Teddy, moses, & brooks

[foreveratiger]

Yep that's it…..If we don't get some TPA's? We are going to struggle to hold onto them all as there value is only going to go up and other Clubs will be prowling around.

 

[sunshine_coast_tiger]

Very hard for any club to keep three or four top shelve players on there books and still have enough cap space to put a good team around them. The better we go the more the value of the next tier of players rises.

As I said in another post,every dollar over what they had planned to spend on the 6 and 7 (if they sign) will come out of another players contract. They also have to be in the position to have a real crack at Teddy when he next comes off contract because he will not come cheap

It really isn't that hard. Look at the roster of the Broncos, Cowboys, Souths, Storm etc.

To do it you need to take full advantage of the loop hole of Third Party Agreements (TPAs). These allow you if used correctly within the guidelines to have a squad that is paid well above the Salary Cap.

For example if you pay Tedesco $700,000 a year but can put him in the cap at $400,000 and have the remaining $300,000 paid by TPA you can use that extra $300,000 under the Salary Cap on other players. Broncos have been doing this for years, lets you keep star players and have a better squad around them. It was rumoured that Darren Lockyer in his last contract at the Broncos was on close to $1,000,000 and year but in the salary cap at $350,000 with the rest TPA money.

We just need smart management to take advantage of TPAs, the young talent we have are marketable and it shouldn't be hard to do (actually if management can't do it we need better management). Believe me if any of them go to another club most of their money will be by way of TPAs. Yes I know club managements aren't meant to source TPAs for players but if you think other clubs aren't doing it you still believe in the tooth fairy.

Third party agreement is capped and at present is being overhauled and of course getting TPAs in a highly competitive Sydney market place is not easy especially when the economy is slowing down. Of course TPA's are a way of improving our chances of resigning these kids and I am sure that is what the club is looking at, but as I said the better the team goes the more expensive every player on the roster becomes. Take a player like Sue, if we make the eight and he keeps his form going,his price could nearly double because he is probably on modest money now. It has been happening to the Storm for years, they keep their spine but loose plenty players around them

Think if you follow this link you will find that TPAs are unlimited as long as they are arms length away from the clubs current sponsors. Also I noticed the article says that their was $15 million in such payments last year. Their is a limit to the amount sponsors currently involved with the club can pay. I remember the raiders recruitment guy saying last year when they played the Roosters that he thought the Raiders would have to pay about $3 million over the Salary Cap if they were to field the team the Roosters had on the park that day (but the Roosters have access to a lot of TPAs).

https://www.nrl.com/nrlhq/referencecentre/salarycap/tabid/10434/default.aspx

 

[sunshine_coast_tiger]

Yep that's it…..If we don't get some TPA's? We are going to struggle to hold onto them all as there value is only going to go up and other Clubs will be prowling around.

This is so true. The chances of building a side around Tedesco, Brooks, Moses and Woods relies on tapping into TPAs.

The salary cap is not a level playing field and I can tell you if we were to lose any of all good young talent the clubs they would go to would use TPAs as a way of paying them but making their salary cap hit less. Souths are doing this big time with Sam Burgess, it is going to be the only way to keep elite talent at your club. Tedesco is elite talent and the others may well end up at that level.

 

[eyewonder]

great post jirskyr.

maybe you should be the clubs ceo.

to every action there is a complete and opposite reaction - high school science theory,ithink.

 

[851]

Interesting reading this, the storm have over 3 million in 3 players, souths almost 2 million on 2 players, so why can't we keep all 3.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-premiership/nrls-highest-paid-players-as-cowboys-star-johnathan-thurston-talks-contract-extension/news-story/6261c5e95cbbf4adf1a03cd230cc3337?sv=446bbd770568d2f685c40d072b967690&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=crm&utm_source=daily_sportsmail
3 hours ago|
by Nathan Ryan|
Source: FOX SPORTS

MEET the NRL’s top earners.

