Thread closed?

[4jtigers]

Wait. what....If you don't believe in God you wont go to heaven and live for eternity..?

That God seems pretty discriminatory..

what is discriminatory? if you don't believe in God anyways so why would it bother you if you don't live in heaven and live for eternity 🙂

 

[jirskyr]

Try be open minded, and abandon your bias as hard as that might be at first. If you do, you will ultimately end up in a much better place than when you started.

I find comments like this rather ironic. Surely you are aware that a very significant number of atheists and agnostics were raised within a religion, especially those of a decent age where, like myself, the number of publicly non-religious was much smaller last century than it is now.

Myself, I was raised Catholic and went to Church every week until I was 18. I absolutely believed in Jesus and God, went to Catholic schools and did all my sacraments.

Then I became an adult and started to truly think for myself, question what I'd been told, question what I'd been taught. Not just religion, but everything. Age of reason they call it.

And, frankly, IMO Christianity is one of the weakest theories going around. The arguments are weak as dish water and fundamentally rely on faith and non-provable suppositions. Oh, and from a book first drafted two thousand years ago.

So actually I came from bias, I came from the mindset that the Church preaches the truth and God is out there watching. Then I thought about it with a mature and rational mind, read widely in non-religious texts (because I was well-versed in Christian tradition) and decided it was a pretty spurious position to be so absolute about.

Because that's fundamentally the thing for me. There isn't another topic that I am aware of where people agree there is a high measure of potential uncertainty, or at least non-measurability, but believe it heart and soul regardless. I have faith in people I've known, met, judged, associated. Why would I have that faith in God? Never met the bloke, never spoken to me, never revealed any hidden truth, never even sat down for a beer and a chat. Not deserving of my faith; if he truly does exist he's like an absent Dad.

 

[jirskyr]

A Christian will content that we are here through the creation of an Intelligent Designer, who created the Universe, and all that it contains.

That argument never works.

If God created everything, who created God? If your answer is "nobody, he always existed", then that exact same argument removes the need for a god. What created the universe? "Nothing did, it has always existed".

The proposition of a divine creator mandates the question of who created the creator, chicken and egg-style, ad nauseum.

 

[Geo]

who created the creator

Midichlorian's did..

 

[BZN]

G'day @Sart0ri: what a big pitty people like Sandilands, Laws, Jones and others don't use their obvious ability to do good more often. I just don't get this shock jock stuff, and the only time I hear any of them is when I am in the car and my wife wants to listen to John Laws.


I will never forget the absolutely disgusting/disrespectful way in which John Laws spoke to Hetty Johnston from "Bravehearts" a few years ago.

I was so disgusted I sent an email to the local regional radio station complaining about his behaviour and suggesting very strongly he should be sacked.
Amazingly I received a reply saying every one of the staff at that regional station agreed. Unfortunately, no action was taken.

How can anyone get enjoyment listening to a shock jock ridiculing someone? :fa-smile-o:

 

[cktiger]

The funny thing in this thread is I'd bet plenty of the people who don't believe in God believe in karma.:sweat_smile:

 

[BZN]

I don't understand your line of thought @TIGER so I won't be responding to you any further.

 

[Strider]

Diversity bitches

 

[Sart0ri]

I will never forget the absolutely disgusting/disrespectful way in which John Laws spoke to Hetty Johnston from "Bravehearts" a few years ago.

I was so disgusted I sent an email to the local regional radio station complaining about his behaviour and suggesting very strongly he should be sacked.
Amazingly I received a reply saying every one of the staff at that regional station agreed. Unfortunately, no action was taken.

How can anyone get enjoyment listening to a shock jock ridiculing someone? :fa-smile-o:

I think most people like to hear their own beliefs given back to them as truth. The people that listen to Laws/Jones/Sandilands I assume share similar beliefs, or we change the channel/station until we find someone telling us what we already believe.

I read news.com.au and I know its rubbish, I disregard most of it but the political stuff on the more serious sites bores me to tears. None of us are perfect :grinning:

 

[hobbo1]

So many claim not to believe in a God , yet every week pray we win ......... go figure

Prayer is like masterbation, it does nothing for the person being thought of. It only makes the person doing it feel better

People have superstitions whatever it may be ...no different

Do you sit in the same lounge chair at home when you watch the Tigers play .....drink from the same coffee cup , use the same stubby cooler .....etc etc etc

Only have one lounge chair where I watch from so yes, but not because of superstition.
Don't drink coffee
Mostly use my Tigers stubby cooler because....well I love it, not because of superstition.
And I've never prayed for a Tigers win because prayer has the same statistical chance as no prayer or random chance.

Roll a dice a hundred times and pray for a six, write down how many sixes you got.
Roll it again and don't pray, write down how many sixes.

Superstition ain't the way

Your superstitious ...why not use any stubby cooler

What's the difference between superstition and religion .......

I think there comes a point when you can bail out on your suspicions, religion is finality... and people (AS A WHOLE, in this day ‘n age) just cannot accept that. Tbh.

I think if you live a life that you can be proud of without compromising yourself or others around you whatever the higher presence may be will accept you

I don't think he / she would care if you don't barrack for the right religion to be honest


Absolutely agreed Hap, good man even though @hobbo1 thinks ur a total savage lol

@happy_tiger


 

[Go_You_Good_Things]

Its because you cant argue/debate/discus religion on a forum like this. One side is rational, logical and use common sense, the other side is religious.

Because of intolerant, obnoxious posters like this one.
But don't tell him HE'S the intolerant one !!!!!

