Justin Pascoe

[weststigers]

Agree, he didn’t do everything wrong, but I think it’s a case of him being a decent corporate administrator in a sports administration role. He didn’t prioritise making the team successful. He said “let’s get the business side right first” which is a very corporate way of thinking. Unfortunately sports clubs are in the business of winning.
Also, the “I’d rather people make mistakes than do nothing” - that’s a little silly given clubs are under scrutiny for mistakes they make.

He’s also been pretty good at saying he’s ultimately accountable, but subtly evading any direct responsibility.

He’s done another interview:

Pascoe v2
I enjoyed the “I’m not going from Hollywood to Penrith” comment. Not sure that was the right thing to say…

Don’t know of many other CEOs that go on a podcast tour after they’ve been let go. Could be a PR play so he’s not unemployable. Also, if you believe the rumours he applied for multiple jobs before he was axed, so he knew it was coming.

I agree with you on one thing. I think he is a strong CFO type and his strengths are more on the financial/economic side of the business.

He made a good point about memberships. We always made less on memberships than other clubs because we had to split our member packages into 4 games, 8 and 12, where most people would only buy the 4 or 8 game packages because of the Campbelltown and Leichhardt divide.

It's an interesting point going into the future. He said the future is probably Campbelltown stadium...do you then lose all those members that bought the Leichhardt packages? Will that impact membership revenue?

He said league fans want a game day experience where they can get there by public transport and enjoy dinner, drinks and entertainment before and after games, so a complex in Campbelltown would be needed to achieve a full time move there.

I'm not sure that would entice me to attend every game at Campbelltown, but the club doesn't cater to me per se.

I'm very interested in how we will deal with such a difficult question going forward.

Rather than being a Balmain/Wests question, I think it's actually a geographic question. We have supporters living all over Sydney. Currently our grounds are either inner west or far west. One supporter will say it's a huge commitment to travel to Campbelltown. Another will say the same about Leichhardt.

I don't know the answer, but it's a debate we should be having for the greater good of the club.

I think it's well documented that it will first go to a 6/6 split. After that, even Richo says the future is West. I'm certainly more in favour of a council that wants us to be part of the community. Leichhardt council has systematically destroyed Balmain and has shown no appetite to invest into Leichhardt Oval. At least they want us in the Western Suburbs!

I'd be interested to hear some constructive thoughts on the issue.

 

[weststigers]

Agree, he didn’t do everything wrong, but I think it’s a case of him being a decent corporate administrator in a sports administration role. He didn’t prioritise making the team successful. He said “let’s get the business side right first” which is a very corporate way of thinking. Unfortunately sports clubs are in the business of winning.
Also, the “I’d rather people make mistakes than do nothing” - that’s a little silly given clubs are under scrutiny for mistakes they make.

He’s also been pretty good at saying he’s ultimately accountable, but subtly evading any direct responsibility.

He’s done another interview:

Pascoe v2
I enjoyed the “I’m not going from Hollywood to Penrith” comment. Not sure that was the right thing to say…

Don’t know of many other CEOs that go on a podcast tour after they’ve been let go. Could be a PR play so he’s not unemployable. Also, if you believe the rumours he applied for multiple jobs before he was axed, so he knew it was coming.

Hahaha the interview was posted 5 days ago and has 16 views! How did that YouTuber with 23 subscribers get an interview with Pascoe?

 

[Tom Shines]

To all the people defending Pascoe …

Let’s not get hung up on whether he deserves the blame for signing Russel Packer or the credit for signing Ice …

I ask this question … did his performance warrant being in the role for nearly nine years ?

For the Wests Tigers CEO , the main measure for success is wins and losses for the team .., the club exists for no other reason ,.. if you believe otherwise .. then the club exists just to make up the numbers in the NRL ..

He should have had his walking papers no later then the 5th year the club missed the 8 under his tenure..

 

[Bigscreentv]

Hahaha the interview was posted 5 days ago and has 16 views! How did that YouTuber with 23 subscribers get an interview with Pascoe?

True, he either knows him or he was taking interviews with anyone.

 

[Bigscreentv]

I agree with you on one thing. I think he is a strong CFO type and his strengths are more on the financial/economic side of the business.

He made a good point about memberships. We always made less on memberships than other clubs because we had to split our member packages into 4 games, 8 and 12, where most people would only buy the 4 or 8 game packages because of the Campbelltown and Leichhardt divide.

It's an interesting point going into the future. He said the future is probably Campbelltown stadium...do you then lose all those members that bought the Leichhardt packages? Will that impact membership revenue?

He said league fans want a game day experience where they can get there by public transport and enjoy dinner, drinks and entertainment before and after games, so a complex in Campbelltown would be needed to achieve a full time move there.

