Coronavirus Outbreak

[Tiger5150]

It’s not that simple. You can’t debate the facts. You can debate policy implications but you can’t debate the facts.

Can I debate assumptions? Because that was the very basis of the article that I posted this morning. The internationally accepted range of reproduction for the Delta variant is 5 to 9. The R factor used in the Doherty report is 3.6. So it would have to be considered as an outlier.

Now, the authors of the report have reasons for this assumption, but assumptions aren't facts and they should be challenged. The outputs from this report, and the irreversible policy decisions that will flow from their adoption, are all predicated on those assumptions.

Whatever you do, don't question them.

Fair points. That is cool to me.

***In my opinion that number isn't relevant***. You have to understand that these numbers are all just approximations. The key is to get the right message across. You can't predict to a completely accurate level of detail and those numbers you quote are within range of reality ***which is all they need to be.***

"That number" isnt relevant? In a discussion about the spread and number of infectious cases, the r number isnt relevant? Do you actually know what the r number means? It is the exponential coefficient for growth, the number of people each infectious person infects. It is THE MOST critical number in the consideration. It means everything. You clearly dont understand exponential growth.

You may be correct in your individual number **but it doesn't change the picture**. The picture is very clear because we have massive data-sets that are showing clear trends. Those trends are being backed up in real time.


That number LITERALLY changes the picture exponentially by orders of magnitude, MASSIVELY. It is the exponential multiplier. It is everything. You have zero clue.

You aren't getting political advice. It's health advice. It's not going to be perfect. If we keep following this approach this gives us our best chance.

I thought it was science and the science was "perfect" (your words)?

 

[Tim Sheens]

I find it annoying that some people say that the disease doesn't have the signs of a deadly one. They fail to realise that lockdown is one of the reasons.

I did some rough numbers on this.

UK/USA have had about 2000 deaths per million people. Data from here:- https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
Australia has a population of about 25 million.
Say we get to 80% vaccinated and everyone who is vaccinated is safe. That leaves 20% of the population as the percentage exposed to COVID.
In that scenario we'd get 10,000 deaths.

The flaws in those numbers are as follows:-

**1. The 2000 deaths per million population is over the course of the pandemic and not 1 year.**
2. That scenario assumes no deaths for vaccinated people.
3. Getting to 80% may be hard.

More people would die of heart disease and dementia compared to COVID.

Lower vaccination rates would chance the picture completely. If we were completely unvaccinated you are looking at 50 000 deaths which would be our biggest killer by far.

Happy for anyone to come up with rougher figures or point our anything I missed.

The way I view it though is if we can somehow get people vaccinated this isn't a big issue. The unvaccinated will also develop COVID and then develop immunity so deaths should decrease over time.

If people don't get vaccinated this would be a catastrophe. People are getting vaccinated though. From yesterdays figures I get a figure of 56% first dose protected in NSW. If we get to 80% by end of this lockdown and people follow through I think we can basically beat this.

https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/australias-covid-19-vaccine-rollout

For every 528 people in the US a person has died of Covid-19. 1 in 528. Think about that for a minute. That probable equates to 1 person in every street or two has died of Covid-19 in the US.

>**It's about 2 percent of the population**. It's freaken horrendous.

I get a couple of broad takings out of this:-

1. Lockdowns/border closures in Australia have saved so many lives.
2. The Delta strain coming late in the pandemic has been exceptionally lucky for us. It's bad it's here but if the virus was this contagious at the start I think we'd be similar to the UK or the US.
3. Vaccines are going to save so many lives.

This has been bothering me since you posted it and it needs to be corrected. You are out by a couple of orders of magnitude. It’s not 2% but approximately 0.02% of the population. I can do the maths for you if you like.

It was already corrected. I didn't add the correct decimal point. The numbers are correct but the percentage is incorrect.

It's 2000 people per million that have died from the virus. That is significant. I think it is .2% of the population. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

***I also think the figure for heart disease is about 0.072 % of the population.***

So without vaccines and with less restrictions than what Australia has had you get a lot of deaths from COVID. It's not a joke.

Maaaaate....please stop.

Firstly you didnt just "add the correct decimal point" there is a MASSIVE difference between 2% and 0.2% and you doubled down numerous times and kept reporting it.

Now you are lying or merely making things up regarding relative deaths due to heart disease. Where do you get **0.072%** from? **POST YOUR DATA** if you are going to post such provocative information. It is complete made up rubbish if not deliberate misinformation (lies).

