Alcohol

[TillLindemann]

I actually did a study and being a wowser is far worse for your health than alcohol.

 

[TillLindemann]

Decriminalised too in a lot of states - you get a ticket
rather than going to court below a certain amount.
We'd be better off taxing it in my personal opinion.

Alcohol is the devils juice. the problem with 1 or 2
drinks is some people are wired differently and
cannot stop at a few. Sometimes I question why and
how booze was even legalised. Some pubs are open
before the chemist, big drinking culture in Oz too smh

Hope everyone that has gotten in trouble or has a
problem with it keeps fighting the good fight and
manages to face their demons. Addiction is a MF

Disagree strongly, I think frequently getting blind should be mandatory.

Pissheads built our civilisation, while teetotalers stayed home having a sook.

 

[Kelce68]

Mum used to say “there’s always someone who’s worse off”.

I am not an angry drunk so never had fights unless there was an angry drunk around.

“people with self control don't engage in these behaviours”
Yeah that’s just incorrect. Some of us are non addictive. I’m coming off heavy PK meds now. Got to the point the Doctors didn’t know what to do bcoz I got to min dose pretty quick but every time I drop it I’d get the DTs in the body. Now some of these meds give me a real nice buzz mixed, so I enjoy them but also know that it’s time and once it’s time in my head to stop there’s no halting it. So it’s taken me about two weeks to almost halve my intake and before the end of this month I’ll be free of meds with no help from the doctors. It’s like a switch inside my brain, but I know others are not like that. But I can’t agree with you when you say “people with self control don't engage in these behaviours”

No it's not.

I'm referring to people who engage in excessive use of any substance or particularly, those who then become abusive, as per your personal experience with DV.

So, I'll reiterate; those with self control aren't abusive and don't allow themselves to be owned by a substance.

 

[TillLindemann]

Pure evil

 

[Kelce68]

Oh it makes sense.
Nicotine is one of the most poisonous of all drugs worse than arsenic and cyanide but obviously in lower does in a ciggy but there is also arsenic in cigarettes anyway, just for that extra pick-me-up. But yeah it’s time pot was legalised, gateway drug my ass, that’s alcohol. The only reason pot is not legal is they don’t know how to tax it, but as a part taker of natures gifts I don’t want them to legalise it, just decriminalise it. Help the people who can’t help themselves and end up addicts, and this doesn’t happen smoking pot. But alc, cigs, and chems, are highly addictive and our approach should not be banning or taxing as that hurts the non addictive people (like me🤪). We need to be educating people to help themselves and have the mental capacity and strength of will to handle their own shite. Or we could just leave em to their own devices, survival of the fittest? I know I’ll be ok.
No more laws or taxes. They are trying to price us out of alc and cigs, soon only the rich will be able to afford them and that’s not fair on the majority. One thing I can say is some of these newer chems have a very strong hook, that took one of my besties, nearly had the bro inlaw; he was getting angry all the time and recognised it when I confronted him about it, he stopped almost immediately.
Drugs are bad ok.
Except pot. 🪴

Mate, just be mindful that we need to be accurate on when describing these compounds.

Nicotine is one of the most poisonous of all drugs worse than arsenic and cyanide but obviously in lower does in a ciggy but there is also arsenic in cigarettes anyway, just for that extra pick-me-up.

Nicotine can actually be quite a beneficial nootropic. Among on things, it acts on the acetylcholine receptors in the brain, which promotes the production, and limits the reuptake of acetylcholine, one of the main drivers of improved cognitive performance. It's used in its pure form by scholars, poets, athletes, heads of state, etc, to temporarily boost brain performance. It has a different action, but similar outcome (in some ways) to something like alpha GPC, which is an a-ch precursor in the brain.

 

[Kelce68]

I drank to excess nearly every night for a couple of years, because like you, I didn't have the self-control to stop when I'd had enough.

I was doing things that were completely out of character for me which resulted in getting into more trouble than I could handle.
I drove my car many times when I knew I would have been well and truly over the limit and luckily was able to drive past a booze bus one night.
I eventually came to my senses and stopped drinking alcohol completely about 25 years ago.

I had a small cancerous growth removed from my bladder about 10 years ago which I would have thought may have been caused by grog, but my Dr. suggested 'smoking' is a cause of bladder cancer.
I stopped smoking about 25 years ago as well.

There has to be a reason why alcohol is called 'the demon drink'.... for a lot of people.

Good for you brother.

Sorry to hear about the run in with cancer, but the rest of your story is one of triumph.

