tony soprano
Well-known member
Think Barrett doesn't have the intelligence for a first grade coach.
Michael Maguire leaves club
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Think Barrett doesn't have the intelligence for a first grade coach.
tony soprano
Well-known member
Think changes made in off season and sheens have helped madge.
It's about the organisation as a whole like like what I read how Buzz said sheens has introduced all black culture with everyone wearing suits at games now.
Also noticed how assist coach Gardiner was the green shirt at the parra game. Have the feeling they are looking at everything more close now as they finally understand its the little things that count.
Let's face it too we have lucked out with Hastings which no matter what he or the club keep saying he is a big reason for the clubs turn around.
We still have a long way to go but pray for continued improvement across the organisation as a whole.
It's about the organisation as a whole like like what I read how Buzz said sheens has introduced all black culture with everyone wearing suits at games now.
Also noticed how assist coach Gardiner was the green shirt at the parra game. Have the feeling they are looking at everything more close now as they finally understand its the little things that count.
Let's face it too we have lucked out with Hastings which no matter what he or the club keep saying he is a big reason for the clubs turn around.
We still have a long way to go but pray for continued improvement across the organisation as a whole.
finnzo
Well-known member
I’m not sure if I would call it luck Madge identified that we needed Hastings here on the Matty Johns show he said a number of nrl clubs were chasing him but he chose tigers because of Madge props to Madge for getting it done
Heat off Maguire for the moment, but teams in the bottom half of competition are renowned for swings in form hence why they are placed where they are. There will be plenty of twists and turns yet for the coaches and it seems all the disgruntled fans are calling for Flannagan as the answer.
Flannagan would never be welcome here as far as i am concerned.
Great post.
finnzo
Well-known member
Any other info to report?
Yes - I think the collective changes have been very good. I like the idea of Sheens setting standards for things off the field, such as the suits thing. I like what Nathan Cayless has brought as defensive coach. There is resilience and desperation in the online defence. I think Garner has been excellent in this area over the last two weeks. I would keep him as centre with Starford the other centre. Madge - you have also listened to advice (according to earlier post) and the team is working together. Well done to everyone. Long way to go, but it seems the right ingredients for success are finally being found. It's been a long, hard road for all, but the last two weeks have been magnificent and given me real hope.
tiger05premier
Well-known member
No we don't have the best roster and our results over a long time have been very poor but with so many roster changes over the years I think we have really struggled with cohesian and confidence as a team and no matter how hard we try we struggle and fail to compete
That has a lead to the team I feel definitely giving up at times and having us believe Madge has lost the dressing room when maybe he hasn't
Maybe Madge was always right and the boys just needed to believe in themselves and keep hanging in and things will turn around
I'm really going these last 2 weeks are the launching pad for a big move forward the club as a whole and the boys have finally realised that they can do it and we can move forward with a stable coaching staff and strong commitment from our players
I for one an so happy to see a very happy and excited madge with the players playing with the passion and commitment he has wanted them to play with
Keep it up boys
Keep believing and keep playing hard for the coach who has put so much into turning this club around and we will be a force well into the future
Go tigers
That has a lead to the team I feel definitely giving up at times and having us believe Madge has lost the dressing room when maybe he hasn't
Maybe Madge was always right and the boys just needed to believe in themselves and keep hanging in and things will turn around
I'm really going these last 2 weeks are the launching pad for a big move forward the club as a whole and the boys have finally realised that they can do it and we can move forward with a stable coaching staff and strong commitment from our players
I for one an so happy to see a very happy and excited madge with the players playing with the passion and commitment he has wanted them to play with
Keep it up boys
Keep believing and keep playing hard for the coach who has put so much into turning this club around and we will be a force well into the future
Go tigers
rihannafan1
Well-known member
Thanks
Mighty_Tiger
Well-known member
The key to our success in the last 2 rounds has been our fitness and attacking intent.
Mentioned a few weeks back we need to show more intent with the ball and finally we are seeing it but what has been impressive is our fitness in being able to still play with the same defensive mindset.
