Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[Rambo2714]

Tony Abbott is a massive problem for the Libs and potentially Australia . Voters Know it and he is subsequently putting downward pressure on the popularity of the lib party and disuading people from Voting for them at future elections .

Abbott only won the last lib leadership ballot by 1 Vote , so half his party colleagues dont want him . For that reason it is a certaininty that Turnbull is biding his time waiting for the right momnet to pounce. So when will Tunbull Finaly Challeng for the leadership ? Or will someone else beat him to it ? Hockey ? Nelson ?

What are the Libs Going to do about Abbots Lack or leadership Ability ?

 

[stryker]

Also under Labor Govt is a service not a business , so business experience is irrelevant . How about measuring parliamentary experience wouldn't that be relevant ?
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Yes it is relevant. They are a group of very well versed politicians. Gillard is one of the best that has ever come on the scene. She is manipulative, she is condescending, she is distrustful and utterly coniving. That is why the public hate her. The fact that most wanted Rudd back in speaks volumes as he is very little better.

Labor are fantastic at creating policies but let themselves down with their totally incompetent implementation of them. This is where the business world is not irrelevant.

They never perform a feasibility study (business world), they have no plans in place to properly manage these projects (business world), their scope statements, budget forecasts, risk assessments are non existent (all business world related activities). They have no reporting structures, no time scheduling, no quality management systems, no end dates or closure conditions. They dont assess, analyse or manage….they just go straight from concept to execution, then when it all goes to crap they shut it down and walk away.

So yes Rambo, when they are spending tens of billions of dollars of our money I ask that it be done efficiently and effectively. Thats why people with business experience would be by far more beneficial than those with only parliamentary or public service experience.

Effectively they are a fat kid in a lollie shop with their dads stolen credit card....and that is dangerous.

 

[Flippedy]

Also under Labor Govt is a service not a business , so business experience is irrelevant . How about measuring parliamentary experience wouldn't that be relevant ?
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Yes it is relevant. They are a group of very well versed politicians. **Gillard is one of the best that has ever come on the scene. She is manipulative, she is condescending, she is distrustful and utterly coniving.** **That is why the public hate her**. The fact that most wanted Rudd back in speaks volumes as he is very little better.

Labor are fantastic at creating policies but let themselves down with their totally incompetent implementation of them. This is where the business world is not irrelevant.

They never perform a feasibility study (business world), they have no plans in place to properly manage these projects (business world), their scope statements, budget forecasts, risk assessments are non existent (all business world related activities). They have no reporting structures, no time scheduling, no quality management systems, no end dates or closure conditions. They dont assess, analyse or manage….they just go straight from concept to execution, then when it all goes to crap they shut it down and walk away.

So yes Rambo, when they are spending tens of billions of dollars of our money I ask that it be done efficiently and effectively. Thats why people with business experience would be by far more beneficial than those with only parliamentary or public service experience.

Effectively they are a fat kid in a lollie shop with their dads stolen credit card....and that is dangerous.

So was Howard, yet he was acceptable to the majority of the general public for a long time. What is different? The Party? The gender? The age? The personality? Or did one of them just cover up their manipulations and conniving ways so well that few people noticed?

 

[hammertime]

So was Howard, yet he was acceptable to the majority of the general public for a long time. What is different? The Party? The gender? The age? The personality? Or did one of them just cover up their manipulations and conniving ways so well that few people noticed?

Howard never stabbed his predecessor in the back, he didn't cover up criminal activity of one of their members, nor did he go to any election on a lie. Yes, he apparently made up the Children overboard scandal. But Labor have also been in for only 1 1/2 terms… not long! He is no where near as bad.

I think the thing that simply amplifies the hate towards labor is just the waste mate. For me that's it. Howard tested all his policies and always wanted to do things right. e.g. The Liberals studied creating a NBN for a long time.

I hate when Labor say they have 'foresight' to create this. The plain truth is that Howard never implemented due to the cost benefit not stacking up!! There are very little business uses to argue for faster broadband.

Labor are just more irresponsible when it comes to spending other peoples money. They always take the easy road, unless they have to cut a deal with the Greens to hold power.

 

[Yossarian]

So was Howard, yet he was acceptable to the majority of the general public for a long time. What is different? The Party? The gender? The age? The personality? Or did one of them just cover up their manipulations and conniving ways so well that few people noticed?

Howard never stabbed his predecessor in the back.

