Wests Tigers coach Jason Taylor gives halves Luke Brooks and Mitchell Moses licence to entertain

[Tigermama]

The 5 hit ups and a bomb is getting a bit lame isn't it….the Cowboys game is the only one I can really think of as that being the soul tactic or game plan if you like...

I'm Sure Taylor didn't send them out there with a plan to complete at less than 60% have less than 50% possession ...miss 50+ tackles a game....a poor kicking game....get dominated in the ruck end up on the wrong end of the penalty count adding more pressure to a fatigued defensive line...this happened in every game we lost...

When the Wests Tigers as a team completed at over 80% minimised the missed tackles conceded less penalties at least matched it in the ruck we won including Victories over the Storm South's Dragons Raiders and the Dogs..didn't seem to much wrong with those game plans...

A Coach can only do so much no matter which Coach...It's time some of our well paid Superstar players and young guns took ownership of their Performances ON THE FIELD..

The last sentence says it all Geo. 100 % :supporter:

 

[Eddie]

Look I could argue very similar with you with Robbie Farah. You don't like him. Naturally people have some players and coach they gravitate too more. Its all good spirited debate I enjoy. Different personalities might resonate more with some people.

Trying to is probably the key word. I am not against what he was trying to do long term. I actually sang his praises for the most part in pre season. I don't hate Taylor personally but I was filthy with some of his comments at times last year.

I thought we showed huge immaturity and a thin skin calling the radio station. I thought his tactics didnt get the best out of some key players at times. I thought he tried too hard to defend what he was doing all the time, it became about him, and taking pot shots all the time at our results from the past (which were not as bad as his results)

I just thought after his pre season talk 15th was very underwhelming after the pot shots he took at Sheens and Potter. I cant spin 15th too far with stats.

If this year there is a better results and a team working hard for each other ill be the first to sing his praises.

 

[innsaneink]

Yep… Fair enough.
These split divided opinions will continue no matter who's in charge and how we play if we continue to finish down the bottom.
Roosters Broncos forums etc must be boring as he'll... I wonder what they argue about?

 

[Eddie]

I have a good mate who I have been attneding games with for 15 years who 100% won't sign up membership until Taylor is gone. I told him he was a lunatic. He is very pro Robbie Farah and was disgusted with his treatment.. I would never make a stand like that. All clubs are bigger then individual players and fans. 2

I have another mate (who posts regularly in here) who I have attended games with for 20 years straight as a Balmain and WT fan He argues against me on most Taylor and Farah related stuff. It would probably surprise you who it was.

Its football, opinions are what make it go around and make it interesting. I like it, its never anything personal. Emotion does dictate some of, i think thats a good thing from a fans perspective.

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

we could settle this never ending debate by forming our own teams from this forum - Taylor Ball verses WT Freestyle, and have it out after main game at that annual get together

Would be a lot more interesting to watch than the garbage that was dished up at times last year :smiley:

 

[happy_tiger]

People are kidding if they think 5 hit ups and a bomb is the closest way to success. I think its pretty lazy to call that proper structures and systems. That is just basic rubbish that made us get picked off and be very predictable.

That Cowboys games at Ctown was a disgrace, they had a QLD cup style side on the paddock and we wnet one out for 80 minutes. It was horrible tactics on the night against a side there to be beaten.

Did anyone watch the Broncos, Cowboys and Roosters play last season (the three most successful sides)

The 2 best teams Brisbane and North Qld played plenty of footy. They asked alot of quetions. They ran in numbers. Had decoys going, got some offloads going, had some depth in their backs. Roosters often spread the ball early in a set to catch a side napping.

To suggest they went one out and then put a bomb up on their way to success is pretty simplictic for mine.
**They all defended really well no doubt about that.** However it didnt mean they forgone all attack, they found a balance. Im not asking for Benji Ball and sideways rubbish. That all didnt work great, although many of those seasons we were 1 in away from the Top 8 with a horrible injury toll.

We needs way more men in motion , some offloads, some depth in the backs. Put simply we asked no questions before the 20 M line unless Teddy was on fire.

We did plenty of one out rubbish. That is not great sturcutres or systems for mine. I think its lazy to suggest so. Some games we literally sent one men up every single play to get smashed by 3 blokes.

