Pascoe sanctioned by the NRL

[supercoach]

The bottom line is,the NRL doesn’t care if there was intent to cheat or a innocent oversight, they both get put in the same basket. They want to send a strong message that any salary cap infringement for any reason will result in a big punishment.

I am okay with it if they treat all clubs the same but it is obvious to everyone they dont

 

[Guest]

How sure are you of this statement? Do you have a Law degree?

I don't need a law degree, there is a difference between cheating and doing something illegal. If the Tigers gave Farah a contract with the intention of him signing it at a later date, that is cheating.

How important is proving intention in this instance? In certain criminal proceedings (certain serious offences) intention needs to be proved - is that the case in this type of matter because if so, I would suggest the NRL will have a hard time proving that.

I don't think the NRL would need to prove intention at all, I think if you breach the rules they will consider you guilty.

The NRL may, and that may be the basis behind the current penalty but if the Tigers take this to court, then that may potentially be part of their defence.

 

[diedpretty]

For the exact reason you all state, so they can deny the existence of the role.

So how does Robbie guarantee that he gets his money if he doesn't sign the contract. You reckon Pascoe is a cheat so whats stopping him or WT from withdrawing the contract before Farah signs leaving him with nothing.

How do these players who apparently receive brown paper bag payments guarantee they will be paid?

Paid upfront??

Exactly - cochise is just making it up as he goes - anything to promote his agenda. He is yet to answer why Farah would risk losing what he is owed by not signing the contract. His first answer makes Robbie implicit in the whole cover up and this latest is a red herring that has nothing to do with signing contracts.

 

[cochise]

So how does Robbie guarantee that he gets his money if he doesn't sign the contract. You reckon Pascoe is a cheat so whats stopping him or WT from withdrawing the contract before Farah signs leaving him with nothing.

How do these players who apparently receive brown paper bag payments guarantee they will be paid?

Paid upfront??

Exactly - cochise is just making it up as he goes - anything to promote his agenda. He is yet to answer why Farah would risk losing what he is owed by not signing the contract. His first answer makes Robbie implicit in the whole cover up and this latest is a red herring that has nothing to do with signing contracts.

I have no agenda, I believe his thinking would be along the same lines as players who apparently accept part of their payment that is outside their contract in cash in paper bags.

 

[Fade_To_Black]

Seize documents, computer hard drives, mobile phones etc just ss they have done when investigating other dodgy dealings by clubs. That would be a start.

They did a forensic audit?

So if, as you say, Andrew Gee took 300k from the leagues club WITHOUT APPROVAL, isn't that theft? For that large amount he should of been doing jail time.

That's exactly what the leagues club published in its annual report, they notified ASIC who decided to not investigate as the money had been repaid. If you actually read the article I posted it is all in that. The annual report states that it was used without permission or knowledge, correct procedures werent followed and no documentation was completed.

The NRL conducted a forensic audit, which they do in all these cases. That is how Flanagan's emails were found. They interviewed players and check players manager records and no evidence of extra payments were found.

What else do you expect them to have done?

Not everything is a conspiracy against us.

Not saying everything is a conspiracy against WT. If we are guilty then more than happy to accept the punishment.
But what is really galling is the massive double standards within the NRL, A case in point being the Mitchell Pearce Australia Day incident: public opinion was very much favouring the notion that young Mitch was on more than just alcohol, illicit drugs were very likely in his system. I have been pm'd by someone on this forum who stated that they have seen firsthand Mitchell Pearce taking cocaine.
Despite this the NRL were quite happy to let the Roosters secretly ship him overseas without bothering to have him drug tested. Why did the NRL let this happen? Did the Roosters inform the NRL before MP scurried overseas that he was going there? Clubs are supposed to be obligated by the NRL to inform the NRL of players' whereabouts in order for players to be easily located for random drug tests. IIRC there was a club warned/fined 2 or so years ago for not informing the NRL of a certain players' whereabouts when he was being sought by drug testers. Yet nothing was publically mentioned by the NRL that the Roosters had breached their obligations in the Mitchell Pearce case.
The NRL act tough and severe when it suits, ignoring other matters when it is desirable for them to do so.

When Craig Field and Kevin McGuiness were banished from the NRL for illicit drug use, was that an NRL-enforced ban?

 

[newtiger]

Seize documents, computer hard drives, mobile phones etc just ss they have done when investigating other dodgy dealings by clubs. That would be a start.

