. Sheens was sacked in 2012 after nine seasons when no current players were in the squad and only two players were here when Taylor got the boot around Easter in 2017.

Those are the only sackings of a coach in about the time that one ages to be able to vote and drink alcohol, so there is no routine sacking of coaches and it certainly isn't normal practice at WT.

Yep we sacked Sheens after 10 years, didn’t renew Potter, sacked Taylor and Cleary left. That’s 2 sackings (in contract) in 18 years? It’s in the press so much everyone’s started to believe it.

However you spin it we are churning through coaches every 2-3 years without giving them a squad good enough to win. It’s a pattern and the people doing it are failures.

I was just saying we don’t sack coaches like it’s reported

I haven’t read the reports that are being referred to but sacking Madge would be repeating what happened to Taylor and Potter, sacked/not renewed I don’t see the difference- failing to give them a strong roster and then moving on to a new coach and expecting a different outcome. It’s madness.

Cleary was different but ultimately same outcome.

 

[jirskyr]

Problem with Kent’s argument sack the players is Madge hired the majority of these sackable players. That’s important to remember.

Madge didn't hire so many of the players, he retained them. It's a different thing, you can't replace a player just because you feel like it, you have to have someone else lined up to adequately cover the gap.

So every coach in history has to maintain some of the roster they inherited, they can't change everything in 1-2 seasons. Madge has had two recruitment drives available to him since he joined (2020 and 2021), and the first one in particular was hamstrung by the contracts of Mbye, Packer, Mutalino, Reynolds. Reynolds was only cleared at the start of 2021. Plus the salary cap penalty from Farahgate; Madge wasn't even here.

It's a mistake to say that because the coach didn't cut every single ordinary player, that anyone he retained is "his player".

 

[WT2019]

Firstly,I cant support sacking the coach on biased opinion from people on a forum who have little or no knowledge of what truely is going on or being said at board level..
Secondly the critics who keep saying that this is his roster,Hartigan was employed so we purchase the best players available with money available..so its not all on Madge atm...
Thirdly ...Madge has identified with Hartigan the best possible youth to develope into NRL prospects...they are learning and developing as Madge gives them NRL debuts (Cini comes to mind)...
Lastly Madge has been seen numerous times with the KOE cup players and managers and is helping them along the way to becoming NRL standard players...

BUT lets keep talking sack the coach.....its what Wests Tigers do best...

Sort of agree but would like to know who are the players ‘white anting” Madge this year and how long are their contracts . Last year it was Benji. Who is it now ? The contenders would be MBye, Packer, Joey but how much influence would they have on the younger players?

 

[jirskyr]

Reading a fair bit on WT sacking coaches and players only knowing such that just doesn't add up. Sheens was sacked in 2012 after nine seasons when no current players were in the squad and only two players were here when Taylor got the boot around Easter in 2017.

Those are the only sackings of a coach in about the time that one ages to be able to vote and drink alcohol, so there is no routine sacking of coaches and it certainly isn't normal practice at WT.

Yep we sacked Sheens after 10 years, didn’t renew Potter, sacked Taylor and Cleary left. That’s 2 sackings (in contract) in 18 years? It’s in the press so much everyone’s started to believe it.

Some wiseguys started including Webster as well, the interim.

 

[Snake]

Maybe Maguire might survive if the players that are an issue contracted or not are removed !
But that is a big move and I doubt that the club has the stomach for that type of action !

 

[TrueTiger]

Firstly,I cant support sacking the coach on biased opinion from people on a forum who have little or no knowledge of what truely is going on or being said at board level..
Secondly the critics who keep saying that this is his roster,Hartigan was employed so we purchase the best players available with money available..so its not all on Madge atm...
Thirdly ...Madge has identified with Hartigan the best possible youth to develope into NRL prospects...they are learning and developing as Madge gives them NRL debuts (Cini comes to mind)...
Lastly Madge has been seen numerous times with the KOE cup players and managers and is helping them along the way to becoming NRL standard players...

BUT lets keep talking sack the coach.....its what Wests Tigers do best...