Using reported figures, including third party agreements and the marquee player allowance, NRL360 compiled a list of the top 10 highest paid players in the game.

North Queensland superstar Johnathan Thurston headlines the list, earning a reported $1.2 million a season.

The record four-time Dally M medal winner is contracted with the Cowboys until the end of 2017 but revealed to foxsports.com.au Market Watch in February that he was eager to extend his deal a further season.

Cowboys general manager of football Peter Parr joins Ben Ikin, Ben Glover and Nathan Ryan to pull back the curtain when it comes to recruiting and retaining NRL players.
\
\
\
“I know I’m only contracted for another two years but at this stage I’m enjoying my footy that much that I’ll be keen to go beyond that,” Thurston said at the time.

The Courier Mail’s senior league reporter Peter Badel told NRL360 on Wednesday night that Thurston’s manager Sam Ayoub has begun negotiations for a contract extension which will see his client finish his career in 2018.

“The great maestro has begun talks with the Cowboys for another contract — one final season,” Badel said.

Johnathan Thurston of the Cowboys celebrates a try.Johnathan Thurston of the Cowboys celebrates a try. Source: Getty Images
“He’s off contract at the end of 2017 — he has flagged previously the intention to go on. That is now very real. He has instructed his manager to begin talks with the Cowboys (and) he’s done that.”

Should Thurston extend his deal, the 32-year-old will be the first Cowboy in history to play 300 NRL games for the club.

While Thurston’s marketability will see him snare top spot as the game’s biggest earner moving into 2018, remarkably new Parramatta recruit Kieran Foran has already equalled Thurston’s wage.

At only 25, the New Zealand five-eighth signed a two-year deal with an option in his favour for an additional two seasons valued at $1.2 million a year.

“We all know Kieran Foran is on 1.2 — it was spoken about fairly widely as he tried to negotiate last year,” NRL360 co-host Paul Kent explained. “Daly Cherry-Evans is the same.”

Parramatta half Kieran Foran barks instructions.Parramatta half Kieran Foran barks instructions. Source: News Corp Australia
While Melbourne halfback Cooper Cronk is on a reported $800,000 a season, he’s currently in negotiations for a new deal which should see him join the $1 million club.

“You have to bear in mind here that players are at different stages of their contracts,” Kent said.

“Kieran Foran and Daly Cherry-Evans are clearly in their first year whereas a bloke like Greg Inglis is in the (second) last year of his contract and no doubt will be looking for an upgrade in his next deal.

“The figures give people an indication what the good guys are earning.”

These are the highest paid players in the competition:

Johnathan Thurston $1.2 million

Kieran Foran $1.2 million

Billy Slater $1.2 million

Cameron Smith $1.1 million

Daly Cherry-Evans $1.1 million

Greg Inglis $900,000

Robbie Farah $900,000

Sam Burgess $800,000

Cooper Cronk $800,000

Josh Dugan $800,000

 

[Spartan117]

In reading this, every one of the above is guaranteed on their delivery on the field for their clubs or in a their Final contract.

Our Spine deserves to be retained but Im yet to be convinced they are to be given Cronk / Slater Money just yet

 

[tsjonathan]

In reading this, every one of the above is guaranteed on their delivery on the field for their clubs or in a their Final contract.

Our Spine deserves to be retained but Im yet to be convinced they are to be given Cronk / Slater Money just yet

Of course not. They're only 20!!

Rookies in the NBA are on rookie scale contracts for their first 3-4 years. So they are able to get a max deal of about 20 million US at about 23/24 years of age. Just goes to show how absurd NRL management is.

 

[tsjonathan]

Also another thing - I wonder now the potential tactical error of releasing Te Maire Martin this season.

I am all for releasing players who want to go elsewhere, or who have an offer we cannot match. Clubs cannot try to use the line of "stick together with your mates and the club that supported you as a junior" whilst ignoring the personal or career prospects of players.