They did a forensic audit?

So if, as you say, Andrew Gee took 300k from the leagues club WITHOUT APPROVAL, isn't that theft? For that large amount he should of been doing jail time.

That's exactly what the leagues club published in its annual report, they notified ASIC who decided to not investigate as the money had been repaid. If you actually read the article I posted it is all in that. The annual report states that it was used without permission or knowledge, correct procedures werent followed and no documentation was completed.

The NRL conducted a forensic audit, which they do in all these cases. That is how Flanagan's emails were found. They interviewed players and check players manager records and no evidence of extra payments were found.

What else do you expect them to have done?

Not everything is a conspiracy against us.

You need to do some research in Ken Talbot's dealing into under handed cash payments to the Broncos players.

 

[happy_tiger]

Lauren a TPA doesn't come from the club , the player manager and player present it to the club as part of a package …...

The club may not owe Robbie a thing , the TPA he lost when he left however may ....... the TPA may have not applied when he left the WT's

Thanks happy. I know little about TPAs…except that the Roosters have invisible ones.

I can’t find it now, but I did see another post prior to TigerTiger’s which was basically the same
That the fact that RF lost out on third party payments and the club offering him a role was in lieu of that. This can be used by the NRL as grounds for deception and attempting to rort the cap. Or something like that.
This actually concerns me more.

However, if it’s as straightforward as the facts presented in the media. That the issue really is JP’s failure to declare RF’s post-career job. I honestly still don’t see why it’s such a big issue. This seems more like a misdemeanour.
I don’t need the NRL to tell me whether Pascoe is guilty. We already know of his mistake, of how he failed to comply with a certain rule.
If this is the ONLY issue I am more concerned about the penalties. Breaches in the workplace are often categorised to reflect the level of seriousness, and I hope it’s something the NRL will use.

The other ridiculous thing Lauren is this

TPA's quite regularly fall through , and the club has no onus to honour it at all

**Braith Anasta's TPA he had with us fell through and he had a dummy spit about it you may remember**

What was that? The year's supply of Gatorade? :laughing:

He had two , Tontine Pillows and Kleenex Tissues , why they dumped him I'll never know , he was the perfect spokesperson for both

 

[JD Tiger]

Whether or not this contract for a post-NRL job is signed or not, is not the issue.

The accusations are that this role was to compensate Robbie for TPAs that he did not receive. If so, they argue that is cheating. If not, it is just NRL whingeing about not being informed officially (even though they already knew about it),

To me, NRL must believe they can prove that the job was offered to compensate for those cancelled TPAs, otherwise they wouldn't have proceeded. And that is the evidence I am looking forward to seeing. Anything less, and I think it proves their own bias.

It is not about the NRL whinging about being told. They have rules that they must be informed to prevent clubs rorting the cap by offering players a post career job.

NRL came out calling us salary cap cheats, Not that a mistake was made, but that we were deliberate salary cap cheats, If they don't have the evidence to prove our intent to cheat, then that is clear evidence of their bias.

 

[cochise]

Whether or not this contract for a post-NRL job is signed or not, is not the issue.

The accusations are that this role was to compensate Robbie for TPAs that he did not receive. If so, they argue that is cheating. If not, it is just NRL whingeing about not being informed officially (even though they already knew about it),

To me, NRL must believe they can prove that the job was offered to compensate for those cancelled TPAs, otherwise they wouldn't have proceeded. And that is the evidence I am looking forward to seeing. Anything less, and I think it proves their own bias.

It is not about the NRL whinging about being told. They have rules that they must be informed to prevent clubs rorting the cap by offering players a post career job.

NRL came out calling us salary cap cheats, Not that a mistake was made, but that we were deliberate salary cap cheats, If they don't have the evidence to prove our intent to cheat, then that is clear evidence of their bias.

Yes, one of the reasons I believe it was more than a mistake.

 

[cochise]

They did a forensic audit?

So if, as you say, Andrew Gee took 300k from the leagues club WITHOUT APPROVAL, isn't that theft? For that large amount he should of been doing jail time.

That's exactly what the leagues club published in its annual report, they notified ASIC who decided to not investigate as the money had been repaid. If you actually read the article I posted it is all in that. The annual report states that it was used without permission or knowledge, correct procedures werent followed and no documentation was completed.

The NRL conducted a forensic audit, which they do in all these cases. That is how Flanagan's emails were found. They interviewed players and check players manager records and no evidence of extra payments were found.

