Moltzen Staying Or Going

BTW, I note that in the Doust media release quoted from the Dragons Forum, the Wests Tigers CEO's name is misspelt as "Humphries". The correct spelling is Humphreys.

But that is not the main thing Doust gets wrong. Verbal statements surrounding the making of a contract are not part of the contract. First year law students learn that by Easter.

Whether or not Tim Moltzen goes to the Dragons seems therefore to be solely up to the Wests Tigers management - good!
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THE Tim Moltzen soap opera has taken a dramatic twist with St George Illawarra referring the contract dispute to the NRL and calling in their lawyers after Wests Tigers appeared to perform another backflip over the release of the fullback.
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Wests Tigers chief executive Stephen Humphreys yesterday told his counterpart, Peter Doust, of his desire to hold Moltzen to his contract even though he had also signed for the next three seasons with the Dragons. Moltzen, who had been contracted to the Tigers until the end of next season, had not been given a signed release to join the Dragons.
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Doust confirmed last night he had been informed the Tigers were standing firm even though Humphreys had publicly stated on Monday it was likely the club would release Moltzen to the Dragons.
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''We have been investigating our legal position over the past days,'' Doust said. ''Certainly some sections within the NRL rules are worth exploring in protecting the Dragons' interests. Clearly this is not something that we have been able to resolve with the Wests Tigers and we will now continue to press our contractual position in relation to Tim Moltzen and his manager's intentions for the 2012 season and beyond by formally referring the matter to the NRL.''
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In a long statement last night which was heavily critical of the Tigers, Doust said that, on July 8, the day the Dragons announced they had agreed to terms with Moltzen, ''it was certainly clear to me from our conversation that the Wests Tigers intended to release Tim Moltzen from the final year of his contract with their club''.
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He said Moltzen's manager, Martin Tauber, also advised the club the release was ''no issue''.
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''Given these expressions of intent that we received, in good faith, we included Tim Moltzen as part of our roster and planning for 2012 and provided a three-year contract, which Tim Moltzen and Martin Tauber signed on July 12,'' Doust said.
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Doust also detailed public statements by Tauber, Tigers coach Tim Sheens, Moltzen as well as teammate Benji Marshall that confirmed he was going to the Dragons.
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''Tim Moltzen has met with our incoming head coach, Stephen Price, where a number of matters were discussed including the fact that Tim had indicated that he would be moving to Wollongong,'' Doust said.
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''It is quite obvious that some circumstances at the Wests Tigers have changed in recent times, otherwise why only now three months later are we made aware that there is an issue?''
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He said in 11 years as Dragons boss verbal releases had been considered ''a formality and a situation such as this has never previously presented''.
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''Admittedly if we did have the signed release from the Wests Tigers then we would not be in this situation,'' he said. ''However, we strongly believe this matter should be judged on the principles of intent and actions arising in good faith.''
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To prove his point, Doust admitted the Dragons had yet to sign release documents for Darius Boyd and Peni Tagive but said the club had no intention of holding them to the Dragons as he had given verbal agreements.
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''If things were to suddenly change at our club, as they appear to have for the Wests Tigers, we would not be reconsidering our position as we would stand by our conversations, assurances and undertakings that our club had given to these players and their managers,'' he said. ''In our opinion, that is not the right thing to do for any of the parties concerned.''
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Read more: http://www.smh.com.au/rugby-league/league-news/dragons-refer-moltzen-release-saga-to-the-nrl-after-tigers-stand-firm-20111012-1ll4s.html#ixzz1aZiXFyAx

This saga just went into extra time.

Seriously, our club needs to pick a stance and stick with it. This constant back flipping is pathetic.
 
Its…
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Brilliant.

Why?

Because all the backflip talk is heresay and rumour. No one from the Wests Tigers side has shown any actual form of a backflip.

The journos and Doust are trying their darned-ness to make it look that way.

Doust is an imbecile, and is not fit to run a football club - he can't even get OUR CEO's NAME RIGHT!!!
 
And so it continues…

I don't know what to make of all this because we don't know all the facts but there are some telling signs in the above statement that actually suggest the Tigers may be in the box seat:

"It was certainly clear to me from our conversation that the Wests Tigers intended to release Tim Moltzen from the final year of his contract with their club". Unless you start getting int othe very grey area of contract law, an interpretation by one party of the other party's intention (literally what they plan to do but have not yet done therefore may not do) does not constitute a legally binding commitment. Invariably when one party doesnt have much to go on, you hear challenges based on "good faith" or the constitution. The later isn't possible so good faith it is.

If it was me, my philosophy in business is to honour the verbal agreement (if it was a verbal agreement - they say themselves it wasnt even that -it was an intention) and not rely on the letter of the law, but this is FOOTY (woo yeah) and I couldnt care less about the Dragons. They are responsible for some of the most boring mid-season games of the last 3 years and Soward looks like he is severely constipated - someone get him a laxative.

Whatever happens, its clear the boy doesnt want to go. Do the Dragons really want a bloke who doesnt want to be at their club? He's not answering his phone for gods sake...

I agree with the general sentiment from most on this thread. Moltz is the pig in the middle and his heart isn't in it as far as playing for the Dragons goes. Initially I thought it would be best for both clubs if he left, but the lengths he is going to in order to stay at the Tiges definitely makes me like him more. :smiley:
 
@underdog said:
Its…
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Brilliant.

Why?

Because all the backflip talk is heresay and rumour. No one from the Wests Tigers side has shown any actual form of a backflip.

The journos and Doust are trying their darned-ness to make it look that way.

Doust is an imbecile, and is not fit to run a football club - he can't even get OUR CEO's NAME RIGHT!!!

Spot on!!!

Interesting side issue, or am I splitting hairs here…...Taken from the Dragons own website is a section of Doust's statement....

