Politics Super Thread - keep it all in here

[Tiger5150]

The DPP my bad

Also it wasnt the courts allegedly supporting the defendant as you stated, it was the police

 

[Tim Sheens]

Reynolds was the minister rather than Payne.

If there was only one woman that has claimed that the accused had abused them, then I may have a few percentage points of doubt.

I believe the accuser and there was definitely a cover up. Also look forward to a civil case from him which will require him giving evidence. For many reasons, including his own thoughts on his guilt, very much doubt it will happen.

 

[earl]

In his letter to the AFP on 01/11/2022 the DPP stated..."“I am of the view that at the conclusion of the trial, there should be a public enquiry into both political and police conduct in this matter,”

He seems to be a massive part of the problem.

Consider the remarks of ACT Director of Public Prosecutions Shane Drumgold, SC. On announcing the charge against Lehrmann was to be dropped, Drumgold praised the “bravery, grace and dignity” of Higgins, and asked that she be given time “to heal” after facing “a level of personal attack that I’ve not seen in over 20 years of doing this work”.

While this may be true, there is a serious question as to whether it is appropriate for a DDP, who has a duty to the administration of justice rather than to individual complainants, to make public remarks of this kind. Drumgold said nothing of the presumption of innocence or whether Lehrmann may also need time “to heal”. Nor should he have. And that is the point.

 

[Kaito]

We need to look at the judicial process and have a good look at the media etc. This was so bad.

I agree — to a certain extent, blaming book deals, Lisa Wilkinson, 3 million tax money, not saying anything about Cash or Payne doesn't sit well with me
Though...This whole situation
turned out to be one side vs the
other. Situation came out just
before elections as well if I'm
not mistaken. Having said that we
should protect woman at all costs
and take their accusations seriously

 

[earl]

Having said that we
should protect woman at all costs
and take their accusations serious

Agreed but this shouldn't be open to debate. This case though does the opposite. To me it shows that we need more protection for men. It was co-opted for political reasons extremely early and it never ended.

 

[Tiger5150]

Agreed but this shouldn't be open to debate. This case though does the opposite. To me it shows that we need more protection for men. It was co-opted for political reasons extremely early and it never ended.

Disagree with this Earl. There is sufficient protection for both women and men right now, but it requires the parliament (and media) to stick to the judicial process and keep their noses out of it until it is resolved in the courts. That way everyone is protected under the law and when resolved then things can be corrected.

 

[Magpie_Magic]

Forgive my ignorance as I'm not well versed on this very sensitive topic but I have a massive problem with due legal process not correctly followed and also with the 3 million in compensation.

With regards compensation two things.

1) As far as I know rape accusers/victims do not receive millions of dollars of taxpayer money in compensation, so why her.

What about the other poor victims are they less important?

2) Sounds like Marissa Paynes office wronged her. Why isn't she sued and why doesn't she pay the compensation instead of the Commonwealth/ taxpayer?

 

[Kaito]

Agreed but this shouldn't be open to debate. This case though does the opposite. To me it shows that we need more protection for men. It was co-opted for political reasons extremely early and it never ended.

From the libs side for sure.
Preety disgusting from Payne.
Her comments before and after.
Think she called her a lying [This word has been automatically removed]
and had the staff clean the office.

Going to take a time out from
this convo bro..all due respect.
As a man I don't need protection,
I put my hand up straight away for
a situation i got into or found myself
in. This case was so much deeper
than what the media potrayed
and what folks are selling on here

 

[Tiger5150]

I agree — to a certain extent, blaming book deals, Lisa Wilkinson, 3 million tax money, not saying anything about Cash or Payne doesn't sit well with me

Its the whole point. If Lisa Wilkinson and the book deal had just butt out, the initial trial wouldnt have been delayed by months because of her stupidity and ultimately the retrial didnt happen, in part because of this and Morrisons apology under parliamentary privilege. Ultimately these things prevented Brittany Higgins (or anyone else) receiving justice. The $3M tax money, whilst some could argue its not the best use of taxpayers money on an untried allegation, more importantly because it was paid without representative mediation, it lets Cash, Payne and any other parliament members or staff off the hook.

 

[earl]

Disagree with this Earl. There is sufficient protection for both women and men right now, but it requires the parliament (and media) to stick to the judicial process and keep their noses out of it until it is resolved in the courts. That way everyone is protected under the law and when resolved then things can be corrected.