According to the **American Heart Association**, cardiovascular disease killed 868,662 people in 2018 which represents ***0.26%*** of the US population IN ONE YEAR which is 30% higher than COVID has killed over 18 months. Almost 4 times higher than you claim.

https://www.heart.org/-/media/phd-files-2/science-news/2/2021-heart-and-stroke-stat-update/2021_heart_disease_and_stroke_statistics_update_fact_sheet_at_a_glance.pdf

I am NOT minimising the deadliness of COVID, I am correcting Earls lies when he posts that COVID kills 2% then is corrected to 0.2% and then to gin his point up lies about the rate of cardiovascular disease to make it seem worse is pretty bad. Its misinformation and dangerous and goes against what Earl rabbits on about.

I think that Earl has me on foe because he hates me pointing out his lies but I think its important that he get pulled up. Can someone repost so @Earl will read and hopefully realise that he cant just continue to make stuff up.

Don't think lockdowns work on heart disease, but maybe we could get a report that confirms they do if one inputs certain data.

 

[Mighty_Tiger]

The Israel experience of opening at 80%. I worry for our children who cannot be vaccinated yet. I also worry about our PM. I've seen greater sincerity on the faces of cobras and I've seen quite a few of them.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-08-21/israel-shows-what-life-looks-like-at-80-per-cent-vaccinated/100394760

I don't think Israel is a great test case. A large part of the population is Palestinian and I believe the Palestinian territories are well behind on vaccination. I believe I also read the take up was slow in East Jerusalem.

Iceland would be a better case of what it would look like for us (single island nation,) which appears to be a lot better.

Read the article. It's more alarmist than the reality of the situation suggests. Restrictions exist such as having to wear masks indoors and having to be vaccinated to attend certain events.

The whole developed world is opening up. We are way behind the curve. That cannot last. The science states we will be fine and we have no choice.

Geez you look at things very one way don’t you.

We actually aren’t way off if anything most developed countries wish they could be us.

We have been doing things differently because we are a very unique country.

People blow this whole lockdown scenario out of proportion. Most countries have been in lockdown for 6-9mths over the last 18mths. 2mths is nothing even then its not even the while country either.

We do have a leading heathcare capability, our economy actually bounced back brilliantly and faster than any other country. Job losses compared to other countries is lower. Government assistance being provided is better than most countries etc. utilities and banks are putting profits on hold.

The way in which we make decisions is targeted to keep our health system afloat. Alot of the developed nations have not been able to do that. US only count deaths who go to hospitals - if you die at home, street m, car etc its not counted. Italy pick who gets treated. UK hospitals have evolved.

We have lived life normally for the most part of the last 18mths which the world has been very jealous of & based on the jab rate will be more adoptive and ready to go before the other nations.

It doesn’t mean we shouldn’t strive to be better, attempt to be infront and continue to do things differently.

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

 

[Demps]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

 

[pawsandclaws1]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Party time! Get in first. Don't get the needle after it has been used 7 times.

 

[Tiger5150]

I find it annoying that some people say that the disease doesn't have the signs of a deadly one. They fail to realise that lockdown is one of the reasons.

I did some rough numbers on this.

UK/USA have had about 2000 deaths per million people. Data from here:- https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/
Australia has a population of about 25 million.
Say we get to 80% vaccinated and everyone who is vaccinated is safe. That leaves 20% of the population as the percentage exposed to COVID.
In that scenario we'd get 10,000 deaths.

The flaws in those numbers are as follows:-

**1. The 2000 deaths per million population is over the course of the pandemic and not 1 year.**
2. That scenario assumes no deaths for vaccinated people.
3. Getting to 80% may be hard.

More people would die of heart disease and dementia compared to COVID.

Lower vaccination rates would chance the picture completely. If we were completely unvaccinated you are looking at 50 000 deaths which would be our biggest killer by far.

Happy for anyone to come up with rougher figures or point our anything I missed.

The way I view it though is if we can somehow get people vaccinated this isn't a big issue. The unvaccinated will also develop COVID and then develop immunity so deaths should decrease over time.