You better let Andrew Peacock know about this…

 

[Flippedy]

So was Howard, yet he was acceptable to the majority of the general public for a long time. What is different? The Party? The gender? The age? The personality? Or did one of them just cover up their manipulations and conniving ways so well that few people noticed?

Howard never stabbed his predecessor in the back, he didn't cover up criminal activity of one of their members, nor did he go to any election on a lie. Yes, he apparently made up the Children overboard scandal. But Labor have also been in for only 1 1/2 terms… not long! He is no where near as bad.

I think the thing that simply amplifies the hate towards labor is just the waste mate. For me that's it. Howard tested all his policies and always wanted to do things right. e.g. The Liberals studied creating a NBN for a long time.

I hate when Labor say they have 'foresight' to create this. The plain truth is that Howard never implemented due to the cost benefit not stacking up!! There are very little business uses to argue for faster broadband.

Labor are just more irresponsible when it comes to spending other peoples money. They always take the easy road, unless they have to cut a deal with the Greens to hold power.

Yes Hammer, Howard did lie about the children overboard and it was, also, the gullibility of Howard that rendered our entire country to blindly follow Bush and the US into a supposed ‘War on Terror’ when they invaded Iraq.

George Bush and Tony Blair believed in the non-sensical arguments supplied by Neo-Con intellectuals and the intelligence disinformation supplied by the exiles linked to the Iraqi National Congress. After Sept 11, John Howard pledged an oath of devotion to the US. From that moment, in the prosecution of the War on Terrorism, he was willing to believe anything and everything the Americans happened to believe. He had willingly suspended his capacity for disbelief. Imo, Howard was on a power trip, driven purely by his selfish ambition to be internationally recognised and ‘patted on the head’ by the leader of the free world. Sit, Ubu, sit!

Countless innocent lives have been (and still are being) lost because of the atrocious decision of the US to enact war on a nation of people that had nothing to do with Sept 11\. Our illustrious leader, of the time, followed on blindly, not giving any thought or reason of his own for doing so.

Also, offical US documents, which were released last year, prove that the Howard Govt, had interfered in the terrorism case of David Hicks. The documents claim that Australian Govt officials knew that Hicks was innocent, yet they bowed to the pressure from the US Govt to have quote - “something pinned on him” – unquote. While the British Govt were fighting for their citizens to be repatriated back into the UK, our govt was colluding with US officials to invent a charge, so they could make an example of Hicks. Now there’s someone you would want to have on your side when you’re in a fix!

I get that Labor Governments, past and present, have a tendency to spend too much of our ‘hard earned’ and they often make some big blunders in doing so, but I don’t recall a Labor Govt, in recent times, ever making decisions or policies that have, directly or indirectly, led to the death and suffering of thousands of people worldwide – please correct me if I’m wrong. The mistakes, manipulations, cover ups and lies of John Howard’s Govt may have been fewer than our present Gillard Govt, but all of them have resulted in gross violations of human rights. I guess none of this matters to the majority of Australians, though, as long as the economy is good for us all here in Oz :unamused:

 

[happy_tiger]

So was Howard, yet he was acceptable to the majority of the general public for a long time. What is different? The Party? The gender? The age? The personality? Or did one of them just cover up their manipulations and conniving ways so well that few people noticed?

Howard never stabbed his predecessor in the back, he didn't cover up criminal activity of one of their members, nor did he go to any election on a lie. Yes, he apparently made up the Children overboard scandal. But Labor have also been in for only 1 1/2 terms… not long! He is no where near as bad.

I think the thing that simply amplifies the hate towards labor is just the waste mate. For me that's it. Howard tested all his policies and always wanted to do things right. e.g. The Liberals studied creating a NBN for a long time.

I hate when Labor say they have 'foresight' to create this. The plain truth is that Howard never implemented due to the cost benefit not stacking up!! There are very little business uses to argue for faster broadband.

Labor are just more irresponsible when it comes to spending other peoples money. They always take the easy road, unless they have to cut a deal with the Greens to hold power.

Yes Hammer, Howard did lie about the children overboard and it was, also, the gullibility of Howard that rendered our entire country to blindly follow Bush and the US into a supposed ‘War on Terror’ when they invaded Iraq.