_"Whilst Stephen continues to state publicly that he has never formalized the release of Tim Moltzen, Tim’s Manager Martin Tauber advised us on a number of occasions that the release was “no issue”."_

Does this mean they have asked Tauber on a number of occasions about the release because they were nervous and knew that the whole thing had not been done properly? Why would you keep asking about it if it was a mere formality as they suggest?
 
@underdog said:
Its…
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Brilliant.

Why?

Because all the backflip talk is heresay and rumour. No one from the Wests Tigers side has shown any actual form of a backflip.

The journos and Doust are trying their darned-ness to make it look that way.

Doust is an imbecile, and is not fit to run a football club - he can't even get OUR CEO's NAME RIGHT!!!

Errrr - Sheens quoted as saying ''the boys have known all about Timid going, its not the reason for the parra loss.''

Marshall quoted as saying ''hes on fire now, will be a loss, I wont get to see him every day.''

Moltzen himself:
‘‘I’m happy with the decision but my focus is on the Tigers and I’m not really worried about next year until it comes around.’’

Having never met Dragons coach-in-waiting Steve Price, he was given permission to negotiate with other NRL clubs.

Moltzen has since met with his future coach on several occasions to discuss his plans but the utility insists he hasn’t been guaranteed a certain position in the team for 2012.

‘‘We obviously spoke about it because I wanted to know where I stood going to a club like that,’’ Moltzen said.

…...Everyone for months was under the impression he was gone, fans wishing him well.... at games and pressos....one big fraud
 
@LaT said:
@innsaneink said:
Macarthur adv article LaT is a pretty nothing piece, blokes been reading the forum and put 2 & 2 together, no quotes, no nothing

Going by what Doust has said, it seems its common practice in NRL to not finalise deeds of realease before signing a contract. Fairly casual, much like telling a player he's free to see what he can find in way of a better deal elsewhere

Yeah looks that way. But Humphreys statements on Monday seemed to pretty much signal the end of the standoff.

"The way that it is likely to play out is that he will be going to the Dragons," Humphreys told The Daily Telegraph last night.
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"We will have a conversation with them in the next few days about it, but we have been working on the assumption that he won't be here next season.
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"His move depended on us granting him a release, and that is the process we are going through now."
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Asked why the clubs position had changed, Humphreys said: "He has signed a contract with the Dragons, so that is where he's likely to end up."

Just having a closer look at what Humpty has said - he doesn't say WT have or will grant a release but that they were working through that process which i assume would have included some form of compensation from the queens - we all know what they would have said if this was the case - he also says its likely he will end up at saints not certain - up until now i have only taken what Humpty says at surface value - i'm now realising i need to read more deeply in to what he actually says - a pretty shrewd businessman i think.
 
Btw if tim moltzen is not talking to dragz then u think he wants to join no for sure he wants to stay with tigers he and our ceo prob spoke and sheens they want him and if this was going on its for a reason and y hasent tim moltzen say he wnts to go dragz because he wants to stay go u tigers 2012 :smiley:😀
 
I don't know if there are any new stories on the Moltzen saga but the headline flashing at the bottom of the screen on the Sunrise program says "Tigers asking for the NRL to settle the Moltzen contract issue"
If that is the case you would think if the NRL only has 1 contract as was stated last week …... that Moltzen might stay a Tigers ???
 
@happy tiger said:
I don't know if there are any new stories on the Moltzen saga but the headline flashing at the bottom of the screen on the Sunrise program says "Tigers asking for the NRL to settle the Moltzen contract issue"
If that is the case you would think if the NRL only has 1 contract as was stated last week …... that Moltzen might stay a Tigers ???

Dragons have asked the NRL to intervene, not us…..we have closed shop, no ones returning calls or emails, Tims hiding behind his couch
 
@innsaneink said:
@happy tiger said:
I don't know if there are any new stories on the Moltzen saga but the headline flashing at the bottom of the screen on the Sunrise program says "Tigers asking for the NRL to settle the Moltzen contract issue"
If that is the case you would think if the NRL only has 1 contract as was stated last week …... that Moltzen might stay a Tigers ???

Dragons have asked the NRL to intervene, not us…..we have closed shop, no ones returning calls or emails, Tims hiding behind his couch

Sheens or Moltzen Ink
Isn't Moltzen in Las Vegas
If what has been said is true about the NRL only having one contract isn't this madness with what the Saints are doing ??
 
Moltzen.
Hasnt fronted for a prearranged meeting, ignoring calls and emails….a thorough pro.

I assume the saints just want it sorted one way or the other....I assume they want to move on and prepare for next year, from where I sit it seems we just wanna fart everyone around
 
I think the Dragons have told us they only have Jacks, while Humpty is still sitting on his hand….

I reckon Humpty is playing Doust for a bigger pot?!
 
Alright, hands up: this is now embarrassing. I've been inclined to back the club on this, not because I thought the public information made them look good but because I was prepared to accept there was enough going on I don't know about that it's more than possible that the public image is not giving a fair and accurate picture. But this is just a complete shambles now. Are we now assuming that we decided to keep Moltzen because we thought we were losing Lui, then we changed our minds because we thought we were getting Carney, and now we've flipped again because we don't think we're going to have either?

Actually the club would have been better off just shutting the hell up and resolving this behind closed doors. Let people gossip if they want - just get a resolution and say what it is.
 
Why is it embarrassing? Our CEO is looking after OUR interests.

Also, I don't think this is a knee jerk reaction to the Lui issue, I think Tim has approached the club and asked if there is still the possibility of him staying a Tiger, the club who now have more room under the cap have said there is and is protecting a club asset.

You are embarrassed because you have insinuated quite alot re Lui and Carney…
 

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