Signings, Suggestions & Rumours Discussion

[Spud_Murphy]

Its only in very recent times this club has had any money to offer quality players. There really is no history of our club missing out on marquee players because we have never been in the market for them.

As a counter point to the thinking that we miss out on marque buys of players- that last time we had $$$ to spend Cleary had little difficulty getting the players he wanted- Packer, Matulino & Reynolds. I think I'm right saying that McQueen was singed by Taylor but also Mbye and Matterson were later signings by Cleary. So, you can rightly argue the merits and value of these players and their signing value, but they did put pen to paper and came to WT.

Agree Magic, although only 3 maybe 4 were ever touted as Marquee - yet how well did they go for us?

I wouldn’t consider any of those players marquee signings when they came to us.

 

[Tiger_Steve]

Its only in very recent times this club has had any money to offer quality players. There really is no history of our club missing out on marquee players because we have never been in the market for them.

As a counter point to the thinking that we miss out on marque buys of players- that last time we had $$$ to spend Cleary had little difficulty getting the players he wanted- Packer, Matulino & Reynolds. I think I'm right saying that McQueen was singed by Taylor but also Mbye and Matterson were later signings by Cleary. So, you can rightly argue the merits and value of these players and their signing value, but they did put pen to paper and came to WT.

Agree Magic, although only 3 maybe 4 were ever touted as Marquee - yet how well did they go for us?

I wouldn’t consider any of those players marquee signings when they came to us.

I would define marquee as any player playing rep level footy in tier one teams. We ain’t close. We were but we gave him to parra.

 

[tiga4eva]

Neil Breen is Moses Mbyes Uncle. So might be some truth to the story

 

[Tigerdave]

"They look at the list of top players who left the Tigers – James Tedesco, Aaron Woods, Mitch Moses, Josh Addo-Carr – and wonder what drove them out."

I really hate this type of list.

We did everything we could do to keep Teddy and Woods, they didn't want to stay. Adding to that, we weren't winning much with them in the squad.....

Moses was not a top player at the time either and didn't want to stay. This is a guy who blatantly tanked it in his last few games too and shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as any other player listed.

The Fox yes, that's completely on the club, but he actually wanted to stay.

 

[Telltails]

"They look at the list of top players who left the Tigers – James Tedesco, Aaron Woods, Mitch Moses, Josh Addo-Carr – and wonder what drove them out."

I really hate this type of list.

We did everything we could do to keep Teddy and Woods, they didn't want to stay. Adding to that, we weren't winning much with them in the squad.....

Moses was not a top player at the time either and didn't want to stay. This is a guy who blatantly tanked it in his last few games too and shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as any other player listed.

The Fox yes, that's completely on the club, but he actually wanted to stay.

We lost those players because at the time and prior to, the club was a mess. We have to own that. In some ways it was the wake up call the club needed. The club had a pretty good record of retaining players on loyalty who came through our junior ranks, and assumed regardless of the poor off field performance, that the players we wanted would stay at the club. They didn't and things began to change.

 

[The_Patriot]

Jason Taylor, the gift that keeps giving. Maguire's new culture at least will see less young players leave as more is made of buying in to the culture and the coach 'actually' creating that culture not just giving it lip service

 

[Bones]

"They look at the list of top players who left the Tigers – James Tedesco, Aaron Woods, Mitch Moses, Josh Addo-Carr – and wonder what drove them out."

I really hate this type of list.

**We did everything we could do to keep Teddy and Woods, they didn't want to stay**. Adding to that, we weren't winning much with them in the squad.....

Moses was not a top player at the time either and didn't want to stay. This is a guy who blatantly tanked it in his last few games too and shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as any other player listed.

The Fox yes, that's completely on the club, but he actually wanted to stay.

That’s the entire point of the article.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Jason Taylor, the gift that keeps giving. Maguire's new culture at least will see less young players leave as more is made of buying in to the culture and the coach 'actually' creating that culture not just giving it lip service

It’s your coaches mess that Madge is wading through.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

It’s easy in retrospect, but Tedesco was never a chance of staying. How do you compete with a millionaire throwing millions of dollars at a player, with the allure of premierships. You can’t. It’s impossible.

Moses, well who cares about that pea heart. If there’s one player I’d spit in the face of if I ever saw him on the street, it’d be him.

Woods. Having the IQ of a wooden plank leaves you susceptible to being manipulated by people smarter than you. I have no doubt advisors were in his ear telling him he was above this club and he needed to go. He was our captain, and never once did he act as a mouthpiece for the club. He never showed any sign he wanted to commit. Except after he signed with the Dogs and they didn’t win a game for 2 months. Suddenly when there was talk of him flippping due to the Dogs cap problems, he suddenly became receptive. I think due to him having a good relationship with Ivan and seeing how good a job Ivan was doing at the time. Cleary had slammed that door shut though I think. A “you made your bed” type message.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

It’s easy in retrospect, but Tedesco was never a chance of staying. How do you compete with a millionaire throwing millions of dollars at you, with the allure of premierships. You can’t. It’s impossible.