I'm not sure that would entice me to attend every game at Campbelltown, but the club doesn't cater to me per se.

I'm very interested in how we will deal with such a difficult question going forward.

Rather than being a Balmain/Wests question, I think it's actually a geographic question. We have supporters living all over Sydney. Currently our grounds are either inner west or far west. One supporter will say it's a huge commitment to travel to Campbelltown. Another will say the same about Leichhardt.

I don't know the answer, but it's a debate we should be having for the greater good of the club.

I think it's well documented that it will first go to a 6/6 split. After that, even Richo says the future is West. I'm certainly more in favour of a council that wants us to be part of the community. Leichhardt council has systematically destroyed Balmain and has shown no appetite to invest into Leichhardt Oval. At least they want us in the Western Suburbs!

I'd be interested to hear some constructive thoughts on the issue.

Yeah, I'm a Balmain fan from way back, but I think it's probably the best move to go to Campbelltown and build a base there. In doing that you'd probably lose a bunch of game attendees, but long-term it's probably what's going to ensure longer-term success.

 

[weststigers]

To all the people defending Pascoe …

Let’s not get hung up on whether he deserves the blame for signing Russel Packer or the credit for signing Ice …

I ask this question … did his performance warrant being in the role for nearly nine years ?

For the Wests Tigers CEO , the main measure for success is wins and losses for the team .., the club exists for no other reason ,.. if you believe otherwise .. then the club exists just to make up the numbers in the NRL ..

He should have had his walking papers no later then the 5th year the club missed the 8 under his tenure..

I don't think anyone is defending the decision to move on from Pascoe. I'd say we are all united in that on the forum.

The board was a bigger problem than Pascoe in my opinion. Totally incompetent.

If you've ever had the responsibility as a CEO or COO, you'd know that things aren't always as they seem on the surface. You need absolute autonomy and authority. Sounds like we had a committee for every decision which simply doesn't allow you to make decisions effectively. Everyone wanted their hands on the decision making, but ran a mile when it was time to be accountable. I think that structure played a huge role in the mess over the last few years.

Thankfully, the power now sits with our CEO as a result of the review and that will change things immensely.

A quick example. Pascoe mentioned about leaks to the media. Supposedly, there was a 6 man committee on recruitment! Then it would need to go to the board! He said that causes loads of issues, least of which is the more people that know, the more chance it gets leaked.

This directly impacts recruitment. I take him at his word on that, because now we don't see any leaks at all. The only thing that's changed is the board and where the decision making power sits.

He gave some really good insight into the club and you can see that there was a lot wrong with the place. Definitely it was time to move on for him. At the very least, it wouldn't have been good optics for him to survive while everyone else got the chop. I think even he knew that would have created a media storm in itself.

The board diluted everyones power including the coach. If we had to pick 1 thing that killed the club, I'd pick the board over Pascoe every time.

 

[weststigers]

Yeah, I'm a Balmain fan from way back, but I think it's probably the best move to go to Campbelltown and build a base there. In doing that you'd probably lose a bunch of game attendees, but long-term it's probably what's going to ensure longer-term success.

Time will tell. I do think Leichhardt numbers get pumped up a bit by away fans because it's just more central. However, away fans equal ticket sales too. Pascoe mentioned Leichhardt only caters to around 400 corporate package opportunities each game. In comparison, SFS caters to 3,000. That's a lot of money we are leaving on the table at home games.

Both grounds need major upgrades in any case. Leichhardt more so than Campbelltown.

It won't matter for you anyway mate. You have that big screen tv 😉

 

[BAGNF05]

Look mate, I'm no supporter of Pascoe. I'm just in favour of a balanced view. There was a lot he didn't get right, but I also thought he got panned unfairly at times too. I also believe that someone cannot be 100% bad. He did some good things for the club too.

You've layed the blame of the Josh Reynolds signing at his feet. Do you also give him credit for Api? At least be fair is my point.

You can look at individual signings all you like. Regardless, we tumbled down the ladder each year under Pascoe. In his own words, we were always the bridesmaids in major contract negotiations. His whole tenure was poor due to his recruitment and retention record.

 

[weststigers]

You can look at individual signings all you like. Regardless, we tumbled down the ladder each year under Pascoe. In his own words, we were always the bridesmaids in major contract negotiations. His whole tenure was poor due to his recruitment record.

I'm not looking at individual signings. I'm simply responding to someone that did with the alternative view. Essentially saying that it's not relevant.

The structure in which we recruited was the major reason. We can argue about how that structure came about under his tenure, but a 6 man committee that then needs board approval kills any chance you have of reaching consensus, being able to react quickly and stopping leaks. I hope we could agree on that at least? I don't think anyone could work under those conditions.

