Madge Maguire - Mega Thread

[851]

It has been said here that Ciraldo has overseen the best defensive team in the NRL but nobody knows how he would go with inferior players. As an example, look at the Penrith Parramatta final and you wouldn't see better defence than either side put up. Now, look at the assistants at those clubs and Ciraldo did really well but Parra had David Kidwell, who was a past defence coach at the Tigers and he did equally well in that game.
BUT Kidwell was a disaster as defence coach at the Wests Tigers. My point is that any reasonable coach can do well if he has a quality roster and it is the roster that needs improving under any future or present coach before we will have any success.

Yeah very good point.
Signing Ciraldo would be an enormous risk.

Keeping Madge after 3 years of getting worse each year he has been here is a far greater risk, one we can't really afford

We’ll see.
I’m not arguing Madge should stay.
I’m arguing that a rookie coach is an unacceptable risk in this particular club.

Flanagan over Ciraldo ?

We've heard the boys club Rumours for years and i think Ciraldo would thrive in that, make him feel young again... let the boys get away with murder and run the show.

Need some dry footy head like Flanno.
Aside from the drug use issues, he seems like a staunch footballing mind.

Have Kimmorley and Farah by his side and we got some real smarts in the coaching box.

I would be happy with either of them, both I think would attract some players, something we can't do now

 

[Plisskin]

It has been said here that Ciraldo has overseen the best defensive team in the NRL but nobody knows how he would go with inferior players. As an example, look at the Penrith Parramatta final and you wouldn't see better defence than either side put up. Now, look at the assistants at those clubs and Ciraldo did really well but Parra had David Kidwell, who was a past defence coach at the Tigers and he did equally well in that game.
BUT Kidwell was a disaster as defence coach at the Wests Tigers. My point is that any reasonable coach can do well if he has a quality roster and it is the roster that needs improving under any future or present coach before we will have any success.

Yeah very good point.
Signing Ciraldo would be an enormous risk.

Every option is a large risk.

True but the green coaches are an unacceptable risk

Believe me I have thought that for a long time.

Taking on a Ciraldo or ESL coach is a risk because their experience in NRL as a head coach, with this squad is completely unknown.

Retaining Madge is a huge risk because his experience as a head coach of the Wests Tigers, with this squad is completely known.

One risk is unknown, the other is known. Past performance is the best indicator of future performances. Which do you hitch your wagon to?

That is not how risk assessment works.

Mate, Im not going to engage with you but I do risk assessment every day for a living. 100% risk assessment in based on known risks, not imagined risks.

I do them as well, and you are right

Sorry but risk assessment conducted on stuff that is already known is half arsed. I say this because a known known - in other words facts, (in this case, the historical tenure and future educated predictions related to Madges coaching), can be managed and are not fundamentally risks. Other factors must be considered relating to uncertainty of impacts and consequences, (in this case, a rookie coach) which is what supplies your classic risk. Mitigation strategies can be formed through investigative research, benchmarking etc but the probabilities of failure are certainly higher.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

 

[Needaname]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

 

[Plisskin]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

Can he play 80?

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

 

[Demps]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Blayke Brailey off contact after 2022...

There's a 9 sorted.

 

[2041]

Actually a decent article for Hooper and tend to agree

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-premiership/teams/tigers/hoops-maguires-messy-divorce-from-tigers-is-nearly-done-and-this-was-the-final-straw/news-story/5b468673678b41410e5a8471b99e3915

If you are being objective and not just hating on Hooper, then it is hard to argue against what he said

I think it's a decent assessment. Lots of people seem to miss the fact that two things can both be true at the same time: (1) that the Tigers are in a state and lots of things still need fixing, and (2) that Maguire isn't the right coach. I don't think getting rid of Maguire is going to solve all our problems, but equally I don't think keeping him is going to help.

The other thing I see a lot is people wanting to somehow punish the players. It's like: it's the players' fault Maguire hasn't got anything out of them, so they should be forced to work under Maguire. I totally understand anger with some of the players - they've underperformed for years. But we have to be realistic. We can't sack the whole playing staff, so what we need is a coach who can get something out of what we've got and maybe even be a net positive in trying to attract new players we actually want. Maguire doesn't seem to be either of those things.

I was initially very against getting rid of Maguire. But facts are facts: this is his roster, performance has gone backwards and he hasn't been able to get a defence on the park that doesn't ship 30+ points a week to everyone. It's just not good enough.