What else do you expect them to have done?

Not everything is a conspiracy against us.

Not saying everything is a conspiracy against WT. If we are guilty then more than happy to accept the punishment.
But what is really galling is the massive double standards within the NRL, A case in point being the Mitchell Pearce Australia Day incident: public opinion was very much favouring the notion that young Mitch was on more than just alcohol, illicit drugs were very likely in his system. I have been pm'd by someone on this forum who stated that they have seen firsthand Mitchell Pearce taking cocaine.
Despite this the NRL were quite happy to let the Roosters secretly ship him overseas without bothering to have him drug tested. Why did the NRL let this happen? Did the Roosters inform the NRL before MP scurried overseas that he was going there? Clubs are supposed to be obligated by the NRL to inform the NRL of players' whereabouts in order for players to be easily located for random drug tests. IIRC there was a club warned/fined 2 or so years ago for not informing the NRL of a certain players' whereabouts when he was being sought by drug testers. Yet nothing was publically mentioned by the NRL that the Roosters had breached their obligations in the Mitchell Pearce case.
The NRL act tough and severe when it suits, ignoring other matters when it is desirable for them to do so.

When Craig Field and Kevin McGuiness were banished from the NRL for illicit drug use, was that an NRL-enforced ban?

How do you know he wasn't tested? The NRL doesn't conduct drug testing by the way, that is do by ASADA.

 

[Spud_Murphy]

The bottom line is,the NRL doesn’t care if there was intent to cheat or a innocent oversight, they both get put in the same basket. They want to send a strong message that any salary cap infringement for any reason will result in a big punishment.

I **am okay with it if they treat all clubs the same but it is obvious to everyone they dont**

Not quite everyone

 

[prattenparkchild]

Sounds like the only thing WT should do is take back the job offer, since Farah has not accepted it anyway, and say they will review the situation a year to two after Farah retires. Its all hypothetical then.

 

[WT2K]

Whether or not this contract for a post-NRL job is signed or not, is not the issue.

The accusations are that this role was to compensate Robbie for TPAs that he did not receive. If so, they argue that is cheating. If not, it is just NRL whingeing about not being informed officially (even though they already knew about it),

To me, NRL must believe they can prove that the job was offered to compensate for those cancelled TPAs, otherwise they wouldn't have proceeded. And that is the evidence I am looking forward to seeing. Anything less, and I think it proves their own bias.

It is not about the NRL whinging about being told. They have rules that they must be informed to prevent clubs rorting the cap by offering players a post career job.

NRL came out calling us salary cap cheats, Not that a mistake was made, but that we were deliberate salary cap cheats, If they don't have the evidence to prove our intent to cheat, then that is clear evidence of their bias.

Yes, one of the reasons I believe it was more than a mistake.

Punishment currently standing, makes me believe it's definitely not a mistake on pascoes part and more to it.
We'll all find out either way in a few weeks time.

 

[Telltails]

https://amp-smh-com-au.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/furious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html?amp_js_v=a2&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQECAFYAQ%3D%3D#aoh=15467763500845&_ct=1546776364740&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.smh.com.au%2Fsport%2Fnrl%2Ffurious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html

This article - if correct - states that Go and the board were aware of the deal so why is Pascoe the sole fall guy?
And the issue they raise about Farah being welcomed back - do they really not know that it was Farahs realtionship with the then coach which was destabilizing. Cleary, new coach did not have the same issues and hence welcomed him back as was his role in recruiting.
Based on public information the NRLs case against Pascoe is questionable, even if the rules were breached.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

https://amp-smh-com-au.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/furious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html?amp_js_v=a2&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQECAFYAQ%3D%3D#aoh=15467763500845&_ct=1546776364740&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.smh.com.au%2Fsport%2Fnrl%2Ffurious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html

This article - if correct - states that Go and the board were aware of the deal so why is Pascoe the sole fall guy?
And the issue they raise about Farah being welcomed back - do they really not know that it was Farahs realtionship with the then coach which was destabilizing. Cleary, new coach did not have the same issues and hence welcomed him back as was his role in recruiting.
Based on public information the NRLs case against Pascoe is questionable, even if the rules were breached.

Cleary welcomed him back because he did not care about this club. His heart and mind were elsewhere. That’s why he re-signed him again. Wasn’t going to be his problem.