 

[4jtigers]

Its because you cant argue/debate/discus religion on a forum like this. One side is rational, logical and use common sense, the other side is religious.

Because of intolerant, obnoxious posters like this one.
But don't tell him HE'S the intolerant one !!!!!

I can feel this thread will be closed soon lol

 

[happy_tiger]

Its because you cant argue/debate/discus religion on a forum like this. One side is rational, logical and use common sense, the other side is religious.

Because of intolerant, obnoxious posters like this one.
But don't tell him HE'S the intolerant one !!!!!

I can feel this thread will be closed soon lol

About to say we will be starting the thread closed closed thread shortly

 

[Tiger_Steve]

Its because you cant argue/debate/discus religion on a forum like this. One side is rational, logical and use common sense, the other side is religious.

Because of intolerant, obnoxious posters like this one.
But don't tell him HE'S the intolerant one !!!!!

I can feel this thread will be closed soon lol

I’m praying that that is the case

 

[Harvey]

The funny thing in this thread is I'd bet plenty of the people who don't believe in God believe in karma.:sweat_smile:

Not sure about Karma, I do not follow any organised religion, or have a belief in any sort of divine entity. I do however try to live by the mantra of do unto others........

I think that this is based in common courtesy rather than the fear of eternal damnation.

 

[Tigerboy]

What not exactly true?

"You do realise atheists arent making a positive claim, dont you?"

Some atheists are making a positive claim - of the non-existence of any god. First two paragraphs of what originally I wrote.

You do realise atheists arent making a positive claim, dont you? The position of Atheism isnt a positive claim, its a rejection of your claim that a god exists. Atheists are not saying there is no god, **you can have subgroups of hard atheists or anti-theists that do make claims that there is no god, and yes, they would then have to provide evidence to prove their claim of no god exists**, however, Atheists in general are saying “you are asserting something exists prove it otherwise i dont believe your claim”




Like how i mentioned it, so whats not exactly true?

I apologise, I must have misread that first time around.

I wonder what the ratio of what you called "hard atheists" vs general atheists is? Certainly, amongst prominent atheist commentators (Hitchens, Harris, Dawkins, Ricky Gervais), they all come across as hard atheists. Most of the atheists I know are fairly anti-religion and definite about their being no god.

I feel a lot are forced into a corner with that statement about “definite” and simply choose to believe that rather they’ve confused faith and knowledge. The very smartest, and most down to earth people I know do NOT believe they have any right to freely say no God exists, IMO 🙂

 

[Tigerboy]

The funny thing in this thread is I'd bet plenty of the people who don't believe in God believe in karma.:sweat_smile:

Not sure about Karma, I do not follow any organised religion, or have a belief in any sort of divine entity. I do however try to live by the mantra of do unto others........

I think that this is based in common courtesy rather than the fear of eternal damnation.

Catholic family, believe what you’re saying is true yet life is still a cruel ***** and if you don’t believe in something AT ALL then, like me, I’m assuming you’re having a hard time finding something to die for?

What I mean by this is that unless you do believe that what goes around comes around and the ‘desperate’ need to be appreciated by peers (by doing the morally conscious thing) then are you really even human? It’s a very expansive topic. You cannot simply ask somebody what they believe and knowingly take it with a grain of salt but still ask them for definite ‘proof’. Serious stupidity - so I don’t really find a problem with belief in Karmic debts personally- to answer CK’s question

:::

Spoiler Text

:::

 

[JD Tiger]

I'm curious, what is the opinion of religious folk who go door knocking, and try to convert other people to their faith?

 

[fair dinkum]

Probably because those who don't believe in a God belittle those who do by basically stating they're idiots.
Those who believe are marked as rational, logical and full of good old common sense.
What does that infer they consider the ones who do?
**The one thing these people can't do, however, is totally disprove the idea.**
Each to their own.
As long as people are respectful of each each others views without denigrating them there shouldn't be a problem.

**The one thing these people can't do, however, is totally disprove the idea.**

Truth matters.

**The burden of proof is on the person making the positive claim**, not the person saying i dont believe you because you have failed to provide a single piece of non anecdotal evidence. **Logic 101.**

I think you've got it the wrong way around.
If you want to debunk someone's belief then you should be able to prove why they're wrong.
Now that's Logic 101.
I'm no bible basher, nor do I attend church ... but I can't think of a way to categorically disprove their may be a God.
Can you?

So using your logic
If I claim that unicorns, fairies, goblins, elves exist and you can't prove they don't, then you must believe that they do?

You must believe in a hell of a lot of crap if that's how you work, lots of things can't be proven to not exist.

Do you agree with this statement?
The right time to believe something exists is when sufficient evidence is presented to warrant belief in it, not a second before.

Fair enough then.
**Can you prove to me what caused the big bang that you obviously believe in** and what was in existence prior to that?

God of the gaps fallacy.

No one knows and neither do you. Its ok to say "you dont know". Not being able to explain the exact reasoning for the beginning of the universe in no way gets you closer to proving a "god" did it.

In the future the big bang theory may change as science evolves with evidence but for now its the single most agreed upon theory in the scientific community.

How did you insert a God into the equation?

 

[NT_Tiger]

@jirskyr
Yes, my experience mirrors yours. I was indoctrinated into catholicism in a devout family environment. At the age of seven, as an altar boy, I knew the mass in latin. Etc etc.
Then around the age of 15 I started thinking for myself.
In my 26 years of working with the Aboriginal people of the Western Arnhem area I gained an awareness of a spirituality within some members of the community that I couldn't explain or understand. But with those people it had a day to day relevance and could not be dismissed.
It had nothing at all to do with any western concept of god or religion.