The fitness levels are signs of very good training and preseason. Our defensive efforts and defensive structures from the games before our 2 wins has remained solid with same effort. We are lasting 80mins which over the last few seasons has always been a problem. We are letting in 10 less points a game so far on last season which is a massive change.
Many are saying teams are making errors against us, which for 1 game sure but all season has been the case. Our defensive tactics are causing teams problems. Because we hold a line it forces teams to either rush decisions on half chances or try and create something out of nothing. Panthers/Storm do this brilliantly and it's clear we are frustrating teams as well.
Our attacking formations, structures & intent are vastly different in the last 2 games and will break these down below as we have changed alot on this:
1) Our approach to driving teams defensive structures infield to then create space for Brooks/Laurie and the backs
- It starts with our hooker intent in the last 2 weeks our Hookers have run more out of dummy half than we did all season. Despite what some say it's nothing to do with forwards enabling this as our forward pack mtrs per hitup and speed of play the ball has actually been less and slower during the 2 games. When our Hookers run we do get the ball to the edge the same set of six 80% of the time. It's a clear move switch.
2) Instructing and setting up sequence in the middle 40 is key, Hastings is doing this big time and has stepped up. He is directing the play between the 20mtr zones to just keep it simple and move out of the danger zone.
3) Brooks is playing less structure and more impulsive, he is roving and fast. Several times he sprints from 1 side to the other to be ready for next play. He has played the blindside last 2 games 7 times, more than previous 10 games. Not having to organise has made a massive difference but also playing what he sees has driven alot more of a change.
4) Support play and clean offloads. Our support play around the forwards has improved and the license to allow 2nd phase play has as well. We have always had offloads in our side from wingers through to the props issue has always been when we do them and if we had someone to give the offload to.
5) We are using our backrowers as decoys when we shift. During the 1st few games we always went to Lucy and Kelma but the last 2 games the backrowers involvement has been alot less in the sense of getting the ball in hand but has been more effective being used as a decoy to enable space for Laurie & Brooks to use Nofa/Ken/Toa.
6) attacking kicking game, we have been more attacking focused. bombs to Ken & grubbers into ingoal are paying rewards. Yes we have missed some chances but the main thing is opportunities are occurring which over the course of the season will pay off if we persist. We are getting repeat sets which the more you ask of the opposition the more fatigue sets in
7) This is the biggest change!!!!! Use of the props and who we target running towards. Last 2 games our focus has been very heavily on work rates of the Hookers. Hastings is directing the running and they are all angling in at the Hookers. Tamou and Twal are doing this brilliantly. Eels Mahoney had to come off - he made 48 tackles in 56mins & Cook was totally ineffective due to making 63 tackles. We are working over the middle to force large defensive efforts. This might appear a minor change but it's been a very large change. Prior to this the Hookers were making 29 tackles a game. The impacts of this is we compress defensive lines to enable space out wide.
We need to continue and evolve the above but areas we need to improve on are as follows
- 20mtr zone. We are a very ineffective team in this zone and this is due to over shifting the ball right then go left then go middle then go right again - this is on repeat. Rather than continue to compress defensive lines to then go wide. I do think we need to look at bash and barge plays with Lucy and Kelma instead of trying to go around teams in this zone. I would even look at Garner off Brooks hip in this zone as he is a hole runner.
- Want to see our kicking play from the 40mtr-halfway zone go along the ground rather than bomb it up. I know its about setting defensive lines but if we find the ground we turn the backs around and force them to run sideways over straight giving us an edge on field positioning.
- Want to see more of whoever plays fullback to support the middle forwards and our halves support the backrowers. Lucy needs runners off him and more often than not has no one around him.
- Nofa is starting to get back into some form, keep running more direct than cross field as you are starting to get some mtrs going, offloads flowing & converting chances into points. Nofa is a very different winger to Ken and is a large key on setting the platform on kick returns. We need his involvement to continue to increase for our success to keep going.
The changes above aren't just because of Hastings, we have had some clear clear changes in direction and play outside of Hastings which means coaching directives have changed also.