 

[jadtiger]

https://amp-smh-com-au.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/furious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html?amp_js_v=a2&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQECAFYAQ%3D%3D#aoh=15467763500845&_ct=1546776364740&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.smh.com.au%2Fsport%2Fnrl%2Ffurious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html

This article - if correct - states that Go and the board were aware of the deal so why is Pascoe the sole fall guy?
And the issue they raise about Farah being welcomed back - do they really not know that it was Farahs realtionship with the then coach which was destabilizing. Cleary, new coach did not have the same issues and hence welcomed him back as was his role in recruiting.
Based on public information the NRLs case against Pascoe is questionable, even if the rules were breached.

Cleary welcomed him back because he did not care about this club. His heart and mind were elsewhere. That’s why he re-signed him again. Wasn’t going to be his problem.

You are drawing a very long bow there.Last year we needed a hooker badly because we didnt have an effective hooker at the club(Liddle injured) and we still had a season to be potentially saved.It didnt quite work but hardly due to Farah being a problem.

 

[GNR4LIFE]

https://amp-smh-com-au.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/furious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html?amp_js_v=a2&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQECAFYAQ%3D%3D#aoh=15467763500845&_ct=1546776364740&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.smh.com.au%2Fsport%2Fnrl%2Ffurious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html

This article - if correct - states that Go and the board were aware of the deal so why is Pascoe the sole fall guy?
And the issue they raise about Farah being welcomed back - do they really not know that it was Farahs realtionship with the then coach which was destabilizing. Cleary, new coach did not have the same issues and hence welcomed him back as was his role in recruiting.
Based on public information the NRLs case against Pascoe is questionable, even if the rules were breached.

Cleary welcomed him back because he did not care about this club. His heart and mind were elsewhere. That’s why he re-signed him again. Wasn’t going to be his problem.

You are drawing a very long bow there.Last year we needed a hooker badly because we didnt have an effective hooker at the club(Liddle injured) and we still had a season to be potentially saved.It didnt quite work but hardly due to Farah being a problem.

I don’t think it is. He did re-sign Farah and Marshall after the news broke that he was approached by Penrith. And his heart was never in this place. It was obvious long before Griffin was sacked. He appointed 5 captains, never showed interest in filling out the roster, even after the season had started. So I don’t see why he would have been so emotionally invested in bringing Farah back.

 

[happy_tiger]

https://amp-smh-com-au.cdn.ampproject.org/v/s/amp.smh.com.au/sport/nrl/furious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html?amp_js_v=a2&_gsa=1&usqp=mq331AQECAFYAQ%3D%3D#aoh=15467763500845&_ct=1546776364740&referrer=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.google.com&_tf=From%20%251%24s&share=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.smh.com.au%2Fsport%2Fnrl%2Ffurious-wests-tigers-to-challenge-pascoe-ban-salary-cap-fines-20181219-p50naj.html

This article - if correct - states that Go and the board were aware of the deal so why is Pascoe the sole fall guy?
And the issue they raise about Farah being welcomed back - do they really not know that it was Farahs realtionship with the then coach which was destabilizing. Cleary, new coach did not have the same issues and hence welcomed him back as was his role in recruiting.
Based on public information the NRLs case against Pascoe is questionable, even if the rules were breached.

Cleary welcomed him back because he did not care about this club. His heart and mind were elsewhere. That’s why he re-signed him again. Wasn’t going to be his problem.

You are drawing a very long bow there.Last year we needed a hooker badly because we didnt have an effective hooker at the club(Liddle injured) and we still had a season to be potentially saved.It didnt quite work but hardly due to Farah being a problem.

I don’t think it is. He did re-sign Farah and Marshall after the news broke that he was approached by Penrith. And his heart was never in this place. It was obvious long before Griffin was sacked. He appointed 5 captains, never showed interest in filling out the roster, even after the season had started. So I don’t see why he would have been so emotionally invested in bringing Farah back.

Farah proved a good on field signing , but if Cleary was in charge of the entire roster , he should have known the entire story behind Farah

It is obvious the NRL have been sniffing around this ever since he was re signed …......

IF the SMH article is on point ..........it looks shady ......and if it looks like a pig , smells like a pig .............. you know the outcome

 

[rex2ce]

Has anyone heard whether the club/Pascoe are going to defend the NRLS accusations, thought there would be some info by now

 

[GNR4LIFE]

Has anyone heard whether the club/Pascoe are going to defend the NRLS accusations, thought there would be some info by now

If there was info, it would be in this thread.