I believe we may be making some progress with Eddie.
You mentioned why those teams can do what they do successfully regularly, but we can't.
It's not simplistic, it's not lazy.. It's fact. You can't attack until you can defend. It's defensive offence.
It's what most here are saying yet a few like you & Steve fail to see…. Despite your 'balance' addendum earlier.

As Steve and Eddie fail to understand the 5 hit ups and kick is called the grind , every team does it for at least 40 % of their games

But then again Steve and Eddie could be right , the "Licence to Thrill" will work again ….. at some stage ..... in some galaxy ........

We just need to wait Ink , be patient :smiley:

 

[happy_tiger]

"Getting the spoon by a mile…." .

"Or performing worse than we actually did... "
Same difference.
I thought most might pick up on the slight exaggeration.

I wasn't referring to any other years other than last year that willow mentioned... However coming last or 13th or 15th, again... Same difference - playing " free-wheeling footy"
JT has clearly stated what his ambition was re. Last. season... Some choose to ignore it... Doesn't suit their agenda.
There are two basic elements to this game, we are somewhat capable in attack.... Yet weak as pee in D.
You want them to play to their strengths.... Freewheeling. That doesn't work... And learning how to defend as a Top 4 team that you want them to be doesn't happen overnight either..
You are one of the most blinkered and one eyed posters on this subject, it's a laugh you talk about "balance" when you posts don't contain an ounce of that.

Taylor talked up a big game when he came across. I didn't discount his vision. He did need to toughen up and focus on defence. However running one out for 80 minutes in games and calling that "tough, structured footy" I just didnt buy it like some others.

He rubbished Sheens and Potter and said "we had been down the bottom for years" and that "defence was not a priority at the Tigers" I thought it was disrespectful and said so at the time. Taylor soon found out though it was more difficult then he thought.

I just don't like the fact that Taylor and his band of apologists find 1000 different stats to spons way we improved despite finishing equal last. Last season we had less injuries then we have had for several, several years.

I thought the season was poor and worse then Potters season in 2014 which was decimated by injury.

He will be a better coach for last years experience.He knows the players betters and their strenghts. Im looking forward to this season.

Benji since he left has even said that defence wasn't a priority and when Sheens did try and grind in 2010-2011 they would often ignore him

When push comes to shove you need to be able to hang in their when you are losing the possession battle and to close out games

The Roosters 2010 semi and the Warriors 2011 semi are great examples of that

The clubs that can grind games out win premierships and consistantly play semi final footy

We don't fit that bill and if we don't start learning that we will finally pay the ultimate price

Big name Sponsors are really only interested in successful clubs and quality players are really only interested in playing finals footy when the $$$'s are the same

Look at 2010-2012 , when we were seen as possible premierships favourite we attracted quality players

The gulf between the best and the worst NRL clubs grows every season , if we don't start catching up shortly we never will

 

[Telltails]

Money ….. the gulf between the best and the worst NRL clubs. They sought out the admin mess and generate some funds then we can compete in the player market and on the field.

 

[happy_tiger]

Money ….. the gulf between the best and the worst NRL clubs. They sought out the admin mess and generate some funds then we can compete in the player market and on the field.

But even when we sort the mess out , who do you think Greg Inglis , Cooper Cronk ,Sam Burgess etc want to play for when earning the same $$$'s

Club running 13th -16th consistently or a consistent Top 6 club ??

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Money ….. the gulf between the best and the worst NRL clubs. They sought out the admin mess and generate some funds then we can compete in the player market and on the field.

But even when we sort the mess out , who do you think Greg Inglis , Cooper Cronk ,Sam Burgess etc want to play for when earning the same $$$'s

Club running 13th -16th consistently or a consistent Top 6 club ??

Well not necessarily just any money, TPA money in particular.

Canberra and Parra are very well off clubs, problem is they can't spend the money they have available due to the cap. The TPA system is great for clubs who have external contacts.

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Taylor had the right idea last year. I think there was a combination of issues there in that senior players have been brought up through a system that overvalued attacking football (obviously remnant from a time where the game rewarded attacking footy,) a young halves pairing relatively fresh from NYC graduation who ran riot at that level and let's face it, there's no emphasis in defence at that level and JT investing too much in defensive football. The one thing he is guilty of IMO is that he didn't try to implement a blended structure with his players strengths in mind, he overdid it with his structure (Cowboys game is the gleaming example,) and the only time we looked regularly lethal last year was when Teddy had the ball.