There's been plenty of comments from players and managers that we are the slowest, most difficult club to deal with when it came to recruitment. Surely that had something to do with it?

Don't conflate my focus on this issue as trying to absolve Pascoe of responsibility. My only contention is that people can't blame one man for the failures of this club. I don't think it's a fair assessment and I don't think it's accurate.

 

[Tom Shines]

I don't think anyone is defending the decision to move on from Pascoe. I'd say we are all united in that on the forum.

The board was a bigger problem than Pascoe in my opinion. Totally incompetent.

If you've ever had the responsibility as a CEO or COO, you'd know that things aren't always as they seem on the surface. You need absolute autonomy and authority. Sounds like we had a committee for every decision which simply doesn't allow you to make decisions effectively. Everyone wanted their hands on the decision making, but ran a mile when it was time to be accountable. I think that structure played a huge role in the mess over the last few years.

Thankfully, the power now sits with our CEO as a result of the review and that will change things immensely.

A quick example. Pascoe mentioned about leaks to the media. Supposedly, there was a 6 man committee on recruitment! Then it would need to go to the board! He said that causes loads of issues, least of which is the more people that know, the more chance it gets leaked.

This directly impacts recruitment. I take him at his word on that, because now we don't see any leaks at all. The only thing that's changed is the board and where the decision making power sits.

He gave some really good insight into the club and you can see that there was a lot wrong with the place. Definitely it was time to move on for him. At the very least, it wouldn't have been good optics for him to survive while everyone else got the chop. I think even he knew that would have created a media storm in itself.

The board diluted everyone’s power including the coach. If we had to pick 1 thing that killed the club, I'd pick the board over Pascoe every time.

No.. I haven’t had a CEO responsibility …out of interest , have you ? I would suggest that having this role in an elite/ highly professional sporting organisation ( at least supposedly) would be something different again…

I have my suspicions as to where the leaks came from ..and it involves the people wining and dining Rothfield and his mates at Grappas every quarter … when that fifth bottle of red gets brought out, I imagine tongues are pretty loose by then …but even outside those times, they all would have had a comfortable level of familiarity …

Im assuming Pascoe knew the parameters of the job including the decision making challenges of various parts of the business before accepting the role,,,and he must have thought after being in the role that this didnt impede him too much in completing his duties, given he elected to continue in the job for nine years …Any CEO worth a damn wouldnt have continued doing the job otherwise…

He also mentions several times in the interview ( and elsewhere over the years) that he took ”full responsibility for what happens on and off the field”… so you can’t really say that and hide behind a board as well IMO..

I’m sure all club NRL CEO’s have this issue of a board ( Dogs,Parra come immeadiately to mind) or an owner ( Souths, Manly) interfering to some extent in decision making …perhaps it might have been worse at the Tigers … but we don’t really know for sure in comparison…

Anyway … like I said, the decision to move on should have happened after Year 5 at the latest ( coaches never get given that long) …. Maybe we would have not had the debacles of the last three years … alternatively… maybe we had to reach rock bottom to get real change ..hopefully in another three or four years with Premiership 2 secured we are looking back at the events of the past few months as the start of that journey..

 

[weststigers]

No.. I haven’t had a CEO responsibility …out of interest , have you ? I would suggest that having this role in an elite/ highly professional sporting organisation ( at least supposedly) would be something different again…

I have my suspicions as to where the leaks came from ..and it involves the people wining and dining Rothfield and his mates at Grappas every quarter … when that fifth bottle of red gets brought out, I imagine tongues are pretty loose by then …but even outside those times, they all would have had a comfortable level of familiarity …

Im assuming Pascoe knew the parameters of the job including the decision making challenges of various parts of the business before accepting the role,,,and he must have thought after being in the role that this didnt impede him too much in completing his duties, given he elected to continue in the job for nine years …Any CEO worth a damn wouldnt have continued doing the job otherwise…

He also mentions several times in the interview ( and elsewhere over the years) that he took ”full responsibility for what happens on and off the field”… so you can’t really say that and hide behind a board as well IMO..

I’m sure all club NRL CEO’s have this issue of a board ( Dogs,Parra come immeadiately to mind) or an owner ( Souths, Manly) interfering to some extent in decision making …perhaps it might have been worse at the Tigers … but we don’t really know for sure in comparison…

Anyway … like I said, the decision to move on should have happened after Year 5 at the latest ( coaches never get given that long) …. Maybe we would have not had the debacles of the last three years … alternatively… maybe we had to reach rock bottom to get real change ..hopefully in another three or four years with Premiership 2 secured we are looking back at the events of the past few months as the start of that journey..

Yes I have been a CEO, which is why I make the points I do.