However, if I have my timeline right, Martin was released before "Mooks" (I'm sick of calling Brooks and Moses - or should it be "Broses"?) decided to postpone their final-year option decision. We should not be shocked that they are testing their market value.

But the media says we have been sounding out backup half options like Benji and Blake Green, to cover ourselves in case one of these kids does decide to leave.

Had we kept Martin on the books just one more year, would this have already given us the backup / bargaining chip we now need? Would we be in a stronger position to negotiate with Mooks if Te Maire was working away in NSW Cup right now?

Or does releasing Martin play in our favour, showing our readiness to invest in Mooks at the expense of other juniors?

Certainly this topic gives great support to the comments of JT about releasing Taupau early. I expect that few hundred thousand is coming in VERY handy right now. It's not just "was Taupau worth big bucks as a dynamic forward in reduced interchange" but "was Taupau for 1 year worth losing Brooks or Moses?"

That's a great point regarding Martin. Similar in some respects to the conundrum the tigers had when Farah, De Gois and Flannagan came through at once. I would have preferred us to keep Martin another year as I firmly believe he is a year off first grade (I know he debuted etc). I honestly find it hard to see Brooks and Moses leaving now that Martin is gone and Lovett and Milone are still here yet players like Seve and Funaki are gone. I certainly notice a trend here…

 

[happy_tiger]

Interesting reading this, the storm have over 3 million in 3 players, souths almost 2 million on 2 players, so why can't we keep all 3.

http://www.foxsports.com.au/nrl/nrl-premiership/nrls-highest-paid-players-as-cowboys-star-johnathan-thurston-talks-contract-extension/news-story/6261c5e95cbbf4adf1a03cd230cc3337?sv=446bbd770568d2f685c40d072b967690&utm_medium=email&utm_campaign=crm&utm_source=daily_sportsmail
3 hours ago|
by Nathan Ryan|
Source: FOX SPORTS

MEET the NRL’s top earners.

Using reported figures, including third party agreements and the marquee player allowance, NRL360 compiled a list of the top 10 highest paid players in the game.

North Queensland superstar Johnathan Thurston headlines the list, earning a reported $1.2 million a season.

The record four-time Dally M medal winner is contracted with the Cowboys until the end of 2017 but revealed to foxsports.com.au Market Watch in February that he was eager to extend his deal a further season.

Cowboys general manager of football Peter Parr joins Ben Ikin, Ben Glover and Nathan Ryan to pull back the curtain when it comes to recruiting and retaining NRL players.
\
\
\
“I know I’m only contracted for another two years but at this stage I’m enjoying my footy that much that I’ll be keen to go beyond that,” Thurston said at the time.

The Courier Mail’s senior league reporter Peter Badel told NRL360 on Wednesday night that Thurston’s manager Sam Ayoub has begun negotiations for a contract extension which will see his client finish his career in 2018.

“The great maestro has begun talks with the Cowboys for another contract — one final season,” Badel said.

Johnathan Thurston of the Cowboys celebrates a try.Johnathan Thurston of the Cowboys celebrates a try. Source: Getty Images
“He’s off contract at the end of 2017 — he has flagged previously the intention to go on. That is now very real. He has instructed his manager to begin talks with the Cowboys (and) he’s done that.”

Should Thurston extend his deal, the 32-year-old will be the first Cowboy in history to play 300 NRL games for the club.

While Thurston’s marketability will see him snare top spot as the game’s biggest earner moving into 2018, remarkably new Parramatta recruit Kieran Foran has already equalled Thurston’s wage.

At only 25, the New Zealand five-eighth signed a two-year deal with an option in his favour for an additional two seasons valued at $1.2 million a year.

“We all know Kieran Foran is on 1.2 — it was spoken about fairly widely as he tried to negotiate last year,” NRL360 co-host Paul Kent explained. “Daly Cherry-Evans is the same.”

Parramatta half Kieran Foran barks instructions.Parramatta half Kieran Foran barks instructions. Source: News Corp Australia
While Melbourne halfback Cooper Cronk is on a reported $800,000 a season, he’s currently in negotiations for a new deal which should see him join the $1 million club.