The side needs to show a bit of grit, be able to get in the grind and still compete. Our attacking sides in the past we never able to do this. I hope JT has the common sense to make the changes as required, as this season is really about balance, finding the happy medium between Taylorball and Benjiball.

 

[TrueTiger]

People are kidding if they think 5 hit ups and a bomb is the closest way to success. I think its pretty lazy to call that proper structures and systems. That is just basic rubbish that made us get picked off and be very predictable.

That Cowboys games at Ctown was a disgrace, they had a QLD cup style side on the paddock and we wnet one out for 80 minutes. It was horrible tactics on the night against a side there to be beaten.

Did anyone watch the Broncos, Cowboys and Roosters play last season (the three most successful sides)

The 2 best teams Brisbane and North Qld played plenty of footy. They asked alot of quetions. They ran in numbers. Had decoys going, got some offloads going, had some depth in their backs. Roosters often spread the ball early in a set to catch a side napping.

To suggest they went one out and then put a bomb up on their way to success is pretty simplictic for mine.
**They all defended really well no doubt about that.** However it didnt mean they forgone all attack, they found a balance. Im not asking for Benji Ball and sideways rubbish. That all didnt work great, although many of those seasons we were 1 in away from the Top 8 with a horrible injury toll.

We needs way more men in motion , some offloads, some depth in the backs. Put simply we asked no questions before the 20 M line unless Teddy was on fire.

We did plenty of one out rubbish. That is not great sturcutres or systems for mine. I think its lazy to suggest so. Some games we literally sent one men up every single play to get smashed by 3 blokes.

I believe we may be making some progress with Eddie.
You mentioned why those teams can do what they do successfully regularly, but we can't.
It's not simplistic, it's not lazy.. It's fact. You can't attack until you can defend. It's defensive offence.
It's what most here are saying yet a few like you & Steve fail to see…. Despite your 'balance' addendum earlier.

As Steve and Eddie fail to understand the 5 hit ups and kick is called the grind , every team does it for at least 40 % of their games

But then again Steve and Eddie could be right , the "Licence to Thrill" will work again ….. at some stage ..... in some galaxy ........

We just need to wait Ink , be patient :smiley:

Well guys we can all ask who is right and who is wrong when we give our opinions regarding how the team plays,do we throw the ball around randomly and hope it ends up a score on the board,or do we give the opposition the ball on countless occasions and defend our line vigorously until we are dead on our feet and be no better off than when we started the game…..No...we need to learn to defend first and on the back of that defense the attack will come,everyone critises structures,the team has to have structures in place to win games and be competitive...in the words of Wayne Bennett "we have structures in place and the players don't stray from those structures,that's why we are successful"the other thing that must be remembered is the youth of the team needed to understand the rigour and toughness of the NRL game itself...its not easy to step up from NYC and become a superstar in the first week of NRL,they have to learn,even the most seasoned players with big contracts get caught out at times,its the nature of the game...in my opinion,what we saw last year wasn't pretty to watch as a fan,however,with the knowledge of having played the game I could see what JT was trying to implement,a learning curve and a platform for this upcoming season..I honestly believe that the team will do a hell of a lot better this year having a better understanding of what is expected to be a competitive side..the game is tougher and quicker as the years have progressed,keep up or be left forever lamenting at the bottom of the ladder..

 

[Russell]

People are kidding if they think 5 hit ups and a bomb is the closest way to success. I think its pretty lazy to call that proper structures and systems. That is just basic rubbish that made us get picked off and be very predictable.

That Cowboys games at Ctown was a disgrace, they had a QLD cup style side on the paddock and we wnet one out for 80 minutes. It was horrible tactics on the night against a side there to be beaten.

Did anyone watch the Broncos, Cowboys and Roosters play last season (the three most successful sides)

The 2 best teams Brisbane and North Qld played plenty of footy. They asked alot of quetions. They ran in numbers. Had decoys going, got some offloads going, had some depth in their backs. Roosters often spread the ball early in a set to catch a side napping.

To suggest they went one out and then put a bomb up on their way to success is pretty simplictic for mine.
**They all defended really well no doubt about that.** However it didnt mean they forgone all attack, they found a balance. Im not asking for Benji Ball and sideways rubbish. That all didnt work great, although many of those seasons we were 1 in away from the Top 8 with a horrible injury toll.

We needs way more men in motion , some offloads, some depth in the backs. Put simply we asked no questions before the 20 M line unless Teddy was on fire.