Of course Pascoe should probably go, too. But we can't refuse to try to improve one thing on the basis that we aren't fixing everything.

 

[WT2K]

Wests Tigers board expected to make call on Michael Maguire’s future at meeting later today
https://twitter.com/brentread_7/status/1439783385317056514?s=19

How can they make a call when the most advnaced technogy they have in the room is carrier pigeon

Id like to request a new poll if Madge gets sacked. Cheers, boss man

 

[weststigerman]

If the reason for the roadblock to recruitment has been identified then the Board has no other course of action than to remove it.

That roadblock is Wests Tigers I’m afraid…

Elite players don’t want to play for us..you just need to look at the players who have left for your answer

I'd be surprised if the review did not include discussions with player managers.


I would be horrified if they did speak to player managers.Its the player managers who dig a hole and throw the club in it,they only care about the themselves and getting a lucrative slice out of their clients (Players and Coaches).Player managers are a very large part of the problem and you want to get their advice.AMAZING

Player mangers are apart of the NRL landscape. I'd expect Hartigan or Sheens to be having ongoing discussions in an attempt to improve our roster. Providing feedback on road blocks seems a proactive and measured approach. Why alienate a group we need? They need WTs as we have a large amount of $ to spend.


I would hope even our board would not be dumb enough to take advice from player managers.They do not work for a clubs best interest despite the spin you put on it

If the board is like any other board I've dealt with, they will rubber stamp whatever the "review committee" advise that should be done.

This is for 2 reasons:
1. They are not close enough to the problem or lack the expertise to make a call
2. The people making the recommendations on the decision are accountable the outcome



Somehow at WT, Pascoe has managed to absolve himself from any accountability for Losing Tedesco, Farah Debacle, Hiring Ivan, Hiring Madge etc so obviously this board are not strong on the second point.

 

[gallagher]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Bronson Xerri.

 

[weststigerman]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Lachlan Lewis?

 

[weststigerman]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Bronson Xerri.

May as well rename the "Centre of Excellence" to the "Centre of Enhancements".

 

[gallagher]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Lachlan Lewis?

Yuk, you should get a downvote for that

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Bronson Xerri.

May as well rename the "Centre of Excellence" to the "Centre of Enhancements".

Admit it though, a centre pairing of Xerri and Scott would have most WTs' fans salivating. Perhaps the best centre pairing in the NRL.

 

[weststigerman]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Lachlan Lewis?

Yuk, you should get a downvote for that

It was a guess on who the "mate" is. I don't want him here.

 

[TheDaBoss]

Wests Tigers board expected to make call on Michael Maguire’s future at meeting later today
https://twitter.com/brentread_7/status/1439783385317056514?s=19

How can they make a call when the most advnaced technogy they have in the room is carrier pigeon

Id like to request a new poll if Madge gets sacked. Cheers, boss man

Yep what will it be?

 

[weststigerman]

Heard the same optimism when Madge was linked to us. It’s going to end in tears whoever it is. If it’s Flanagan, when he fails it will be his fault.

7 Kyle Flannagan ?

The threads are going to be great.

Kyle played a lot of his junior footy at hooker like his father.

Your not suggesting he would be a better hooker than Liddle?

No. I believe there were unrealistic expectations placed upon him when he signed with the Roosters. I believe he has much to offer in the utility role. Also you get Kyle, his mate will most likely end up with him.

Who's that?

Bronson Xerri.

May as well rename the "Centre of Excellence" to the "Centre of Enhancements".

Admit it though, a centre pairing of Xerri and Scott would have most WTs' fans salivating. Perhaps the best centre pairing in the NRL.

Nah I think I'd prefer Burton and Crichton. I'd want to see how good Xerri is without the juice.

 

[TillLindemann]

The obfuscation blaming the Board and anyone else except Maguire has reached new heights, even for this Forum.

I could not care less if Maguire is replaced but if you think that will change Wests Tigers .. think again…

Very good financial position. tick
COE at Concord and Campbelltown tick tick
Great junior recruitment tick
Hartigan and Sheens onboard tick
New coach - hopefully sorted this week. tick

There are very positive changes happening.

Since you like quoting Gus so much I'll leave this here.



Gus has 100% interest in ensuring the Tigers remain a bad place. He did that at the Panthers before leaving and will do it at the Bulldogs. His primary job now is the Bulldogs. If we look good that impacts the Bulldogs.

He's still right though. A new coach won't change things, we've been down this road how many times?