If people don't get vaccinated this would be a catastrophe. People are getting vaccinated though. From yesterdays figures I get a figure of 56% first dose protected in NSW. If we get to 80% by end of this lockdown and people follow through I think we can basically beat this.

https://www.health.gov.au/initiatives-and-programs/covid-19-vaccines/australias-covid-19-vaccine-rollout

For every 528 people in the US a person has died of Covid-19. 1 in 528. Think about that for a minute. That probable equates to 1 person in every street or two has died of Covid-19 in the US.

>**It's about 2 percent of the population**. It's freaken horrendous.

I get a couple of broad takings out of this:-

1. Lockdowns/border closures in Australia have saved so many lives.
2. The Delta strain coming late in the pandemic has been exceptionally lucky for us. It's bad it's here but if the virus was this contagious at the start I think we'd be similar to the UK or the US.
3. Vaccines are going to save so many lives.

This has been bothering me since you posted it and it needs to be corrected. You are out by a couple of orders of magnitude. It’s not 2% but approximately 0.02% of the population. I can do the maths for you if you like.

It was already corrected. I didn't add the correct decimal point. The numbers are correct but the percentage is incorrect.

It's 2000 people per million that have died from the virus. That is significant. I think it is .2% of the population. Please correct me if I'm wrong.

***I also think the figure for heart disease is about 0.072 % of the population.***

So without vaccines and with less restrictions than what Australia has had you get a lot of deaths from COVID. It's not a joke.

Maaaaate....please stop.

Firstly you didnt just "add the correct decimal point" there is a MASSIVE difference between 2% and 0.2% and you doubled down numerous times and kept reporting it.

Now you are lying or merely making things up regarding relative deaths due to heart disease. Where do you get **0.072%** from? **POST YOUR DATA** if you are going to post such provocative information. It is complete made up rubbish if not deliberate misinformation (lies).

According to the **American Heart Association**, cardiovascular disease killed 868,662 people in 2018 which represents ***0.26%*** of the US population IN ONE YEAR which is 30% higher than COVID has killed over 18 months. Almost 4 times higher than you claim.

https://www.heart.org/-/media/phd-files-2/science-news/2/2021-heart-and-stroke-stat-update/2021_heart_disease_and_stroke_statistics_update_fact_sheet_at_a_glance.pdf

I am NOT minimising the deadliness of COVID, I am correcting Earls lies when he posts that COVID kills 2% then is corrected to 0.2% and then to gin his point up lies about the rate of cardiovascular disease to make it seem worse is pretty bad. Its misinformation and dangerous and goes against what Earl rabbits on about.

I think that Earl has me on foe because he hates me pointing out his lies but I think its important that he get pulled up. Can someone repost so @Earl will read and hopefully realise that he cant just continue to make stuff up.

Don't think lockdowns work on heart disease, but maybe we could get a report that confirms they do if one inputs certain data.

Agreed of course that lockdowns, or very few epidemiological levers you can pull to reduce heart disease deaths and OF COURSE if lockdowns and other restrictions didnt happen COVID deaths would have been much higher and probably more than heart disease. That is not the point I am making here. I am merely repeatedly correcting Earls lies and misinformation.

Earl was making the point about how bad COVID is by relating the death rate of 0.2% of the population for Covid (over 18 months) against his totally made up (in the absence of references) number of 0.072% of the population for heart disease. I merely posted the correct numbers backed by reputable references that heart disease kills **0.28%** of the US population ***annually*** vs 0.2% of the US population over 18 months. It is an important correction.

 

[Demps]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Party time! Get in first. Don't get the needle after it has been used 7 times.

Apparently 1 vile does 5 or 6 jabs.
Fresh needle obvs.

I shot gunned first but I don't know if the others follow the rules of shot gun. Lame.

 

[Geo]

The Israel experience of opening at 80%. I worry for our children who cannot be vaccinated yet. I also worry about our PM. I've seen greater sincerity on the faces of cobras and I've seen quite a few of them.

https://www.abc.net.au/news/2021-08-21/israel-shows-what-life-looks-like-at-80-per-cent-vaccinated/100394760

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/federal/doherty-institute-boss-says-reopening-still-safe-with-hundreds-of-daily-covid-cases-20210823-p58lah.html

>“The really big important issue about moving from phase A to phase B is that we’re moving out of an environment of zero-COVID,” she told the ABC’s The Drum program on Monday evening. “Zero-COVID is no longer the goal once you have 70 to 80 per cent of people vaccinated. Whether you start at 30 cases or 800 cases you can still open up safely.”
>
>“**With 70 per cent vaccination you will get hundreds of thousands of cases, even starting from 30 cases.** However, in the presence of vaccination, your deaths and hospitalisations will be greatly reduced. With the addition of public health measures you can also contain those infections.”

https://www.smh.com.au/politics/nsw/youngest-prioritised-in-planned-staggered-return-to-school-next-term-20210823-p58l93.html

I'm trusting the epidemiologists and the science. They are stating no matter what you start from cases are going to skyrocket. We should all be prepared for this.