Most people only look at things in low resolution, yet you could write a book on why the Tigers have failed under Pascoes tenure. It's human nature to distill a complex issue down to one or two things. The issue with a football club, compared with a corporate is you have to run a business, but also get results on the field. Most CEO's only have to focus on running a business. I think he did that part well. I'm sure most people at the club weren't interested in our accounting and internal systems, so I'd say he got a fairly clean run in that department.

The football side is what the fans care about and that is where the criticism is being directed understandably. My contention is, I think too many people were involved on the football side of things and ended up doing huge damage. You can't run an organisation like a democracy. It needs to be a dictatorship for things to work. Diluting your CEO's power by getting involved in operational decisions, the most notorious one being the Fulton decision, is a recipe for disaster. Pascoe should never have accepted those terms as a CEO, but for reasons only known to him, he carried on. I would say that's why Richo said he would see how things go for 6 months - he doesn't want a situation where he is responsible for decisions that he can't make.

If you think 1 guy, that answers to a board, can bring down a whole organisation on his own, then I guess that's where we probably differ on the topic.

What I do know, is that the new authority structure in place is far more conducive to success than what Pascoe was afforded and I think it will be good for the club going forward. Richo was a great appointment and I'm happy we cleared the slate the way we did. A fresh start across the club was definitely needed.

 

[Bigscreentv]

that's why Richo said he would see how things go for 6 months - he doesn't want a situation where he is responsible for decisions that he can't make.

Definitely, I even recall some potential players saying in the media that the communication with the club was really slow and that's part of the reason they didn't sign, but how long did he feel like this and why did it take until last year for him to write a recommendation to the board? I could be wrong, but it all just sounds too convenient and too late.

He's definitely been thrown under the blowtorch while at the Tigers, but I think a stronger sports administrator wouldn't have made the errors he made...and yes, some were errors of optics, but that's really important in a club that's doing poorly.

 

[innsaneink]

Did you guys really sit through 2hrs of the interview?

nope...not even 10 mins..hes hsitory now

 

[Red88_Tiger]

I’d also hazard a guess that after Cleary pulled out that a the board pulled back in decision making because of the situation he left us in
Regardless of the past though let’s look forward

 

[GCfan]

I did. Got boring after the original Ridge left. Had a much more surly bed side manner than the current one who presents himself like a bit of a boy scout. Not for me.

That’s a bit too detailed a response GNR 🤣

 

[BAGNF05]

I'm not looking at individual signings. I'm simply responding to someone that did with the alternative view. Essentially saying that it's not relevant.

The structure in which we recruited was the major reason. We can argue about how that structure came about under his tenure, but a 6 man committee that then needs board approval kills any chance you have of reaching consensus, being able to react quickly and stopping leaks. I hope we could agree on that at least? I don't think anyone could work under those conditions.

There's been plenty of comments from players and managers that we are the slowest, most difficult club to deal with when it came to recruitment. Surely that had something to do with it?

Don't conflate my focus on this issue as trying to absolve Pascoe of responsibility. My only contention is that people can't blame one man for the failures of this club. I don't think it's a fair assessment and I don't think it's accurate.

Can’t blame one man but the CEO needs to accept most responsibility.

 

[tiger_one]

JP talking everything through his rear vision glasses.
It's like my losing Lotto tickets.
Had hope for a while, but fizzed.
I'm looking forward.

 

[lathami]

To all the people defending Pascoe …

Let’s not get hung up on whether he deserves the blame for signing Russel Packer or the credit for signing Ice …

I ask this question … did his performance warrant being in the role for nearly nine years ?

For the Wests Tigers CEO , the main measure for success is wins and losses for the team .., the club exists for no other reason ,.. if you believe otherwise .. then the club exists just to make up the numbers in the NRL ..

He should have had his walking papers no later then the 5th year the club missed the 8 under his tenure..

Building blocks champ.
If he wasn’t here we would still be training under an old grandstand with primitive equipment! We would be in dept to our eyeballs with a possibility of being kicked out of the comp. We were a basket case almost the entire time of the joint venture and mostly year before that. It’s hard to turn around the titanic.
Was he perfect, shit no.
But credit where credits due!
You know the dogs with all their money and influence still won a couple of wooden spoon and in my opinion were worst than us during the same time.
But keep your head in the sand.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

I can understand why he thinks he probably did a good job with the opening of the COE occurring on his watch. And the human ego being what it is, of course he’s going to defend himself. I find the fact that him telling the Nadan story a bit bizarre. That’s the kind of story you would hear from the recipient of the prank or someone else. Not the guy who delivered it.

 

[Leck]

After watching the Brad Banducci fiasco, Justin comes across as a genius.