You are basically agreeing with me or maybe putting it into it's proper context. It's not rules that are wrong it's how the rules are managed and policed.

We have a judicial and legal system that should work. It shouldn't be tainted by political movements.

 

[Kaito]

Its the whole point. If Lisa Wilkonson and the book deal had just putt out, the initial trial wouldnt have been delayed by months because of her stupidity and ultimately the retrial didnt happen, in part because of this and Morrisons apology under parliamentary privilege. Ultimately these things prevented Brittany Higgins (or anyone else) receiving justice. The $3M tax money, whilst some could argue its not the best use of taxpayers money on an untried allegation, more importantly because it was paid without representative mediation, it lets Cash, Payne and any other parliament members or staff off the hook.

Good points Glen. I'll pay that

 

[Tiger5150]

Forgive my ignorance as I'm not well versed on this very sensitive topic butI have a massive problem with due legal process not correctly followed and even more with the 3 million in compensation.

With regards compensation two things.

1) As far as I know rape accusers/victims do not receive millions of dollars of taxpayer money in compensation, so why her.

The argument is that it happened at her work, in the process of carrying out her duties and her employer (The Commonwealth) didnt protect her. Add in allegations of cover ups etc.

What about the other poor victims are they less important?

If it happened at their work they would have the same recourse.

2) Sounds like Marissa Paynes office wronged her. Why isn't she sued and why doesn't she pay the compensation instead of the Commonwealth/ taxpayer?

By settling out of court without representative mediation with Marissa Payne and Michaela Cash the Commonwealth (under Albanese) has resolved it on behalf of the Commonwealth and Payne & Cash are off the hook.

 

[Tiger5150]

Good points Glen. I'll pay that

Jesus Kaito....its been my point since the start

 

[Magpie_Magic]

The argument is that it happened at her work, in the process of carrying out her duties and her employer (The Commonwealth) didnt protect her. Add in allegations of cover ups etc.

If it happened at their work they would have the same recourse.

Not insensitive to the alleged crime but wasn't it after work?

By settling out of court without representative mediation with Marissa Payne and Michaela Cash the Commonwealth (under Albanese) has resolved it on behalf of the Commonwealth and Payne & Cash are off the hook.

Sounds like Payne and Cash should have a case to answer.

 

[earl]

Its the whole point. If Lisa Wilkonson and the book deal had just putt out, the initial trial wouldnt have been delayed by months because of her stupidity and ultimately the retrial didnt happen, in part because of this and Morrisons apology under parliamentary privilege. Ultimately these things prevented Brittany Higgins (or anyone else) receiving justice. The $3M tax money, whilst some could argue its not the best use of taxpayers money on an untried allegation, more importantly because it was paid without representative mediation, it lets Cash, Payne and any other parliament members or staff off the hook.

So many stuff ups. Lisa Wilkinson/Peter Fitzsimmons should be cancelled. If their employers had standards they should be cancelled. This did happen to some left wing feminist a while back who used to write on the SMH so they can do it.

The government shouldn't have paid a cent out in this case.

 

[Kaito]

Jesus Kaito....its been my point since the start

Very fair points. I think they settled
to save Ms Higgins the grief.
Going up against her superiors
would have been a shit show

 

[earl]

I think they settled
to save Ms Higgins the grief.

I think you are probably right but I'm a bit more cynical. They wanted to avoid the media storm over this issue.

I ask you and anyone why didn't Higgins utilize her right to anonymity on the case ? She choose not to do this so why pay her out in a civil case against the government ?

This case reeks to high heavens.

The fact is there was nothing normal about the Lehrmann trial, which occurred under a glare of unceasing publicity. Such matters are invariably tried in conditions of anonymity, which is a statutory right afforded to the complainant.

 

[Kaito]

I ask you and anyone why didn't Higgins utilize her right to anonymity on the case ? She choose not to do this so why pay her out in a civil case against the government ?

This case reeks to high heavens.

Such a high profile case man, who knows

So many things disturb me about this case

 

[Kaito]

Hopefully the defendant & the plaintiff
both find peace & manage to move on.
Proper shit show from every angle

 

[trentrunciman]

Lmao i wish bro, they don't like me

They ain’t all that bro…