Moses, well who cares about that pea heart. If there’s one player I’d spit in the face of if I ever saw him on the street, it’d be him.

Woods. Having the IQ of a wooden plank leaves you susceptible to being manipulated by people smarter than you. I have no doubt advisors were in his ear telling him he was above this club and he needed to go. He was our captain, and never once did he act as a mouthpiece for the club. He never showed any sign he wanted to commit. Except after he signed with the Dogs and they didn’t win a game for 12 months. Suddenly when there was talk of him flippping due to the Dogs cap problems, he suddenly became receptive. I think due to him having a good relationship with Ivan and seeing how good a job Ivan was doing at the time. Cleary had slammed that door shut though I think. A “you made your bed” type message.

GNR, it didn't matter which club waved the dollars at Tedesco because he would go. Remember the Raiders debacle? That reflects on his values and sense of loyalty to WTs. Also remember that little incident in Nth Qld when one of his own team mates wacked him for hitting on his partner. What do you say about the values of someone like that?

 

[Deleted member 3518]

Its only in very recent times this club has had any money to offer quality players. There really is no history of our club missing out on marquee players because we have never been in the market for them.

As a counter point to the thinking that we miss out on marque buys of players- that last time we had $$$ to spend Cleary had little difficulty getting the players he wanted- Packer, Matulino & Reynolds. I think I'm right saying that McQueen was singed by Taylor but also Mbye and Matterson were later signings by Cleary. So, you can rightly argue the merits and value of these players and their signing value, but they did put pen to paper and came to WT.

Agree Magic, although only 3 maybe 4 were ever touted as Marquee - yet how well did they go for us?

How can you possibly know that in advance though? Matulino was retired by a new injury , packer was one of the form props in the comp , and Reynolds hasn't gotten healthy , which happens.
Just because the outcome was not to be desired doesn't mean you can change the narrative of what happened at the time of signing here.
Packer was chased by 3 clubs , so was mats , and so was reynolds. They were considered marquee at the time

 

[tony soprano]

"They look at the list of top players who left the Tigers – James Tedesco, Aaron Woods, Mitch Moses, Josh Addo-Carr – and wonder what drove them out."

I really hate this type of list.

We did everything we could do to keep Teddy and Woods, they didn't want to stay. Adding to that, we weren't winning much with them in the squad.....

Moses was not a top player at the time either and didn't want to stay. This is a guy who blatantly tanked it in his last few games too and shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as any other player listed.

The Fox yes, that's completely on the club, but he actually wanted to stay.

Our salary cap was shot and we spent most of the money on them and had a crap forward pack.

 

[Chainlink]

It just does not make sense keeping him this year.. Why put money and time into a player leaving when you could use that spot on another young player that might end up been a first grader.. I would laugh if they kept him and lost another player with talent because they are been idiots.. Cannot wait until they need something from us or another club and they don't get it..

Simple, every team wants to field their best side each year, and parra obviously think that including him will be the best for them. He has a contract, they are entitled to do what they are doing. Maybe just maybe, parra think they can actually push for finals and aren’t willing to budge on player contracts. I hat parra, but they aren’t doing anything wrong in this situation.

 

[Demps]

GNR sums Woods up pretty well.
2040 soldier till the boys told him it was uncool.
Jumped ship.

Still one of the most ineffective props I've ever watched.
No loss.

 

[Demps]

I'd like to point out...
The guy who started this thread fell off the face of the earth.

old Macdougal, league unlimited live update team...
Haha. He was a bit of a jerk tbh.

Anyone know what happened to him?

 

[diedpretty]

It just does not make sense keeping him this year.. Why put money and time into a player leaving when you could use that spot on another young player that might end up been a first grader.. I would laugh if they kept him and lost another player with talent because they are been idiots.. Cannot wait until they need something from us or another club and they don't get it..

Simple, every team wants to field their best side each year, and parra obviously think that including him will be the best for them. He has a contract, they are entitled to do what they are doing. Maybe just maybe, parra think they can actually push for finals and aren’t willing to budge on player contracts. I hat parra, but they aren’t doing anything wrong in this situation.

Exactly - and we could have done the same thing with matterson. People keep banging on about you can't keep a player who doesn't want to be here. Well parra are doing just that. If matterson tanked it he could of been demoted to reserves. Will be interesting to see what happens with the young guy if parra stick to their guns.

 

[jirskyr]

"They look at the list of top players who left the Tigers – James Tedesco, Aaron Woods, Mitch Moses, Josh Addo-Carr – and wonder what drove them out."

I really hate this type of list.

**We did everything we could do to keep Teddy and Woods, they didn't want to stay**. Adding to that, we weren't winning much with them in the squad.....