“You have to bear in mind here that players are at different stages of their contracts,” Kent said.

“Kieran Foran and Daly Cherry-Evans are clearly in their first year whereas a bloke like Greg Inglis is in the (second) last year of his contract and no doubt will be looking for an upgrade in his next deal.

“The figures give people an indication what the good guys are earning.”

These are the highest paid players in the competition:

Johnathan Thurston $1.2 million

Kieran Foran $1.2 million

Billy Slater $1.2 million

Cameron Smith $1.1 million

Daly Cherry-Evans $1.1 million

Greg Inglis $900,000

Robbie Farah $900,000

Sam Burgess $800,000

Cooper Cronk $800,000

Josh Dugan $800,000

I suppose the question we need answered is how much is salary cap and how much is TPA ??

 

[foreveratiger]

My question is…..what's the point having a Salary Cap? When some Clubs can't match each other in TPA's.
Obviously the one's with better TPA's are going to have better squad so the Salary Cap is just a sugar coating....good for nothing as they say.

 

[tigeress]

Yep that's it…..If we don't get some TPA's? We are going to struggle to hold onto them all as there value is only going to go up and other Clubs will be prowling around.

To make it fair for ALL clubs they have to GET RID OF TPA'S otherwise the smaller clubs are going to suffer and not be around at all in years to come. IT'S SIMPLY NOT FAIR :deadhorse: :bash we will lose all our good young players to these clubs because they are just after the $$$ :bawling

 

[Geo]

Interesting reading this, the storm have over 3 million in 3 players, souths almost 2 million on 2 players, so why can't we keep all 3.

**Robbie Farah $900,000**

Part of the answer… 😱pen_mouth:

 

[tigerap]

Interesting reading this, the storm have over 3 million in 3 players, souths almost 2 million on 2 players, so why can't we keep all 3.

**Robbie Farah $900,000**

Part of the answer… 😱pen_mouth:

I thought Farah was leaving 1 year early and going to SL if NSW won the SSO….go the Blues 😛ray:

 

[innsaneink]

Just one of many many aspects of the NRL that isn't fair

 

[happy_tiger]

My question is…..what's the point having a Salary Cap? When some Clubs can't match each other in TPA's.
Obviously the one's with better TPA's are going to have better squad so the Salary Cap is just a sugar coating....good for nothing as they say.

But there are so many different arguments to all this FT

Brisbane being allowed to be a one team city

NZ being a one team country

Melbourne being in an non NRL area with extremely limited junior access

Clubs with low junior numbers in there areas

Too many Sydney based clubs

We need the TPA's to fend off the ESL ,rugby union , AFL or even NFL now

The key is clubs need to become smarter , and if they can't they need to be relocated to areas where they will become more self sufficient with less competition where they can succeed

We can't continue having clubs survive off the NRL , they need to find their own niche in this market and flourish

 

[barra]

Yep that's it…..If we don't get some TPA's? We are going to struggle to hold onto them all as there value is only going to go up and other Clubs will be prowling around.

To make it fair for ALL clubs they have to GET RID OF TPA'S otherwise the smaller clubs are going to suffer and not be around at all in years to come. IT'S SIMPLY NOT FAIR :deadhorse: :bash we will lose all our good young players to these clubs because they are just after the $$$ :bawling

Former Roosters administrator was quoted in last Sunday paper that he believes TPAs should be capped to avoid the current inequities between the clubs.

I'd say this would be the most likely action IF something does actually get done (the NRL is currently reviewing the situation I believe?).

 

[foreveratiger]

My question is…..what's the point having a Salary Cap? When some Clubs can't match each other in TPA's.
Obviously the one's with better TPA's are going to have better squad so the Salary Cap is just a sugar coating....good for nothing as they say.