I don't know if Madge made these changes overnight or if Sheens played a part or the players just spoke up but 1 thing for sure is they have been training well and it's clear some of the players do actually give a rats because what we have seen over the last 2 weeks isn't a team who wants Madge gone.
Mentioned a few weeks back we need to show more intent with the ball and finally we are seeing it but what has been impressive is our fitness in being able to still play with the same defensive mindset.
The fitness levels are signs of very good training and preseason. Our defensive efforts and defensive structures from the games before our 2 wins has remained solid with same effort. We are lasting 80mins which over the last few seasons has always been a problem. We are letting in 10 less points a game so far on last season which is a massive change.
Many are saying teams are making errors against us, which for 1 game sure but all season has been the case. Our defensive tactics are causing teams problems. Because we hold a line it forces teams to either rush decisions on half chances or try and create something out of nothing. Panthers/Storm do this brilliantly and it's clear we are frustrating teams as well.
Our attacking formations, structures & intent are vastly different in the last 2 games and will break these down below as we have changed alot on this:
1) Our approach to driving teams defensive structures infield to then create space for Brooks/Laurie and the backs
- It starts with our hooker intent in the last 2 weeks our Hookers have run more out of dummy half than we did all season. Despite what some say it's nothing to do with forwards enabling this as our forward pack mtrs per hitup and speed of play the ball has actually been less and slower during the 2 games. When our Hookers run we do get the ball to the edge the same set of six 80% of the time. It's a clear move switch.
2) Instructing and setting up sequence in the middle 40 is key, Hastings is doing this big time and has stepped up. He is directing the play between the 20mtr zones to just keep it simple and move out of the danger zone.
3) Brooks is playing less structure and more impulsive, he is roving and fast. Several times he sprints from 1 side to the other to be ready for next play. He has played the blindside last 2 games 7 times, more than previous 10 games. Not having to organise has made a massive difference but also playing what he sees has driven alot more of a change.
4) Support play and clean offloads. Our support play around the forwards has improved and the license to allow 2nd phase play has as well. We have always had offloads in our side from wingers through to the props issue has always been when we do them and if we had someone to give the offload to.
5) We are using our backrowers as decoys when we shift. During the 1st few games we always went to Lucy and Kelma but the last 2 games the backrowers involvement has been alot less in the sense of getting the ball in hand but has been more effective being used as a decoy to enable space for Laurie & Brooks to use Nofa/Ken/Toa.
6) attacking kicking game, we have been more attacking focused. bombs to Ken & grubbers into ingoal are paying rewards. Yes we have missed some chances but the main thing is opportunities are occurring which over the course of the season will pay off if we persist. We are getting repeat sets which the more you ask of the opposition the more fatigue sets in
7) This is the biggest change!!!!! Use of the props and who we target running towards. Last 2 games our focus has been very heavily on work rates of the Hookers. Hastings is directing the running and they are all angling in at the Hookers. Tamou and Twal are doing this brilliantly. Eels Mahoney had to come off - he made 48 tackles in 56mins & Cook was totally ineffective due to making 63 tackles. We are working over the middle to force large defensive efforts. This might appear a minor change but it's been a very large change. Prior to this the Hookers were making 29 tackles a game. The impacts of this is we compress defensive lines to enable space out wide.
We need to continue and evolve the above but areas we need to improve on are as follows
- 20mtr zone. We are a very ineffective team in this zone and this is due to over shifting the ball right then go left then go middle then go right again - this is on repeat. Rather than continue to compress defensive lines to then go wide. I do think we need to look at bash and barge plays with Lucy and Kelma instead of trying to go around teams in this zone. I would even look at Garner off Brooks hip in this zone as he is a hole runner.
- Want to see our kicking play from the 40mtr-halfway zone go along the ground rather than bomb it up. I know its about setting defensive lines but if we find the ground we turn the backs around and force them to run sideways over straight giving us an edge on field positioning.
- Want to see more of whoever plays fullback to support the middle forwards and our halves support the backrowers. Lucy needs runners off him and more often than not has no one around him.