Bloody oath.

 

[coivtny]

My point stands, on no planet is pot more dangerous than the totality health and social issues arsing from alcohol and cigarettes and its deemed completely fine to consume. The broader point was things are only legal or not legal by the whims of the current government. Addiction is addiction, just like sugar etc. Citizen safety is fine to be mandated for bike helmets and seat belts etc but out the window with alcohol and cigarettes. Makes zero sense to have one substance banned and not another when arguably alcohol, (domestics, drunk driving, health/medical issues) are predominantly more harmful.

So, to achieve the consistency you're seeking, are you arguing to ban cigarettes and alcohol or to legalise pot? If the latter, does it extend to everyone's drugs of choice or just pot?

 

[Kelce68]

Fair enough. Whether I like it or not, it will happen in Australia and probably sooner rather than later. I know there are people who enjoy a smoke every now and then without serious harmful effects. But there are others for whom the combination of their brain chemistry with the drug's chemistry is a disaster. They are the people I worry about if MJ becomes freely available. There is always a price for any freedom.

I think you hit the nail on the head here @coivtny . And your previous share of your personal experience with the young fella is both a cautionary tale and one with a happy ending.

But there are others for whom the combination of their brain chemistry with the drug's chemistry is a disaster.

Caffeine can cause heart palpatations, severe anxiety and insomnia.

Alcohol can ravage someone's addiction resilience and lead to catastrophic decision making.

Oxy/Morphine can consume a person to the point of debilitative dependence.

Weed can exacerbate instability in the psyche of certain people, particularly in excess.

Peanuts can literally kill, rather rapidly, certain portions of the population.

Gluten and FODMAPS can destroy some people's digestive system, often times to dangerous or fatal levels.

There are far worse, regulated and/or legal substances that exist for our consumption in society.

None of those reasons should be cause for illegality or restriction in my opinion. Just as people who experience negative effects from caffeine or alcohol tend to, when mature and grounded enough to do so, tend to avoid it, so too should the same approach be taken with cannabis.

There is zero reason for it to still be illegal. Particularly considering the double standards that exist with copious other, equally or worse, compounds in society at present.

 

[Kelce68]

Decriminalised too in a lot of states - you get a ticket
rather than going to court below a certain amount.
We'd be better off taxing it in my personal opinion.

Alcohol is the devils juice. the problem with 1 or 2
drinks is some people are wired differently and
cannot stop at a few. Sometimes I question why and
how booze was even legalised. Some pubs are open
before the chemist, big drinking culture in Oz too smh

Hope everyone that has gotten in trouble or has a
problem with it keeps fighting the good fight and
manages to face their demons. Addiction is a MF

the problem with 1 or 2 drinks is some people are wired differently and cannot stop at a few.

I understand I'm in the minority here, but I think this very excuse is the reason people are never held to account on such things.

'Cannot stop at a few' doesn't mean they biologically don't have the capacity to.

That's not to say it is not infinitely more difficult for addicts to show self control, but everytime people espouse the notion that they 'literally can't', it papers over the lack of self control deficiencies within these people.

Everything is a choice. Some choices are just far harder than others.

 

[Kaito]

I think you hit the nail on the head here @coivtny . And your previous share of your personal experience with the young fella is both a cautionary tale and one with a happy ending.


Caffeine can cause heart palpatations, severe anxiety and insomnia.

Alcohol can ravage someone's addiction resilience and lead to catastrophic decision making.

Oxy/Morphine can consume a person to the point of debilitative dependence.

Weed can exacerbate instability in the psyche of certain people, particularly in excess.

Peanuts can literally kill, rather rapidly, certain portions of the population.

Gluten and FODMAPS can destroy some people's digestive system, often times to dangerous or fatal levels.

There are far worse, regulated and/or legal substances that exist for our consumption in society.

None of those reasons should be cause for illegality or restriction in my opinion. Just as people who experience negative effects from caffeine or alcohol tend to, when mature and grounded enough to do so, tend to avoid it, so too should the same approach be taken with cannabis.

There is zero reason for it to still be illegal. Particularly considering the double standards that exist with copious other, equally or worse, compounds in society at present.

Your posts on this topic are great... a mix of Robert
Sapolsky's 'free will' & Andrew Huberman's neurobiology

 

[Kelce68]

So, to achieve the consistency you're seeking, are you arguing to ban cigarettes and alcohol or to legalise pot? If the latter, does it extend to everyone's drugs of choice or just pot?

Weed.