But there are so many different arguments to all this FT

Brisbane being allowed to be a one team city

NZ being a one team country

Melbourne being in an non NRL area with extremely limited junior access

Clubs with low junior numbers in there areas

Too many Sydney based clubs

We need the TPA's to fend off the ESL ,rugby union , AFL or even NFL now

The key is clubs need to become smarter , and if they can't they need to be relocated to areas where they will become more self sufficient with less competition where they can succeed

We can't continue having clubs survive off the NRL , they need to find their own niche in this market and flourish

As I have said last week happy, the only way your going to fix this….. is if the NRL discloses a Salary Cap value to each player, that way every Club and fan know the Comp is fair, just like fantasy footy....every player has a value and gets revaluated at the end of each footy Season.
Clubs can pay players whatever money they want through TPA'S but a Club has to stay within the value.

Then again not easy to do as at the moment the lower grades come into play i believe.
Everyone knows the current system isn't fair and Clubs with better TPA's and 1 City teams like you said happy have superior advantages.

I know easy said than done.

 

[happy_tiger]

Interesting reading this, the storm have over 3 million in 3 players, souths almost 2 million on 2 players, so why can't we keep all 3.

**Robbie Farah $900,000**

Part of the answer… 😱pen_mouth:

I thought Farah was leaving 1 year early and going to SL if NSW won the SSO….go the Blues 😛ray:

😱pen_mouth: Bloody hell Tigerap , Farah will be until here until 2026 based on SOO :smiley:

 

[Muffstar]

According to Paul Kent on NRL 360, Moses manager is shopping him around and he did visit Penrith. Supposedly when Moses manager told Penrith what he wants and they could not believe it. So it sounds like serious coin these boys are asking based on potential only at this stage.

Was good to see Toovey saying they should stay at the club and agrees with the clubs approach of staggering their respective contracts.

 

[VanillaThunder]

Go with a points system. Each player is independently rated by the NRL from 1-10, each team has a cap of say 175 points for their top 25, discounts for local juniors/long-serving clubmen, ratings adjusted yearly. Clubs can pay whatever they want/can afford, though say for interest's sake salaries are public so everyone can tell just how much money has gone in to a team. That way clubs with large junior pools that might not have the money (us) can afford to keep more talented juniors, clubs with lots of money can't fudge the books with international lineups, and it rewards long service. Say 0.5 discount for a local junior, 0.5 discount for each year after 5 at one club.

Looking (somewhat subjectively) at ours based on TT's list:
Tedesco - 9/10 (local junior)
Nofoaluma - 6/10 (local junior)
Naiqama - 6/10
Simona - 7/10 (local junior)
Rankin - 4/10
Moses - 6/10 (local junior)
Brooks - 5/10 (local junior)
Sue - 6/10 (local junior)
Sironen - 5/10 (local junior)
Lawrence - 6/10 (local junior, long service 2.5)
Woods - 9/10 (local junior)
Farah - 9/10 (local junior, long service 4)
Grant - 7/10
Seumanufagai - 5/10
Aloiai - 2/10
Cherrington - 4/10 (local junior)
Chee Kam - 2/10
Buchanan - 3/10
Halatau - 5/10 (local junior, long service 2)
Lovett - 3/10 (local junior)
Ballin - 7/10
Hunt - 3/10
Edwards - 5/10
Littlejohn - 2/10
Drinkwater - 2/10

Total = 173/175
Minus discounts = 158/175

Basically with our current squad, we'd have 17 points to play with to improve our roster, Farah is essentially 5.5/10 and Rowdy a 3/10\. We've got a free 6.5 from using local juniors, which is essentially a free good-to-average quality player, plus 8.5 from long service meaning a free top class player. The longer Teddy and Broses stay the cheaper they get, which makes retention a lot easier. While we'd struggle financially to match offers initially, there'd be a clear incentive for players to stay together and essentially back-end their own contracts, and we'd go closer to building a strong, consistent and (hopefully) successful squad which would secure long-term financial gain.