Completely unacceptable: ramifications

[cochise]

The performance was unacceptable. It was expected it will happen every time on dry tracks against the top sides. We don’t have the players. The only way we will get them is through development. The league made a huge mistake with rule changes and not doing anything about funding junior development and a draft spreading talent.

A draft is the best idea. Or two leagues (the division of power, money and talent is that clear!).
Otherwise we are just like the premier league, but without the relegation.

I favour the draft. Make it happen PVL.

I'm not a fan of the draft, but that is just me being an old fogey.


I really see it as the option to even out the teams so that every team gets a crack at good players.

Yeah, I just love watching youngsters come thru the grade at a club, watching them from juniors to rep players. I'd prefer we just get better than need a artificial assistance through a draft.

But it’s not happening mate they just end up at the Roosters

Then we need to get better.

Better or richer?

What comes 1st, the chicken or the egg?

A draft works to assist clubs who don’t have the power or finances, you will always have a big disparity particularly when some clubs are owned by super rich media moguls. If the gap between the haves and have nots keeps growing the NRL is going to become a niche sport followed by a few big corporates and nuffies from Victoria who don’t know the rules.

But fans scream at me all the time
' we're one of the few profitable clubs '.
A draft wouldn't help us, like the salary cap didn't help us.
You can only help yourself

A draft would help us because it would help us keep our own young talent. Would Teddy or Paps have left if they might have ended up a the wooden spoon club rather than roosters/storm?

Won’t happen anyway. Needs the players association to agree

How does it help you keep your own talent?


Because if one of you players is off contract, he can negotiate to stay at your club, but if he leaves he doesnt get to pick where he goes, he goes into the draft and could end up at a club he isnt keen on.

Most people are talking about a Rookie draft not an internal draft. I haven't seen anyone suggest a internal draft in years.

 

[jirskyr]

After getting destroyed 66 to 16 it’s now clear as day. He needs to go and Ben Gardiner should be given a go as interim coach asap.

I will point out that Wayne Bennett's side got done 56-12 the other week and 50-nil two weeks before that. I don't really think it's about a single bad result, it's about whether Madge can eventually turn a young team around given another 2 years.

Melbourne have scored more than 40 points 9/15 matches this season.

Sadly Jirskyr, I think the game has now passed Madge by. I was really excited when he came onboard, an actual premiership winning coach, I was thinking he would turn things around for us really quickly, but in all honesty after 2 years he seems clueless as to how to improve this side.

The fact that there seems to be no real structure to any of our plays, or particularly to our defensive line is a real concern, imo. I mean what is going on at training, what is he teaching them? Or do they all just have short term memory loss on game day and can’t remember anything that he coached them during the week?

Unfortunately, with all the rule changes and mucking around with stuff over the past few years, the game has changed so much and not for the better, imo. I just think Madge hasn’t kept up with it and his coaching methods are a tad outdated. It’s showing in our lacklustre performances on the field each week, either that or the players are just not listening.

I'm just interested to know who the coach is that will / can turn us around, with the roster we have right now, or the roster he would be able to build in his 2-3 tenure without getting sacked. The club went nowhere much with Ivan Cleary, despite the roster he had at his disposal, even though I liked a lot of what I saw at times in Ivan's tenure.

I don't think the rule changes have really modified the way football is played and I don't believe coaches have had to do a lot to adjust. It's not any more complicated than it used to be - respect possession, be fit, defend smart. The difference is now that in-game ascendancy really does mean points, and enough points will kill a match off well before full time, like a head start in a running race. Teams having bad days get mauled, and it makes fans more upset than usual because their team is blown off the park in 20 minutes rather than losing more slowly over 80.

I think Tigers are just being shown up for how ordinary we are, and that has perhaps been diluted a little in previous years when the number of hidings maybe weren't so high.

Like I said with Souths, they are a Top-4 side but the top 2 sides put 50 on them. Parra are a Top-3 side currently and have been shellacked twice themselves, without yet having faced Penrith (next week). Roosters are 5th and have been beaten by 100% of sides above them on the ladder.

 

[Tiger5150]

The performance was unacceptable. It was expected it will happen every time on dry tracks against the top sides. We don’t have the players. The only way we will get them is through development. The league made a huge mistake with rule changes and not doing anything about funding junior development and a draft spreading talent.

A draft is the best idea. Or two leagues (the division of power, money and talent is that clear!).
Otherwise we are just like the premier league, but without the relegation.

I favour the draft. Make it happen PVL.

I'm not a fan of the draft, but that is just me being an old fogey.


I really see it as the option to even out the teams so that every team gets a crack at good players.

Yeah, I just love watching youngsters come thru the grade at a club, watching them from juniors to rep players. I'd prefer we just get better than need a artificial assistance through a draft.

But it’s not happening mate they just end up at the Roosters

Then we need to get better.

Better or richer?

What comes 1st, the chicken or the egg?

A draft works to assist clubs who don’t have the power or finances, you will always have a big disparity particularly when some clubs are owned by super rich media moguls. If the gap between the haves and have nots keeps growing the NRL is going to become a niche sport followed by a few big corporates and nuffies from Victoria who don’t know the rules.

But fans scream at me all the time
' we're one of the few profitable clubs '.
A draft wouldn't help us, like the salary cap didn't help us.
You can only help yourself

A draft would help us because it would help us keep our own young talent. Would Teddy or Paps have left if they might have ended up a the wooden spoon club rather than roosters/storm?

Won’t happen anyway. Needs the players association to agree

How does it help you keep your own talent?


Because if one of you players is off contract, he can negotiate to stay at your club, but if he leaves he doesnt get to pick where he goes, he goes into the draft and could end up at a club he isnt keen on.

Most people are talking about a Rookie draft not an internal draft. I haven't seen anyone suggest a internal draft in years.

Ah ok, I thought we were talking internal draft. Not a fan of rookie drafts. Catch and kill your own.

 

[cochise]

The performance was unacceptable. It was expected it will happen every time on dry tracks against the top sides. We don’t have the players. The only way we will get them is through development. The league made a huge mistake with rule changes and not doing anything about funding junior development and a draft spreading talent.

A draft is the best idea. Or two leagues (the division of power, money and talent is that clear!).
Otherwise we are just like the premier league, but without the relegation.

I favour the draft. Make it happen PVL.

I'm not a fan of the draft, but that is just me being an old fogey.


I really see it as the option to even out the teams so that every team gets a crack at good players.

Yeah, I just love watching youngsters come thru the grade at a club, watching them from juniors to rep players. I'd prefer we just get better than need a artificial assistance through a draft.

But it’s not happening mate they just end up at the Roosters

Then we need to get better.

Better or richer?

What comes 1st, the chicken or the egg?

A draft works to assist clubs who don’t have the power or finances, you will always have a big disparity particularly when some clubs are owned by super rich media moguls. If the gap between the haves and have nots keeps growing the NRL is going to become a niche sport followed by a few big corporates and nuffies from Victoria who don’t know the rules.

But fans scream at me all the time
' we're one of the few profitable clubs '.
A draft wouldn't help us, like the salary cap didn't help us.
You can only help yourself

A draft would help us because it would help us keep our own young talent. Would Teddy or Paps have left if they might have ended up a the wooden spoon club rather than roosters/storm?

Won’t happen anyway. Needs the players association to agree

How does it help you keep your own talent?


Because if one of you players is off contract, he can negotiate to stay at your club, but if he leaves he doesnt get to pick where he goes, he goes into the draft and could end up at a club he isnt keen on.

Most people are talking about a Rookie draft not an internal draft. I haven't seen anyone suggest a internal draft in years.


Ah ok, I thought we were talking internal draft. Not a fan of rookie drafts. Catch and kill your own.

Which is my exact thought as well mate.

 

[Ultimate Warrior]

Need to sign Pearce. Arrogant, swagger and leader.

 

[FinestTigers]

After getting destroyed 66 to 16 it’s now clear as day. He needs to go and Ben Gardiner should be given a go as interim coach asap.

I will point out that Wayne Bennett's side got done 56-12 the other week and 50-nil two weeks before that. I don't really think it's about a single bad result, it's about whether Madge can eventually turn a young team around given another 2 years.

Melbourne have scored more than 40 points 9/15 matches this season.

Sadly Jirskyr, I think the game has now passed Madge by. I was really excited when he came onboard, an actual premiership winning coach, I was thinking he would turn things around for us really quickly, but in all honesty after 2 years he seems clueless as to how to improve this side.

The fact that there seems to be no real structure to any of our plays, or particularly to our defensive line is a real concern, imo. I mean what is going on at training, what is he teaching them? Or do they all just have short term memory loss on game day and can’t remember anything that he coached them during the week?

Unfortunately, with all the rule changes and mucking around with stuff over the past few years, the game has changed so much and not for the better, imo. I just think Madge hasn’t kept up with it and his coaching methods are a tad outdated. It’s showing in our lacklustre performances on the field each week, either that or the players are just not listening.

The difference between us and teams like the storm is, they have more than enough of players in key positions with replacements in waiting who are just as good or sometimes even better than the injured player, we could of had this luxury in the past, but we currently don't have it, this is the reason for the appointment of T Sheens, we just need to be patient, Victory is coming for the mighty WT.

 

[Deleted member 3518]

After getting destroyed 66 to 16 it’s now clear as day. He needs to go and Ben Gardiner should be given a go as interim coach asap.

I will point out that Wayne Bennett's side got done 56-12 the other week and 50-nil two weeks before that. I don't really think it's about a single bad result, it's about whether Madge can eventually turn a young team around given another 2 years.

Melbourne have scored more than 40 points 9/15 matches this season.

Sadly Jirskyr, I think the game has now passed Madge by. I was really excited when he came onboard, an actual premiership winning coach, I was thinking he would turn things around for us really quickly, but in all honesty after 2 years he seems clueless as to how to improve this side.

The fact that there seems to be no real structure to any of our plays, or particularly to our defensive line is a real concern, imo. I mean what is going on at training, what is he teaching them? Or do they all just have short term memory loss on game day and can’t remember anything that he coached them during the week?

Unfortunately, with all the rule changes and mucking around with stuff over the past few years, the game has changed so much and not for the better, imo. I just think Madge hasn’t kept up with it and his coaching methods are a tad outdated. It’s showing in our lacklustre performances on the field each week, either that or the players are just not listening.


The difference between us and teams like the storm is, they have more than enough of players in key positions with replacements in waiting who are just as good or sometimes even better than the injured player, we could of had this luxury in the past, but we currently don't have it, this is the reason for the appointment of T Sheens, we just need to be patient, Victory is coming for the mighty WT.

It’s easy for them though . They can stash player 19-30 pay them a good salary , and have them play out the Sunshine Coast . There’s never really any competition , from other clubs . And most are happy to stay home and develop . Usually in a winning environment . The moment a reserve grader gets good in Sydney , the whole comp tries to lure him away .
The real power of the storm doesn’t lie in coaching . It lies in the club itself managing to build a culture that in itself keeps out the parasitic managers who would upswell thier clients at a whim .

 

[wet tiger coloured bird]

notice only the big city teams gets all the good players. storms lots of bussiness handshakes out of melbourne. roosters lots out of east suburbs. broncos in brisbane. small town teams gets no handshake. except penrith who grows their own talent.

 

[BAGNF05]

The performance was unacceptable. It was expected it will happen every time on dry tracks against the top sides. We don’t have the players. The only way we will get them is through development. The league made a huge mistake with rule changes and not doing anything about funding junior development and a draft spreading talent.

A draft is the best idea. Or two leagues (the division of power, money and talent is that clear!).
Otherwise we are just like the premier league, but without the relegation.

I favour the draft. Make it happen PVL.

I'm not a fan of the draft, but that is just me being an old fogey.


I really see it as the option to even out the teams so that every team gets a crack at good players.

Yeah, I just love watching youngsters come thru the grade at a club, watching them from juniors to rep players. I'd prefer we just get better than need a artificial assistance through a draft.

But it’s not happening mate they just end up at the Roosters

Then we need to get better.

Better or richer?

What comes 1st, the chicken or the egg?

A draft works to assist clubs who don’t have the power or finances, you will always have a big disparity particularly when some clubs are owned by super rich media moguls. If the gap between the haves and have nots keeps growing the NRL is going to become a niche sport followed by a few big corporates and nuffies from Victoria who don’t know the rules.

But fans scream at me all the time
' we're one of the few profitable clubs '.
A draft wouldn't help us, like the salary cap didn't help us.
You can only help yourself

No good making money if good rugby league players won’t take it from us.

 

[BAGNF05]

There is such a large step up that’s the issue. Guys are putting up good numbers and winning in reggies, that’s really all they can do. Madge and co have so much invested in some of the “first graders” they can’t afford to drop them. It’s a face saving exercise because the club’s reputation is so weak already. Surely now you just elevate tuki and tuilagi and one of the outside backs and hope one or two of them are up to it.

It's got nothing to do with "saving face". You are compelled to play from your Top 30 and you can't just introduce whomever you please from other sources. You also can't just chuck 5 kids in and expect the team to excel - the team is young enough as it is, and Penrith have already showed what happens when you remove experience from a side.

For example BJ and JTJ - were opportunity year-end signings (not part of long-term planning). They were bought because we were light-on in the backs and there's a general lack of junior talent in the league at the moment. Neither player has worked out except in bursts. But that hasn't been keeping other kids from getting a shot in the backs, if good enough. But there's barely anyone to push BJ or JTJ out.

You look at Souths, once Campbell Graham or Gagai are down, they get into very lean territory very quickly - Braidon Burns, Jaxson Paulo, Taane Milne, Tautai Moga, Steven Marsters.

All those Souths players have adequately filled rolls in some pretty big games. Difference is they’re coming into a team of proven first graders. We signed too many guys who were struggling to make the 17 where they were -expecting some miracle turnaround.

Not the night Storm beat them 50-blot

I agree Souths have a better platform to introduce nuffies or juniors. I also don't think anyone at Tigers expected a miracle turnaround with the recruitment. I think they knew Blore, Laurie, Stefano were long-term projects.

My point was re BJ, LL, Jet etc.

 

[TheDaBoss]

Need to sign Pearce. Arrogant, swagger and leader.

More like

Arrogant, douche, past his prime

 

[Deleted member 3518]

So we are bashing brooks for the other side of the field leaking 36 points in 10 minutes ? Is that what’s happening . Because I can tell at you all day , calling you all kinds of names , F this , F’en that , name calling all day , but that doesn’t stop Lucy shooting up and constantly having a meltdown , Mbye caught in no mans land , and the jet deciding tackling was optional .

 

[BAGNF05]

So we are bashing brooks for the other side of the field leaking 36 points in 10 minutes ? Is that what’s happening . Because I can tell at you all day , calling you all kinds of names , F this , F’en that , name calling all day , but that doesn’t stop Lucy shooting up and constantly having a meltdown , Mbye caught in no mans land , and the jet deciding tackling was optional .

A marking cone would have been more effective in D than LL on Saturday. At least the guys around him would know they need to make his tackles too.

 

[Love_the_WestsTigers]

I’ve seen under 14s teams with more resilience than this team

Heads must roll

Makes sense, they werent wearing a Wests Tigers jersey

 

[rustycage]

****Huge disclaimer** first:** In no way am I making excuses for last night, that was possibly the worst I have seen not only ourselves play but any team for as long as I can remember. Embarrassed to be a tigers fan is an understatement.


however, is it time the NRL has to seriously consider the make up of this competition along with he product that is currently on display?

Nobody wants to watch games like this...over in 10mins. We are seeing score score lines grow bigger and bigger each week, the divide between top 4-6 and everyone else is alarming and quite frankly a terrible look on the game. Im a die hard footy fan but the only games even close to being enjoyable over the last few years are bottom teams playing each other and this is only because the score lines are SOMETIMES closer (however quality of each team is usually terrible). We are only half way through the comp and we can probably all guess who the grand finalists will be.

Does the NRL have to accept the rule changes, crackdowns, bias refereeing is simply making this game unwatchable. Does the salary cap need a revision? the unbalance in quality is simply insane. Do they possibly need to be giving leg ups to teams who finish out of the 8 the year prior to hopefully rotate success throughout the competition?

Or is it a case of the bottom teams just need to 'adapt better'? We hear that a lot but it's always the powerful big clubs that seem to be able to 'adapt' to anything, so why is it the others can't?

Surely the NRL has to make changes and somehow prop up the struggling clubs...I understand how bias that is but the game is simply terrible at the moment.

Why should the top teams get blamed for getting better and better ......

Why don't we improve or die ......

Think of us as a business (which we are ) why do we deserve help when we continually make the same mistakes year after year after year .....NRL should give us time frame ...and if we can't make the 8 ...kick us out or relocate us

What, you'd be more happy for the current biased crop of pathetic garbage referees to be give even more reason to flog the living crap out of us?

 

[Tiger_Fanatic3]

Tigers need to take a new approach with pre-season and hire SAS Australia. Then sort out which players are up to NRL standard.
Forget about sand dunes.. 😆

 

[isaaktigers]

Tigers need to take a new approach with pre-season and hire SAS Australia. Then sort out which players are up to NRL standard.
Forget about sand dunes.. 😆

The SAS got choked out by Burgess.. let’s sign Burgess instead!

 

[cochise]

Tigers need to take a new approach with pre-season and hire SAS Australia. Then sort out which players are up to NRL standard.
Forget about sand dunes.. 😆

Apparently they did the miltary training for 3 days in the preseason.

 

[GCfan]

Tigers need to take a new approach with pre-season and hire SAS Australia. Then sort out which players are up to NRL standard.
Forget about sand dunes.. ?

Apparently they did the miltary training for 3 days in the preseason.

Maybe it should have been for 3 weeks

 

[SeanT]

Madge hasn't been going that well but jeez the players need to be held to account. Look them up on Google and it will say professional athletes. Nothing professional about the last two weeks.

What is with this generation of players that need to be cuddled every day. The report saying that Broncos players don't like kevvy because he won't communicate how they can improve. Bloody hell watch a replay and Youl see how you can improve and where you went wrong

Fair dinkum send them out shearing for a few weeks. Tough em up a bit.