Sort of agree but would like to know who are the players ‘white anting” Madge this year and how long are their contracts . Last year it was Benji. Who is it now ? The contenders would be MBye, Packer, Joey but how much influence would they have on the younger players?

I dont know who in particular is whiteanting Madge,but I have always been taught to respect my peers...if this squad is failing to live up to their paychecks and not doing what the coach asks....then maybe they should get out or find another profession...after all they have chosen to play NRL as a career,if they can do better at coaching,then that should be the road they should choose and not play...

 

[mike]

Maybe Maguire might survive if the players that are an issue contracted or not are removed !
But that is a big move and I doubt that the club has the stomach for that type of action !

The club better have the stomach for it otherwise we are just repeating the same cycle we have been on for past 10+ years.

 

[momo_amp_medo]

Kent hit the nail on the head.

As noted by Moir previously, Noffa needs to go - and I’m all for it!

Him and Brooks have been there through all these changes.

It’s hard to criticise Brooks over the past month, he’s one of the only ones having a go.

Agree …. Brooks has been putting in …. Suggestion is just rubbish.

 

[momo_amp_medo]

Maybe Maguire might survive if the players that are an issue contracted or not are removed !
But that is a big move and I doubt that the club has the stomach for that type of action !

The club better have the stomach for it otherwise we are just repeating the same cycle we have been on for past 10+ years.

Any player found to be undermining the coach should be shown the door.
My view still remains that we have a good coach and the majority of the squad is ok. They both need time and addition of few experienced players to reach the next level.
I don’t expect major improvement this season …. the players are short on confidence and that’s not easy thing to wrestle back in the short term.
But after 4 difficult rounds behind us all we can hope for is some positive steps and improvements on the ladder.
Fingers crossed from me anyway.

 

[BZN]

I love Madge and will be disappointed if we part ways...really wanted him to bring us out of the hole but maybe we are just to too weak atm for his style...I reallly think we need to go for a coach with a great reputation and who players love...my two ideal options would be Wayne or filter...both would help us with attracting the right players

NOOOOOO to both


ciraldo or Flanagan?

Fittler and Bennett

Tbh I can’t really see any other coach changing this team besides tho two, due to their ability to get stars in the squad. Truth is we are a weak team...Madge is a good coach with an underperforming roster...imo no coach can get this team into the the top...so either stick with Madge and co and try and rebuild culture from the bottom down or get a high profile coach like Freddy or Wayne to attract top tier talent

Fittler is a dunce who does well at origin level due to the quality of players and it being more about motivation.

Wayne is not a rebuild coach and doesn't care about how he leaves a side when he finishes up. In fact I believe he likes them to crash and burn after he leaves.

They are the worst type of coaches for this club.

You can't be serious about Wayne Bennett @cochise?
What would a coach's motivation be to leave the club in a mess after they leave?
Wouldn't that be a sure fire way of not getting another coaching position?
As far as I can see Bennett is still respected.

 

[BZN]

Madge going nowhere.

The club is in the verge of sustained success.

Reworked roster based on youth.
Salary cap relief
Pathways investment
Tom Sheens
Reserve team performing well.

There not gonna dump a tough coach for a nobody or rookie now.

I'm intrigued why you believe a 'tough coach' gets results? Clearly it is not working.

Phil Gould said on ch9 this morning, one thing that is common in the bottom teams is a lack of mental toughness from the players when the pressure is on during a game, so they panic and their game falls apart.
Imo Madge would be trying to instill that in our players, but their either dumb or their rebelling because they have to work to hard.

 

[hobbo1]

Madge going nowhere.

The club is in the verge of sustained success.

Reworked roster based on youth.
Salary cap relief
Pathways investment
Tom Sheens
Reserve team performing well.

There not gonna dump a tough coach for a nobody or rookie now.

I'm intrigued why you believe a 'tough coach' gets results? Clearly it is not working.

Phil Gould said on ch9 this morning, one thing that is common in the bottom teams is a lack of mental toughness from the players when the pressure is on during a game, so they panic and their game falls apart.
Imo Madge would be trying to instill that in our players, but their either dumb or their rebelling because they have to work to hard.

Both