- Nofa is starting to get back into some form, keep running more direct than cross field as you are starting to get some mtrs going, offloads flowing & converting chances into points. Nofa is a very different winger to Ken and is a large key on setting the platform on kick returns. We need his involvement to continue to increase for our success to keep going.
The changes above aren't just because of Hastings, we have had some clear clear changes in direction and play outside of Hastings which means coaching directives have changed also.
I don't know if Madge made these changes overnight or if Sheens played a part or the players just spoke up but 1 thing for sure is they have been training well and it's clear some of the players do actually give a rats because what we have seen over the last 2 weeks isn't a team who wants Madge gone.
Tucker
Well-known member
Great review and assessment of our evolution these past 2 weeks. I have argued similarly that Hastings has made a big difference but so much else has changed that other input is being heard/implemented.
And it was so good to see him do it with a smile on his face
Tucker
Well-known member
Did that happen?
I love that!
BAGNF05
Well-known member
Yep, I watched closely after the try as I know Hastings is a competitive bugger. He gave Noff a bit of a serve then when Noff didn’t agree Hastings pointed up at the big screen.
Very appreciative of your concise post MT...I will say that a lot of forum members kept abusing Madge for the one out and bomb on the last...if you look at it from the outside looking in, it is a plan many teams use,the only difference is they have the speed and quality outside of them to give the ball air at any given time...
If you notice we still play one out and then bomb,but this year have you noticed since Hastings is in control the players stand so much deeper than the last few games before Jacko got back and try and spread the ball ?? this is where you run hard on the ball and catch the defense wondering what the next move is...
Its easy to predict that its 5 hit ups and a bomb,its much harder when you run on the ball get an offload away and pin them in their own red zone...
Not questioning any thing of peoples opinion,but its rugby league and I played it at a reasonable level,we were always coached to stand deep and run on the ball at pace...
The game has changed but the basics are still the same although coaches try and manipulate the new rules etc to suit them,if your a hardened RL player or coach you get the simple basics right then you can adjust to the level of player you have and need....sorry about the long chat...its just my opinion and I totally respect others....
Mighty_Tiger
Well-known member
I get what your saying & agree it's used across the NRL. My issue with our use is that's all Brooks is allowed to do these days and we lack variety. Storm/Panthers etc all use it and often but mainly when they are from halfway onwards, majority of time it's not used coming out of their half. For us we are using it often in our own half more so than in their half. Slight difference but does make a difference. If teams know we will kick high all the time it removes things like 40/20, kick long etc and makes it easier for fullbacks and wingers to manage things.
Magpie_Magic
Well-known member
They are certainly alot deeper in attack which is a good start but for mine still relying on to many long passes and not enough bodies in motion.
One thing for sure I reckon we still have much ammo in our attack and we are scoring 4 tries against good opposition.
It almost seems Madge is going for an incremental approach to building our attacking complexities maybe because he feels that up to now mentally if an increase in errors came due to attacking complexities certain guys would fall to pieces before the team has a strong enough culture and belief in themselves.
I didn't think of this previously but it looks as though he being close to the group saw firstly culture then morale the problem.
Think of,
Offloads,
Inside ball,
Multiple decoys,
Kicking imagination,
Crisscross moves featuring Laurie and the like midfield,
Garner and Luc getting better ball not to mention Roberts.
Attacking from our own half.
These 2 unlikely wins opens the door to Madge and Sheens to be more adventurous because they have built something now which they believe in.
Not getting ahead of myself but throwing this in as a guide to at least the way Sheens may be thinking.
In 05 early on with a rather small side we couldn't get out of our own 40 during early games.
Then one game against Canterbury over Easter we won 37 to 36 spreading the ball from deep in our own half and got a win and built on it. Been watching Madge the last few years trying for a big scalp yearly maybe to build with something but never nailed it.
Well he has 2 now and it will be interesting if he levels up the attack.
Gotta feeling they have a feeling.
Tiger Woods
Well-known member
Is it me or does Madge look 10 years younger when we’re winning & 10 years older when we’re losing 😆
I’m not our coach and I experience the same phenomenon.
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