We did plenty of one out rubbish. That is not great sturcutres or systems for mine. I think its lazy to suggest so. Some games we literally sent one men up every single play to get smashed by 3 blokes.

I believe we may be making some progress with Eddie.
You mentioned why those teams can do what they do successfully regularly, but we can't.
It's not simplistic, it's not lazy.. It's fact. You can't attack until you can defend. It's defensive offence.
It's what most here are saying yet a few like you & Steve fail to see…. Despite your 'balance' addendum earlier.

As Steve and Eddie fail to understand the 5 hit ups and kick is called the grind , every team does it for at least 40 % of their games

But then again Steve and Eddie could be right , the "Licence to Thrill" will work again ….. at some stage ..... in some galaxy ........

We just need to wait Ink , be patient :smiley:

Well guys we can all ask who is right and who is wrong when we give our opinions regarding how the team plays,do we throw the ball around randomly and hope it ends up a score on the board,or do we give the opposition the ball on countless occasions and defend our line vigorously until we are dead on our feet and be no better off than when we started the game…..No...we need to learn to defend first and on the back of that defense the attack will come,everyone critises structures,the team has to have structures in place to win games and be competitive...in the words of Wayne Bennett "we have structures in place and the players don't stray from those structures,that's why we are successful"the other thing that must be remembered is the youth of the team needed to understand the rigour and toughness of the NRL game itself...its not easy to step up from NYC and become a superstar in the first week of NRL,they have to learn,even the most seasoned players with big contracts get caught out at times,its the nature of the game...in my opinion,what we saw last year wasn't pretty to watch as a fan,however,with the knowledge of having played the game I could see what JT was trying to implement,a learning curve and a platform for this upcoming season..I honestly believe that the team will do a hell of a lot better this year having a better understanding of what is expected to be a competitive side..the game is tougher and quicker as the years have progressed,keep up or be left forever lamenting at the bottom of the ladder..

Good post TT - agree with you.

There was a reason for Taylorball - if the lessons were learned (and I think that mostly they were) then I think this will be a much better year.

Still much to learn, still a few players to buy when we have the ready but we are getting there. I am looking forward to see them putting it together.

Go, you Mighty Tigers!!!!!

 

[Eddie]

"Getting the spoon by a mile…." .

"Or performing worse than we actually did... "
Same difference.
I thought most might pick up on the slight exaggeration.

I wasn't referring to any other years other than last year that willow mentioned... However coming last or 13th or 15th, again... Same difference - playing " free-wheeling footy"
JT has clearly stated what his ambition was re. Last. season... Some choose to ignore it... Doesn't suit their agenda.
There are two basic elements to this game, we are somewhat capable in attack.... Yet weak as pee in D.
You want them to play to their strengths.... Freewheeling. That doesn't work... And learning how to defend as a Top 4 team that you want them to be doesn't happen overnight either..
You are one of the most blinkered and one eyed posters on this subject, it's a laugh you talk about "balance" when you posts don't contain an ounce of that.

Taylor talked up a big game when he came across. I didn't discount his vision. He did need to toughen up and focus on defence. However running one out for 80 minutes in games and calling that "tough, structured footy" I just didnt buy it like some others.

He rubbished Sheens and Potter and said "we had been down the bottom for years" and that "defence was not a priority at the Tigers" I thought it was disrespectful and said so at the time. Taylor soon found out though it was more difficult then he thought.

I just don't like the fact that Taylor and his band of apologists find 1000 different stats to spons way we improved despite finishing equal last. Last season we had less injuries then we have had for several, several years.

I thought the season was poor and worse then Potters season in 2014 which was decimated by injury.

He will be a better coach for last years experience.He knows the players betters and their strenghts. Im looking forward to this season.

Benji since he left has even said that defence wasn't a priority and when Sheens did try and grind in 2010-2011 they would often ignore him

When push comes to shove you need to be able to hang in their when you are losing the possession battle and to close out games

The Roosters 2010 semi and the Warriors 2011 semi are great examples of that

The clubs that can grind games out win premierships and consistantly play semi final footy

We don't fit that bill and if we don't start learning that we will finally pay the ultimate price

Big name Sponsors are really only interested in successful clubs and quality players are really only interested in playing finals footy when the $$$'s are the same

Look at 2010-2012 , when we were seen as possible premierships favourite we attracted quality players

The gulf between the best and the worst NRL clubs grows every season , if we don't start catching up shortly we never will

Payten also came out and said it was a load of rubbish that the Tigers did not focus on defence.