George Bush and Tony Blair believed in the non-sensical arguments supplied by Neo-Con intellectuals and the intelligence disinformation supplied by the exiles linked to the Iraqi National Congress. After Sept 11, John Howard pledged an oath of devotion to the US. From that moment, in the prosecution of the War on Terrorism, he was willing to believe anything and everything the Americans happened to believe. He had willingly suspended his capacity for disbelief. Imo, Howard was on a power trip, driven purely by his selfish ambition to be internationally recognised and ‘patted on the head’ by the leader of the free world. Sit, Ubu, sit!

Countless innocent lives have been (and still are being) lost because of the atrocious decision of the US to enact war on a nation of people that had nothing to do with Sept 11\. Our illustrious leader, of the time, followed on blindly, not giving any thought or reason of his own for doing so.

Also, offical US documents, which were released last year, prove that the Howard Govt, had interfered in the terrorism case of David Hicks. The documents claim that Australian Govt officials knew that Hicks was innocent, yet they bowed to the pressure from the US Govt to have quote - “something pinned on him” – unquote. While the British Govt were fighting for their citizens to be repatriated back into the UK, our govt was colluding with US officials to invent a charge, so they could make an example of Hicks. Now there’s someone you would want to have on your side when you’re in a fix!

I get that Labor Governments, past and present, have a tendency to spend too much of our ‘hard earned’ and they often make some big blunders in doing so, but I don’t recall a Labor Govt, in recent times, ever making decisions or policies that have, directly or indirectly, led to the death and suffering of thousands of people worldwide – please correct me if I’m wrong. The mistakes, manipulations, cover ups and lies of John Howard’s Govt may have been fewer than our present Gillard Govt, but all of them have resulted in gross violations of human rights. I guess none of this matters to the majority of Australians, though, as long as the economy is good for us all here in Oz :unamused:

Flip it is all starting to make sense A broncos lover and a Labor supporter What next ??

 

[Rambo2714]

Bravo Flipedy ! Well said !!

As most know , and the rest choose to ignore , conservatism or the Liberal Party in Aus seek to represent NO morality or positive ethic in any thing they do.

Howard was a good example of an Authentic Conservative which = NIL morality IE Temp protection visas , waging war on already weak and impoverished nations , introducing regressive taxes such as GST … And the list goes on = NIL MORALITY .

Abbott is another example of a person who believes that so long as he gets his elitist god fearing ass to an evangillical church every Sunday , What ever he does the other days of the week is OK.

So far in this parliament in which power is SHARED , Abbott and the libs have FAILED to make any constructive contribution to single a policy . And even when invited to the table to speak about immigration laws , the libs deliberately " played for a draw " because they concluded that it was better for thier party if boats keep coming to Australia . In doing so they demonstrated that they are not interested in governing for the benefit of the popultation . But only for the enrichment of Themselves as individuals . Further more by having no policy agenda they are declaring that they have no mandate to Govern .

ATM they remind me a lot of the NSW libs under Peter Debenham ..... Both by the style of leader they chooses ? ( IE; Slightly disabled , and entitled to a disability pension which only a labour Govt would fund ) . And also by being a policy less party .

And we all know what happened to that mob , lost the next 2 elections which were supposedly unlosable .

So when are the libs gona return Turnbull to his rightful position as leader ? When ate they going to offer a real option as leader ?
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[Yossarian]

Bob Carr WILL now take his place in the senate and be our new foreign minister…

 

[system]

Upside. If the Earth is invaded by Praying Mantis looking aliens we are in the best position to survive as he looks like one of their own. :slight_smile:

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Upside. If the Earth is invaded by Praying Mantis looking aliens we are in the best position to survive as he looks like one of their own. :slight_smile:

:laughing:

Doesn't look as though he's aged since he left State politics.

What's everyone make of the move?

 

[tomcat]

Bob Carr ??? The government that bankrupted the country is now seeking assistance from the Premier who bankrupted the state. :crazy

 

[tomcat]

I'm confused, yesterday Bob Carr had never been approached to be foreign minister, today he IS foreign minister I've got no doubt Julie Gillard was telling the truth when she said she did not approach Bob Carr with the offer of a senate seat and the foreign affairs ministry. As time goes on, it is becoming more and more obvious that Julia Gillard is a mere puppet - the government is being run by the so called "faceless men" of the Labour Party. The only question I have is whether Julie Gillard is a willing party to this and if so, what is the pay off for continually being made a fool of by these cowards who want the power but are too gutless to show their faces to the electorate and take responsibility for their decisions

 

[Swordy]

Don't be confused, it is one lie after another. Carr give it to NSW from behind, and he will be doing the same thing to the country in federal politics. This is the same man that made NSW such a good place to invest, he took his own personal wealth and invested it in NZ. He also collects a NSW Parliament hefty salary until retirement, a hefty consultant fee from Macquarie bank, and now federal money as a politician. I find it interesting that Bob Brown, Penny Wong, Andrew Wilkie and now Bob Carr is in federal politics. You work out the link.

And just for those a little confused about Abbott. He did not win the last leadership ballot by one vote. At the last vote, he was re-elected unopposed.

And by the way, THERE IS NO 'U' in Labor!!!!!! In fact, that should be there slogan. 'U' are not part of Labor!!!

Everyone has the right to vote as they wish, but surely even staunch 10th generation Labor voters are looking around.

 

[tomcat]

I find it interesting that Bob Brown, Penny Wong, Andrew Wilkie and now Bob Carr is in federal politics.

should that read ARE in federal politics ??

 

[tomcat]

Don't be confused, it is one lie after another. Carr give it to NSW from behind, and he will be doing the same thing to the country in federal politics. This is the same man that made NSW such a good place to invest, he took his own personal wealth and invested it in NZ. He also collects a NSW Parliament hefty salary until retirement, a hefty consultant fee from Macquarie bank, and now federal money as a politician. I find it interesting that Bob Brown, Penny Wong, Andrew Wilkie and now Bob Carr is in federal politics. You work out the link.

And just for those a little confused about Abbott. He did not win the last leadership ballot by one vote. At the last vote, he was re-elected unopposed.

And by the way, THERE IS NO 'U' in Labor!!!!!! In fact, that should be there slogan. 'U' are not part of Labor!!!

Everyone has the right to vote as they wish, but surely even staunch 10th generation Labor voters are looking around.

Everybody does LABOUR under LABOR !!!

 

[Swordy]

I find it interesting that Bob Brown, Penny Wong, Andrew Wilkie and now Bob Carr is in federal politics.

should that read ARE in federal politics ??

With a bit of luck, it will be WERE!

 

[happy_tiger]

Don't be confused, it is one lie after another. Carr give it to NSW from behind, and he will be doing the same thing to the country in federal politics. This is the same man that made NSW such a good place to invest, he took his own personal wealth and invested it in NZ. He also collects a NSW Parliament hefty salary until retirement, a hefty consultant fee from Macquarie bank, and now federal money as a politician. I find it interesting that Bob Brown, Penny Wong, Andrew Wilkie and now Bob Carr is in federal politics. You work out the link.

And just for those a little confused about Abbott. He did not win the last leadership ballot by one vote. At the last vote, he was re-elected unopposed.

And by the way, THERE IS NO 'U' in Labor!!!!!! In fact, that should be there slogan. 'U' are not part of Labor!!!

Everyone has the right to vote as they wish, but surely even staunch 10th generation Labor voters are looking around.

I love it when Labour supporters get angry about putting the U in Labour There should be an I in Labor because that's are concerned about

 

[Yossarian]

I'm confused, yesterday Bob Carr had never been approached to be foreign minister, today he IS foreign minister I've got no doubt Julie Gillard was telling the truth when she said she did not approach Bob Carr with the offer of a senate seat and the foreign affairs ministry. As time goes on, it is becoming more and more obvious that Julia Gillard is a mere puppet - the government is being run by the so called "faceless men" of the Labour Party. The only question I have is whether Julie Gillard is a willing party to this and if so, what is the pay off for continually being made a fool of by these cowards who want the power but are too gutless to show their faces to the electorate and take responsibility for their decisions

Senate replacements are ALWAYS handled by the state offices. That applies to the ALP and the Liberal Party. So your rant is extremely misguided - you think Abbott has any control over who a Liberal state office would appoint to replace an outgoing senator? Faceless men indeed! In this case the decision to appoint a replacement Senator was handled by the NSW ALP secretary (his name is Sam Dastyari as has been very widely reported. A quick check of Google will reveal he has a face). Dastyari obviously couldn't guarantee him the FM position.

What was reported was Carr hadn't discussed it with Gillard when they first talked (this may or may not be true). It had been discussed between Dastyari and Carr, and probably between Dastyari and Gillard. So presumably the context had been established by the time Gillard and Carr spoke.

 

[Yossarian]

I find it interesting that Bob Brown, Penny Wong, Andrew Wilkie and now Bob Carr is in federal politics.

should that read ARE in federal politics ??

What are you getting at? Would you like a dog whistle or would you like to explain what you mean?