Kids are back at school all over the world.

I have a 10 yo. I also have a 17 yo doing the HSC. My 17 yo has been vaccinated. I don't think we can wait and vaccinate all the kids prior to returning to school. Vaccination for kids might not even be a good option. The science isn't clear on this just yet.

The increasing number in Children getting COVID is a massive concern .. screw numbers and data

 

[Tim Sheens]

It’s not that simple. You can’t debate the facts. You can debate policy implications but you can’t debate the facts.

Can I debate assumptions? Because that was the very basis of the article that I posted this morning. The internationally accepted range of reproduction for the Delta variant is 5 to 9. The R factor used in the Doherty report is 3.6. So it would have to be considered as an outlier.

Now, the authors of the report have reasons for this assumption, but assumptions aren't facts and they should be challenged. The outputs from this report, and the irreversible policy decisions that will flow from their adoption, are all predicated on those assumptions.

Whatever you do, don't question them.

Fair points. That is cool to me.

***In my opinion that number isn't relevant***. You have to understand that these numbers are all just approximations. The key is to get the right message across. You can't predict to a completely accurate level of detail and those numbers you quote are within range of reality ***which is all they need to be.***

"That number" isnt relevant? In a discussion about the spread and number of infectious cases, the r number isnt relevant? Do you actually know what the r number means? It is the exponential coefficient for growth, the number of people each infectious person infects. It is THE MOST critical number in the consideration. It means everything. You clearly dont understand exponential growth.

You may be correct in your individual number **but it doesn't change the picture**. The picture is very clear because we have massive data-sets that are showing clear trends. Those trends are being backed up in real time.


That number LITERALLY changes the picture exponentially by orders of magnitude, MASSIVELY. It is the exponential multiplier. It is everything. You have zero clue.

You aren't getting political advice. It's health advice. It's not going to be perfect. If we keep following this approach this gives us our best chance.

I thought it was science and the science was "perfect" (your words)?

I think you missed an important sentence amongst the figures of that which you quoted and the thoughts may have been missed by the author as well when typing **"The key is to get the right message across."**

 

[Devon Head]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Mine was AZ which seems to hit ppl a little harder. Any of my mates lucky enough to get Pfizer just said a little arm pain at needle site.

 

[Tiger5150]

It’s not that simple. You can’t debate the facts. You can debate policy implications but you can’t debate the facts.

Can I debate assumptions? Because that was the very basis of the article that I posted this morning. The internationally accepted range of reproduction for the Delta variant is 5 to 9. The R factor used in the Doherty report is 3.6. So it would have to be considered as an outlier.

Now, the authors of the report have reasons for this assumption, but assumptions aren't facts and they should be challenged. The outputs from this report, and the irreversible policy decisions that will flow from their adoption, are all predicated on those assumptions.

Whatever you do, don't question them.

Fair points. That is cool to me.

***In my opinion that number isn't relevant***. You have to understand that these numbers are all just approximations. The key is to get the right message across. You can't predict to a completely accurate level of detail and those numbers you quote are within range of reality ***which is all they need to be.***

"That number" isnt relevant? In a discussion about the spread and number of infectious cases, the r number isnt relevant? Do you actually know what the r number means? It is the exponential coefficient for growth, the number of people each infectious person infects. It is THE MOST critical number in the consideration. It means everything. You clearly dont understand exponential growth.

You may be correct in your individual number **but it doesn't change the picture**. The picture is very clear because we have massive data-sets that are showing clear trends. Those trends are being backed up in real time.


That number LITERALLY changes the picture exponentially by orders of magnitude, MASSIVELY. It is the exponential multiplier. It is everything. You have zero clue.

You aren't getting political advice. It's health advice. It's not going to be perfect. If we keep following this approach this gives us our best chance.

I thought it was science and the science was "perfect" (your words)?