Because the literature is abundantly clear. On any major metric it has preferential outcomes to other, already legal compounds.

The likes of cocaine, mdma or other opioids, whilst they have very nuanced uses in medicine, cannot claim the same preferential impacts over substances like alcohol.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Oxy/Morphine can consume a person to the point of debilitative dependence.

I’m watching a minI series atm called Dopesick, about OxyContin. The addiction is one of the most intense imaginable. Will lead people to rob Pharmacies for it and take nothing else. The manufacturers deliberately designed it to be that addictive. Scary stuff.

 

[Kelce68]

Your posts on this topic are great... a mix of Robert
Sapolsky's 'free will' & Andrew Huberman's neurobiology

You're always a good egg, my man.

 

[TrueTiger]

I can honestly say that when a good mate of mine back in the late ninety's was a postman and had a great job,his major downfall was he loved JD and coke as well as a bong morning,noon and night...
He met a girl who he really thought a lot of,but she tried to get him off the bongs and grog because he was always in a state of bliss,she tried to help him and eventually she left..
His answer to that was to drive his car stoned and at 100 ks an hour killed himself...
So my point is maybe the grog and weed increased the depression he had because she left,maybe sober and off the weed he could still be here,,,I dont have the answer but as some say on here different personalities can have different effects from the grog and weed as I have seen personally,,
Will legalising the weed make society better or do we continue down the road of grog,smokes and weed ie live life how you want as long as it doesnt affect others or get pushed on others...

 

[coivtny]

I’m watching a minI series atm called Dopesick, about OxyContin. The addiction is one of the most intense imaginable. Will lead people to rob Pharmacies for it and take nothing else. The manufacturers deliberately designed it to be that addictive. Scary stuff.

You're right. A few years ago I had surgery and when I left I was given 6 packets (24 tabs) of Endone for pain management and told to take it when I felt pain. I'd never heard of it. When my oldest son came home he asked me if I knew Endone's nickname. As I'd never heard of it I said no. He said it was referred to as 'hillbilly heroin" and was highly addictive. I was shocked that I was given Endone without any explanation of the risks.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

You're right. A few years ago I had surgery and when I left I was given 6 packets (24 tabs) of Endone for pain management and told to take it when I felt pain. I'd never heard of it. When my oldest son came home he asked me if I knew Endone's nickname. As I'd never heard of it I said no. He said it was referred to as 'hillbilly heroin" and was highly addictive. I was shocked that I was given Endone without any explanation of the risks.

A few months ago i had to go for an MRI. I’m claustrophobic, so the Specialist prescribed me a sedative (blitzing on the name). It put me in such a relaxed state, I could easily see why those sorts of medications are addictive. As I stepped out of the car, about 15 mins after I took it, my knees buckled.

 

[Kaito]

You're always a good egg, my man.

My guy, you already know, nothing but love bro

 

[upthetigers]

Decriminalised too in a lot of states - you get a ticket
rather than going to court below a certain amount.
We'd be better off taxing it in my personal opinion.

Alcohol is the devils juice. the problem with 1 or 2
drinks is some people are wired differently and
cannot stop at a few. Sometimes I question why and
how booze was even legalised. Some pubs are open
before the chemist, big drinking culture in Oz too smh

Hope everyone that has gotten in trouble or has a
problem with it keeps fighting the good fight and
manages to face their demons. Addiction is a MF

Alcohol is socially acceptable. If it was invented today it would be a controlled substance without question, there are more alcohol related deaths then illicit substances combined.

 

[Winston Churchill]

So, to achieve the consistency you're seeking, are you arguing to ban cigarettes and alcohol or to legalise pot? If the latter, does it extend to everyone's drugs of choice or just pot?

Decriminalise pot, I've never smoked it in my life and have no dog in the fight but I recognise reality. I recognise many people use it for medicinal purposes and a far greater number use it for recreational purposes. Where is the arbitrary line drawn now for banned substances? why and how? And how can anyone argue pot should be banned over alcohol and cigarettes which is objectively worse for you on every level. I also believe the government shouldn't be involved with seat belts or bike helmets or 99.9% of things in your life but I recognise there are low IQ individuals throughout society that need to be told things are dangerous or safe.

 

[BZN]

Good for you brother.

Sorry to hear about the run in with cancer, but the rest of your story is one of triumph.

Bloody oath.

Thanks for your thoughts Kelce68.
I passed a small amount of blood doing a wee on one occasion so pretty much went to my Dr. straight away.
The cancer was very minor and hadn't spread as they got to it very early.