Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[Tim Sheens]

“Maybe if the Prime Minister’s watching, he could give me a call and I’d love an apology. But he could help me resolve my contract. What I do going forward, I will contemplate now that we have closed the door of my submission with the inquiry.” – Christine Holgate

A little more here: https://twitter.com/i/status/1381904957079658498

Great to see yet another strong women give Promo some more comeuppance. Keep it coming ladies!

Oh yeah, I should have added that she also described his rant as "the worst case of bullying that I have witnessed"


I understand that there is a lot of dramatic theatre about all of this, but correct me where I have this wrong..........

Holgate blows wads of tax payers money, in an state owned organisation hemorrhaging money on Cartier watches for her mates. Correctly there is decided to be an investigation into it. The PM says "She should step aside or she can go" pending the investigation.

Which bit did I get wrong?

IMO there is nothing wrong with the way she has been treated and I would expect the same of she was a man. Seems to me that she expects kd glove treatment because she is a woman?

Dramatic theatre about noting IMO.

Now there could be a case that he could have expected the same of a couple of his ministers, that is an arguable case.


Your arguement falls at the first hurdle because Australia Post is NOT subsidised by the taxpayer or the government.

Not under her leadership and the watches were less, much less than that previously given under previous watch (pun intended) and my local post office was one of the many beneficiaries of that deal across the nation, not to mention the communities they serve.

All of that may (or may not) be true, and that is exactly what the investigation would be for. It is right that she be expected to stand aside during it.


in fact she was doing too good job, such that it made it hard for them to implement their ideological privatisation of the enterprise.

Hard to privatise a loss making operation in an industry crippled by technological advances. Maybe she was doing her part to make it less attractive for private investors by blowing $50K?

To be clear, Im not saying she was evil or pure, I dont know. On the face of it gifts of Cartier watches in an organisation that is State owned and struggling seems excessive. Scomo stating that he expected her to stand aside doesnt seem excessive and the outrage surrounding it seems pretty contrived.

How on earth is it right for her to be stood aside when it was within her remit?

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


To be clear, I am saying Morrison is an evil misogynist and Holgate was only stood down because he made wrongly attacked her.

YOu have made yourself pretty clear here, I dont think there is any ambiguity. I think you are wrong however.

There is no think involved.

 

[jadtiger]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?

The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

 

[Papacito]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

 

[Nelson]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

 

[TillLindemann]

I do hope Australia Post is never privatised.

 

[Tiger5150]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

Havent listened to 2GB in 15years....I could just be wrong

 

[Tiger5150]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

**Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.**

Agreed, particularly in a poorly performing State owned corporation. I would love to know if Aus Post paid the relevant FBT on these watches, left it to the employees to pay or simply defrauded the ATO?

Any business owner in Australia would be rightfully annoyed with this level of blind arrogance. She demonstrated that she does not have any idea about corporate culture.

 

[Tiger5150]

I do hope Australia Post is never privatised.

I cant see the benefit in privatisation. You will never sell the mail division (its a massive loss maker) so why separate the profit making sections?

 

[balmain boy]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

It is, but when you look at the hundreds of thousands, and even millions that many politicians give their mates by manipulating contracts bids etc - why is she a demon for giving out 20k when they repeatedly do far far worse and yet both the politicians and their mates never face any consuquences?

 

[Tiger5150]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

It is, but when you look at the hundreds of thousands, and even millions that many politicians ***give their mates by manipulating contracts bids*** etc - why is she a demon for giving out 20k when ***they repeatedly do far far worse*** and yet both the politicians and their mates never face any consuquences?

Do they really? Like really really

I tender on Govt tenders all the time and the hoops you have to jump through are enormous. Every Tender gets independently audited. Every one. In NSW we have a a standing commission to detect and prosecute Government corruption (ICAC). Last politician found to do this spent three years in gaol.

 

[mike]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

It is, but when you look at the hundreds of thousands, and even millions that many politicians ***give their mates by manipulating contracts bids*** etc - why is she a demon for giving out 20k when ***they repeatedly do far far worse*** and yet both the politicians and their mates never face any consuquences?

Do they really? Like really really

I tender on Govt tenders all the time and the hoops you have to jump through are enormous. Every Tender gets independently audited. Every one. In NSW we have a a standing commission to detect and prosecute Government corruption (ICAC). Last politician found to do this spent three years in gaol.

Likewise. Tenders that the Govt put out are pretty much impossible to circumvent. You have to follow the process.

 

[Tim Sheens]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

It is, but when you look at the hundreds of thousands, and even millions that many politicians ***give their mates by manipulating contracts bids*** etc - why is she a demon for giving out 20k when ***they repeatedly do far far worse*** and yet both the politicians and their mates never face any consuquences?

Do they really? Like really really

I tender on Govt tenders all the time and the hoops you have to jump through are enormous. Every Tender gets independently audited. Every one. In NSW we have a a standing commission to detect and prosecute Government corruption (ICAC). Last politician found to do this spent three years in gaol.

You can even get millions of dollars, up to about 80 of them for natural water flows or say ten times the value of your land for being a donor.

Then we have the myriad of grants rorts that is par for the course for this corruption riddled government with Promo's office at the heart of it and no disciplinary action apart from McKenzie taking the fall for the disgusting men of this government.

 

[jadtiger]

I do hope Australia Post is never privatised.

I couldnt agree more.

 

[TillLindemann]

The ACCC has had a court win over Google, which was found to have deceived Australian users about retention of location history. In news that will surprise nobody, google was still recording location history even when android users had specifically disabled this.

They will pay a pittance and, of course, continue to rape pillage and plunder the notion of privacy in any way they can.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-04-16/google-misled-some-australian-mobile-users-over-location-history/100074292

 

[TillLindemann]

Who would have thought that being a "trained Marxist", advocating for the end of Capitalism and taking millions of dollars in donations to benefit "black communities" would be profitable enough to buy a $ 1.4M house in the whitest part of the US?

https://londonnewstime.com/the-founder-of-blm-became-a-fraudulent-brand-after-buying-a-1-4-million-home/181596/

Facebook and Twitter have now blocked sharing of that story, despite it being correct.

On the other hand, people are still free to share the incorrect, debunked 'Russia bounties' story, a story which undermined peace talks in Afghanistan and which has aggravated tension between two nuclear powers.

 

[Papacito]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

Of course bonuses were in her remit. That's the whole point.

Our own personal opinions on bonuses is irrelevant.

 

[Tiger5150]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

Of course bonuses were in her remit. That's the whole point.

Our own personal opinions on bonuses is irrelevant.

As CEO she gets to decide whether bonuses are appropriate and the form and value of those bonuses.

The owners of her organisation are then completely entitled to question her judgement. Isn’t that exactly what is happening here?

 

[Papacito]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

Of course bonuses were in her remit. That's the whole point.

Our own personal opinions on bonuses is irrelevant.

As CEO she gets to decide whether bonuses are appropriate and the form and value of those bonuses.

The owners of her organisation are then completely entitled to question her judgement. Isn’t that exactly what is happening here?

It's pretty clear cut.

Her boss was the chair. She already had approval to give significant performance bonuses.

It's a non issue.

 

[Nelson]

The investigation was to determine if indeed it was within her remit to buy $50K worth of Cartier watches. If I bought $50K worth of Cartier watches in my business, what do you think the ATO would say about it?


The figure you are quoting for the watches i have never seen before.Every article i have read or heard puts the amount at 20k or just a touch under(19,950).The figure you are quoting seems like the sort of fake news i would expect from Murdochs media or 2GB.

The figure quoted in parliament by Albo was $12k.

It's clearly also fake news that the coalition are good with numbers or finance.

The $12,000 was based on Holgate's evidence that they were worth about $3,000 each. It was then clarified that the total cost was $19,950. I had the misfortune of listening to some 2GB yesterday and heard figures of $20,000, $25,000 and $50,000 within the space of maybe 20 minutes...

Anyway, regardless of whether or not it was within her remit, I think it's poor judgment to hand out bonuses in that form. If that is part of corporate culture then it's stupid and has no place in a government-owned corporation. I don't accept that ostentatious bonuses are required to attract talent: in fact I'd question the judgment of anyone who refused to take a job just because they weren't going to be in line for an expensive watch.

Of course bonuses were in her remit. That's the whole point.

Our own personal opinions on bonuses is irrelevant.

Irrelevant to what?

It’s a government owned organisation so I have an interest in it much like shareholders would have an interest in such conduct in a private corporation. CEO’s should have some sense of what is likely to alienate or annoy the ownership base and shouldn’t go out of their way to do it.

 

[Tiger5150]

So, contrary to pre election reassurances, Biden is “investigating” possibilities of packing Supreme Court.

Disgusting radical policies but at least he isn’t Trump, who is a convicted Rapist and Felon.

https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefing-room/statements-releases/2021/04/09/president-biden-to-sign-executive-order-creating-the-presidential-commission-on-the-supreme-court-of-the-united-states/