I think you missed an important sentence amongst the figures of that which you quoted and the thoughts may have been missed by the author as well when typing **"The key is to get the right message across."**

Good point and I did see that sentence and considered the irony.

Im not sure of your meaning or of Earls. It seems to me that Earl is VERY keen on getting a *particular* message across and Im sure in his mind it is also the *right* message. For me, its important that it is the truth and the truth is an important component in getting whatever message across. For Earl the truth seems a less important aspect as long as he gets HIS message across.

 

[Demps]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Mine was AZ which seems to hit ppl a little harder. Any of my mates lucky enough to get Pfizer just said a little arm pain at needle site.

Interesting.
See how I go.

Been through worse.
?

Thanks for the info though.

 

[Tiger5150]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Mine was AZ which seems to hit ppl a little harder. Any of my mates lucky enough to get Pfizer just said a little arm pain at needle site.

Ive heard anecdotally that the first AZ jab belts you and the second Pfizer gets you. My son was leveled by his first AZ jab.

 

[mike]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Mine was AZ which seems to hit ppl a little harder. Any of my mates lucky enough to get Pfizer just said a little arm pain at needle site.

Ive heard anecdotally that the first AZ jab belts you and the second Pfizer gets you. My son was leveled by his first AZ jab.

Most reporting the second AZ should be fine, that was certainly my experience. Headache for a couple of days with the first, no reaction at all with the second.

 

[earl]

We have lived life normally for the most part of the last 18mths which the world has been very jealous of & based on the jab rate will be more adoptive and ready to go before the other nations.

I totally agree. We've done really well. When I said we were behind the curve I didn't mean we were backwards. The issue is that we've done so well and we haven't had to face the same issues. The point being we've got these learning's from other countries.

I'm amazed at how good we are handling this situation.

 

[earl]

Don't think lockdowns work on heart disease, but maybe we could get a report that confirms they do if one inputs certain data.

The point is the numbers mate. That is the only point. We lose 18k people each year to heart disease. It's largely preventable.

 

[cochise]

Gladys Berejiklian said it last night.

What did she say ? Every time I listen to her she gets it pretty much right. The last poor comment I heard her state was that NSW can handle anything. No area has been able to handle the Delta strain without high vaccination rates.

I can't remember the exact quote but it was along the lines that we are going to have to accept that there will be deaths, more deaths than we are having now, but we have to accept that and it is the reality we face. Just like we do with the Flu.

 

[Pascoes_barber]

Wish me luck brothers ?

Had mine on Sat morning and it hit my like a bus around midnight. Cold sweats, fever, headaches, body aches and severe fatigue. Was crook Sunday and some of yesterday. Still feel fatigued and foggy headed however on the mend. Good luck.

Interesting man.
Heard some similar feedback from others.

My co worker said they were fine and then 10 days later they were sizzled.
No energy.
Delayed effect.

Gotta roll the dice though.
Hope I'm free of any negatives.

AZ Demps or Pfizer? AZ is pretty good, no noticeable side effects. Good luck.

Pfizer man.
We got about 8 or so people doing it at our office from 12...
Hopefully I can go first ??

Mine was AZ which seems to hit ppl a little harder. Any of my mates lucky enough to get Pfizer just said a little arm pain at needle site.

Ive heard anecdotally that the first AZ jab belts you and the second Pfizer gets you. My son was leveled by his first AZ jab.

This seems to be the trend.

My second Pfizer shot absolutely knocked me for six. Aching joints everywhere (even fingers/toes), headache, nausea, tingling hands, and I nearly fainted the following morning.

Like the worst hangover ever for a couple of days.

'Little arm pain at needle site' as suggested upthread was only the case for my first shot. Everyone seems to react slightly differently, my work colleague (who is the same age as me) had no side effects whatsoever from either shot.

 

[earl]

Gladys Berejiklian said it last night.

What did she say ? Every time I listen to her she gets it pretty much right. The last poor comment I heard her state was that NSW can handle anything. No area has been able to handle the Delta strain without high vaccination rates.

I can't remember the exact quote but it was along the lines that we are going to have to accept that there will be deaths, more deaths than we are having now, but we have to accept that and it is the reality we face. Just like we do with the Flu.

This is exactly how it is going to be. Any other option is fantasy based thinking and counter to the health advice.

She isn't stating her advice. She is stating the health advice.

It's not going to be good. People should have realistic expectations. There is no other option.