Moses was not a top player at the time either and didn't want to stay. This is a guy who blatantly tanked it in his last few games too and shouldn't be mentioned in the same breath as any other player listed.

The Fox yes, that's completely on the club, but he actually wanted to stay.

That’s the entire point of the article.

It's a pointless article.

You don't need to stand in front of a mirror, take a long hard look at yourself and wonder why James Tedesco left. Everyone knows why he left, because Easts came calling and that may have something specifically to do with culture or winning, but it also may be to do with brown paper bags.

Tedesco was also 15 seconds from leaving to Canberra 3 years prior, so clearly he always had one eye on the door. That's about personal success and personal brand, not the club. He said he reneged on the Raiders for his teammates, but 3 years later, that same consideration didn't matter as much anymore. So clearly his commitment to his teammates only extends so far, within the context of being successful.

I get that Tedesco might have been tired of failure, but if you are really that good a footballer and you believe it, surely leaving isn't going to help the club or your teammates. So we can all agree, at some point, be it the first year or the 6th, he decided the toil wasn't worthwhile vs improving his own brand at the expense of his club and teammates. At some point he was caring more about himself than his teammates/club. He's human, I can understand that without respecting it.

You can't really bring Jason Taylor into the Tedesco argument, because Tedesco signed with Canberra months before Jason Taylor became the head coach. Maybe he contributed to Tedesco leaving, but Tedesco has been mentally out the door every time his contract ended.

So Breen raises a circular argument as old as the hills, which is why his article is pointless - how can losing sides sign up top players, if the top players want to join winning sides? You can't create a winning culture if you haven't got the talent first. This isn't chicken and egg, you must have talent before you can win, the question then becomes how to sculpt and combine that talent on a consistent winning basis.

And the answer is simple actually - you need to either pay overs / have mad perks / cheat, or have players who are willing to toil and struggle to transform the club from failure to winning. You can't just have players joining winning teams, otherwise the comp is forever lopsided.

Specifically to the Taylor-Cleary period, unfortunately for the Tigers that one period basically stands-in as a "lifetime failure" concept for many people, when really that's too simplistic. In other words, Breen asks why Tedesco, Woods, Moses and JAC left, when they all left within 12 months of each other (or just a few weeks, if you take out JAC).

It's like asking "why are there so many floods in Australia" just after the great Brisbane flood. It isn't necessarily true that "all the good players leave Tigers", rather, at one particular point in our history we lost a few good players all at once.

The main problem, as I see it, is that year-on-year players are becoming more brand oriented rather than being a "great clubman". It used to be all about the club success and winning with your mates, now it's more about getting ads with Coke and merchandising deals with Nike. So how do the struggling clubs get players to join without the lure of success? And being struggling clubs, normally their other opportunities are also hamstrung - advertising, gate receipts, TPAs etc. It's lose-lose for players who want an easier path.

Jai Arrow is just the Tedesco issue all over again. Legitimate Gold Coast junior, joined the lure of Broncos as soon as he was up for a senior contract, went "home" to Titans on a strong offer and not being at the top of the Broncos pecking order, had standout years and broke into Origin, then left for the lure of Sydney at the next opportunity. Is that the Titans' fault? Somewhat yes, but Arrow has only been there 5 minutes and now he wants out for more money and better chance of finals. And, apparently, his girlfriend is a model and wants to further her career in Sydney. Don't we all!?

What are Titans supposed to do? Sink all their money into keeping Arrow and put themselves into further harm?

 

[twentyforty]

Let’s face the cold hard truth. We have a consistent track record for not keeping promising juniors and hiring players who are not only at the end of their careers but carry the injuries as a result. We apparently don’t give players a medical before signing contracts?
We sign players on big money who contribute half what our younger up and comers earn. Why wouldn’t they become demoralised and look elsewhere? If Mag is clever he will drive the culture from the bottom up.

 

[Telltails]

You can't target Woods,Tedesco, Moses and attack them personally for their decisions without acknowledging that our club was not run in a professional manner in any shape or form and every player in the game knew it - and none better than them. They could have all stayed and taken the money offered, but as we have seen with other players money is not enough to lure/keep players who want more from the game. The club needed to change what was happening off the field, and we are suffering still for that, far more than any decisions Teddy Woods or Moses made in regard to what they believed was best for them at the time.

 

[tony soprano]

It just does not make sense keeping him this year.. Why put money and time into a player leaving when you could use that spot on another young player that might end up been a first grader.. I would laugh if they kept him and lost another player with talent because they are been idiots.. Cannot wait until they need something from us or another club and they don't get it..

Simple, every team wants to field their best side each year, and parra obviously think that including him will be the best for them. He has a contract, they are entitled to do what they are doing. Maybe just maybe, parra think they can actually push for finals and aren’t willing to budge on player contracts. I hat parra, but they aren’t doing anything wrong in this situation.

There only doing because he’s not on much so it doesn’t bother them, pretty vindictive, but your right they’re entitled to do it.