I just find it astounding that Taylor and plenty of people continue to hark back to others years failures all the time.

In light of the fact we came 15th last year and lost to the wooden spooners twice. Last season was close to the worst year in our history despite a good run with injuries. "failures" including losing semi finals in over time and in the last 2 minutes (I would kill for that now)

If big name sponsors and big name players are interested in semi final football then we would not be an attractive proposition based on how we played last year.

Your right if we don't start catching up soon we never will. Last year was very poor despite what the apologists will tell you, just as poor if not worse then plenty of previous years.

:deadhorse:

 

[innsaneink]

I don't think anyone advocating JTs attemp at getting the team to learn how to forge a basis and platform in defence is saying the season wasn't poor.
It was bland and boring at times but a necessary evil in the bigger scheme of things imo… No quick fixes here.
Quoting two seasons in the decade post 05 does little rely but reinforce how weak we are in the area he is working on
People hark back to other seasons because the problem is ingrained in the club

 

[Eddie]

Taylor had the right idea last year. The one thing he is guilty of IMO is that he didn't try to implement a blended structure with his players strengths in mind, he overdid it with his structure (Cowboys game is the gleaming example,) and the only time we looked regularly lethal last year was when Teddy had the ball.

This is well put.

You need to have your players strengths in mind. Because you need to have them motivated and believing in the game plan.

Like you said last season we looked like zombies in certain games outside of Tedesco.

Im not at all against the need for defensive focus and fortitude. However I think this season you will see a better balance and better morale around the team.

 

[stevetiger]

Last year was terrible and Taylor stuffed up. It was our worst ever season. Argue as much as you want but the results speak for themselves. When he came out and had a go at previous coaches/players it was a joke but unfortunately it was on Taylor.

It showed that he was extremely inexperienced and had a lot to learn.

I hope he gets it right this year.

 

[TrueTiger]

Last year was terrible and Taylor stuffed up. It was our worst ever season. Argue as much as you want but the results speak for themselves. When he came out and had a go at previous coaches/players it was a joke but unfortunately it was on Taylor.

It showed that he was extremely inexperienced and had a lot to learn.

I hope he gets it right this year.

Once again Steve,on about how JT stuffed up :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah ,unfortunately you dont want to accept what he was trying to do….whatever he did last year I will bet the team perform much better this year,but then again you will find something to nit pick him for....

 

[stevetiger]

Last year was terrible and Taylor stuffed up. It was our worst ever season. Argue as much as you want but the results speak for themselves. When he came out and had a go at previous coaches/players it was a joke but unfortunately it was on Taylor.

It showed that he was extremely inexperienced and had a lot to learn.

I hope he gets it right this year.

Once again Steve,on about how JT stuffed up :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah ,unfortunately you dont want to accept what he was trying to do….whatever he did last year I will bet the team perform much better this year,but then again you will find something to nit pick him for....

Once again you and the apologists can't face reality. It's all Wobbie's fault. In 258 years time our defence will be spot on. You can't attack without defending. Statistically we had a great season last year - we improved our for and against by .38 points in the critical 2 minutes past quarter time period. Blah, blah, blah, blah …..

Check the ladder from last year. End of story.

 

[TrueTiger]

Last year was terrible and Taylor stuffed up. It was our worst ever season. Argue as much as you want but the results speak for themselves. When he came out and had a go at previous coaches/players it was a joke but unfortunately it was on Taylor.

It showed that he was extremely inexperienced and had a lot to learn.

I hope he gets it right this year.

Once again Steve,on about how JT stuffed up :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah :blah ,unfortunately you dont want to accept what he was trying to do….whatever he did last year I will bet the team perform much better this year,but then again you will find something to nit pick him for....

Once again you and the apologists can't face reality. It's all Wobbie's fault. In 258 years time our defence will be spot on. You can't attack without defending. Statistically we had a great season last year - we improved our for and against by .38 points in the critical 2 minutes past quarter time period. Blah, blah, blah, blah …..

Check the ladder from last year. End of story.

All I said was that you cant see what JT was trying to do last year with this young group,your quick to blame JT,maybe it took the young ones a lot longer to adapt to nrl …but keep blaming JT .... :master: