Curly_Tiger
Well-known member
Very true but many are terrified of being labelled one
Referendum 2023
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Winston Churchill
Well-known member
Its a badge of honour these days. If a lefty flippantly calls you a racist it means you are above the target.
Coastie_Tiger
Well-known member
Well at least not to me it doesnt, when i saw the news grab of Albo and the ALF guy Michael Long?? after his walk he did in favour of the voice. Albo explained it as one hand shaking the other, it was in the most awkward and disingenuous thing ive ever seen. I feel like the devil is in the detail and you probably have to dig way down to find out exactly what that is.
I also thought Aboriginals were already recognized in the constitution and therefore covered as a normal citizen. They already get extra assistance and fair enough i understand that it seems warranted to close the gap, but extra division i don't think helps anyone. I really dislike this is being painted as two sides, we are all humans last time i checked we share the same country.
If yes vote gets up i can see it being a problem moving forward and if it doesn't get up it will cause a problems moving forward because the majority will be painted as racists.
This could turn into apartheid Lite 2.0, perhaps that's a little melodramatic but it will cause more issues than it solves.
Tim Sheens
Well-known member
What the actual. Imagine posting so many times in this thread, whilst not even knowing that race was part of the constitution. That along with others that are flat out ideologues, as clearly shown by one promoting a lie he has long quoted at the bottom of each and every post.
Talk about good faith, I always post in good faith, based on facts, just as I did above to inform others, including the oblivious you. It has been there since inception, still is, and the change related to removal of a handful of words relating to state powers, yet you try and contort that as well.
I wholeheartedly agree with this. The matter at hand, and what determines stance, hinges on an individual's perspective and context. This ultimately boils down to people's outlook on the subject, and it's disheartening to witness how misinformation can significantly hinder the ability to fully gain important details around all facets of the matter.I continue to believe voting yes is best for country and indigenous people.
Interesting though how successful no campaign has been:
I think most wouldn't have read the constitution or been interested in it or ever really considered the many complexities and vagaries within the document, yet we stand as defenders of the constitution against people with much greater expertise in constitutional law (such as former shadow attorney general, Julian leeser) who argue it is not constitutionally problematic.
I could post numerous articles on this but it's easy enough to dismiss these people. To conservatives, I'd recommend reading this Leeser interview.
'No campaign debating everything but the Voice', says Liberal MP
Liberal MP Julian Leeser has claimed those that are campaigning against the Voice are "arguing about everything but the constitutional amendment".www.google.com
Now the no campaign is moving on to say '70%' of indigenous people are voting no (Price in the above linked interview). I can't claim any such specific figure, but every indigenous person I know is a 'yes' and there's no question except the usual scepticism that it probably won't be allowed to have as much influence on indigenous policies as it should. To me it feels really disingenuous for her to be claiming that number.
Fact check: Do the polls show that Indigenous support for the Voice is between 80 and 90 per cent?
Prime Minister Anthony Albanese has claimed surveys show Indigenous Australians support the Voice at a rate between 80 and 90 per cent. Is that correct? RMIT ABC Fact Check investigates.www.abc.net.au
Totally accept polls are unreliable and would be even harder for measuring indigenous opinion, but I don't believe Price's claim and I don't think it's acceptable for her to just randomly quote unsupported numbers while at the same time deriding others for supposed deceptions.
Anyway, just my once in a while rant. I wish debate was more focused on the issue. I really think we need a better approach to Indigenous policies. I think giving a voice to Indigenous people is a great start.
Same, I’m not seeing a better approach/alternative on offer. This would establish a firm and enduring commitment to addressing the more profound problems faced by Indigenous communities. While various policies and initiatives have been attempted in the past, they often lack the necessary legal and institutional strength to effect lasting change. Rather than susceptibility or possible instability this would elevate these concerns to a level of permanence and significance that surpasses the ebbs and flows of political change.
I believe that maintaining a balance between the autonomy of diverse communities and national cohesion is the cornerstone of our nation's functionality. This equilibrium is already achieved through various means, including inclusive education policies and state legislations, all of which exemplify the principle of coexistence.
To me, it's akin to providing accommodations in education, such as installing ramps for students in wheelchairs, offering support classes, or modifying learning materials for ESL students. These measures demonstrate how diverse needs can exist within a broader framework, promoting fairness and equal opportunity for all.
Another perspective, on the other side of the coin, is seen in state legislations, where residents from different states (like Queensland and New South Wales) have separate laws. Yet, this also demonstrates coexistence within a national framework, recognising that unique regional needs and circumstances can coexist while upholding a sense of national unity and fairness in the legal system.
So just as these accommodations and state-specific laws are generally seen as fair and necessary rather than preferential treatment, I believe that the Voice to Parliament, in its aim to ensure fairness and equal opportunity for all, would operate with the concept of inclusivity and coexistence. It wouldn't weaken national cohesion but strengthen it by accommodating the diverse perspectives and needs that make our nation unique.
At its core, the Voice to Parliament proposal fundamentally addresses whether Indigenous communities should have a say in influencing policies directly affecting them. This would not only have profound social and political implications but would also reflect Australia's ongoing journey toward reconciliation, inclusivity, and equity.
Regardless of the outcome this is where I hope the four more pressing issues are treated urgently.
For those interested.
www.abc.net.au
www.theguardian.com
The Voice campaign has generated much misinformation. Here it is, debunked, all in one place
The Voice to Parliament referendum has been a major source of misinformation. As early voting opens next week, here are the key pieces of misinformation.
www.abc.net.au
What is the Indigenous voice to parliament, how would it work, and what happens next?
Here’s what we know so far about how the Albanese government hopes to enshrine an Indigenous voice in the constitution via a referendum
www.theguardian.com
Winston Churchill
Well-known member
ABC and the Guardian.......reputable sources with no far left leaning bias of course. 🤣For those intersected.
The Voice campaign has generated much misinformation. Here it is, debunked, all in one place
The Voice to Parliament referendum has been a major source of misinformation. As early voting opens next week, here are the key pieces of misinformation.What is the Indigenous voice to parliament, how would it work, and what happens next?
Here’s what we know so far about how the Albanese government hopes to enshrine an Indigenous voice in the constitution via a referendum
Don't be rude/cheeky you. It was seriously hard to find fact checking stuff without mention of Jacinta Nampijinpa Price - refuting her claims, so wanted to try and share some impartial content.
Please feel free to share similar content though.
Fallen Angel
Well-known member
Are there any outlets that aren’t biased one way or the other?
Winston Churchill
Well-known member
Winston Churchill
Well-known member
share some impartial content = by posting ABC and The Guardian. Seems legit
Winston Churchill
Well-known member
Voting no for the ‘racist’ Indigenous Voice is ‘sensible’
Sky News host Rowan Dean says voting no in the upcoming referendum on an Indigenous Voice to Parliament is the “sensible thing to do”. “Because it is racist, and we don’t like racism,” he said.
www.skynews.com.au
Found some impartial sources
ABC and SBS - Absolutely biased coverage.
YES campaign = Small target politics. Dont tell the people anything. All about the feeling.
Enshrined in the constitution is to much to just give 3% of the Population an blank cheque.
All Australians are Equal.
Fallen Angel
Well-known member
Thomas Mayo
Pro communists, We will force them with their own rulebook, Pay the Rent.
Quick google search gives me this
Check out this great compellation of quotes
Pro communists, We will force them with their own rulebook, Pay the Rent.
Quick google search gives me this
Check out this great compellation of quotes
Sorry Winston, could've clarified better but meant (material) that wasn't just referencing Jacinta and Warren. It's hard to find as most refutes are aimed at them.
crazycat
Well-known member
Meanwhile back to the voice. We have Indigenous men living 8 years less then the Australian average
What's the No campaigns solution here? All i have heard is a big fat Nothing.
twentyforty
Well-known member
🤔 so Linda Burney will be giving advice to the voice? Isn’t that similar to getting in a guard dog and doing the barking yourself?For those intersected.
The Voice campaign has generated much misinformation. Here it is, debunked, all in one place
The Voice to Parliament referendum has been a major source of misinformation. As early voting opens next week, here are the key pieces of misinformation.What is the Indigenous voice to parliament, how would it work, and what happens next?
Here’s what we know so far about how the Albanese government hopes to enshrine an Indigenous voice in the constitution via a referendum
The ABC has pedalled some misinformation as well. It’s not a one sided affair.
Curly_Tiger
Well-known member
Yes won’t change thatMeanwhile back to the voice. We have Indigenous men living 8 years less then the Australian average
What's the No campaigns solution here? All i have heard is a big fat Nothing.
Tiger-ferret
Well-known member
Any individual who doesn’t look after themself will have a lower life expectancy.Meanwhile back to the voice. We have Indigenous men living 8 years less then the Australian average
What's the No campaigns solution here? All i have heard is a big fat Nothing.
If a group of people are 3x more likely to smoke then that’s a start.
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