Robbie Farah..Discussion Thread.....

[Geo]

Maybe we were not intelligent enough to know that when the press tells us that a press statement is going to be released within 24-48 hours re Robbie staying and all the details already released that that was the press statement already. They save face that way. Like Abbott not publicly resigning (or heavily delayed). It is like waiting for JC's return.

Justin Pascoe in his latest email newsletter to members…If it is not a direct quote from me or the Club do not believe Media fairy tails or words to that effect...

End of the week rolls on still nothing Official from the Club....

 

[Snake]

That's where Farah was stunted last year. He's not the archetypical hooker. He's somewhere between a seven and nine for mine. That freedom to direct the game as a pseudo half has been taken from him and given to a legitimate halves pairing (legitimate in the sense that they're a genuine half and five-eighth, rather than makeshift halves like in the past,) now he's left to run the game solely from dummy half. Everyone can argue that Cherrington is only playing small minutes etc, but we looked more threatening out of dummy half with him there. Service was faster and the attack appeared to be more direct.

I think due to Taylor's basic, defence orientated game plan, it's easy to pin Farah's performances on that but under the surface it looks more like a case of correlation not equating to causation.

In any case, I'm sure if he is indeed staying that we'll see a different Farah this year, he's on notice much like the coach and will be keen to have a lash. That may be the one shining light out of this whole sorry mess.

The situation is Taylor wants a different type of play out of his number 9 plan and simple , the team looks totally different when Cherrington is on the paddock a very threatening side. This talk of the coach will not let Farah play his nature game is rubbish the the coach wants what he wants he is the BOSS,Farah was told this with 8 weeks left in the regular season and has stood his ground so now he will have to toe the line with what Taylor requires .
Taylor does not want the type of play Farah offers good or bad this is the situation so if he does not like it the door is open . Taylor is the coach and he should be able to implement the style of play he requires ,Farah has to realise he is now just a cog in a machine and not the be all of the team .

 

[hammertime]

Maybe we were not intelligent enough to know that when the press tells us that a press statement is going to be released within 24-48 hours re Robbie staying and all the details already released that that was the press statement already. They save face that way. Like Abbott not publicly resigning (or heavily delayed). It is like waiting for JC's return.

Justin Pascoe in his latest email newsletter to members…If it is not a direct quote from me or the Club do not believe Media fairy tails or words to that effect...

End of the week rolls on still nothing Official from the Club....

If pascoe makes the media look silly a few times, they might tone down the rhetoric. Maybe fed some misinformation to ayoub?

 

[Russell]

Maybe we were not intelligent enough to know that when the press tells us that a press statement is going to be released within 24-48 hours re Robbie staying and all the details already released that that was the press statement already. They save face that way. Like Abbott not publicly resigning (or heavily delayed). It is like waiting for JC's return.

Now see, you've got it wrong again.

It's JT, not JC and he's not returning - he's continuing again next year. LOL

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

Maybe we were not intelligent enough to know that when the press tells us that a press statement is going to be released within 24-48 hours re Robbie staying and all the details already released that that was the press statement already. They save face that way. Like Abbott not publicly resigning (or heavily delayed). It is like waiting for JC's return.

Justin Pascoe in his latest email newsletter to members…If it is not a direct quote from me or the Club do not believe Media fairy tails or words to that effect...

End of the week rolls on still nothing Official from the Club....

If pascoe makes the media look silly a few times, they might tone down the rhetoric. Maybe fed some misinformation to ayoub?

Turn the tables you reckon? Hope so, Ayoub is a germ.

 

[jirskyr]

They asked Benny the wrong questions.

Forget about what happens if Taylor drops Farah and Tigers don't win; ask the reverse: what happens if they win without Farah, or lose with him? Then what does JT do.

I guarantee that if we have a losing start with Robbie playing firsts next year, there will be a long line of Farah apologists saying that he is "being hamstrung" or "should be allowed to play his natural game".

I'll tell you who was allowed to play their natural game: Lockyer, Johns, Tallis. Webcke, Ellis. These guys were excellent every week, so over-coaching would be like telling Federer which shots he should select.

Every other player I've seen, needs to be reigned in to some extent; it's a team game. Even Thurston cannot just play however he chooses, because he's always had the issue of not quite having a stable or directing half option alongside him, flicking back and forth between half and 5/8th. First season that he has a halves partner who is consistently dangerous and at his peak, they win the comp.

Did you watch Michael Ennis play last year??

He was tremendous. He said being allowed to play what he saw a lot more made him so much more effective.

Nathan Brown made that point and it was a really solid one. The coach has an asset in Farah, and refused to use him to the best of his abilities and for the teams best interests.

There is no way Ennis was a more skillful or creative player then Robbie, yet last season he had double the assists and numbers? Why, I would argue PARTLY due to good coaching at Sharks. Robbie has been a better player then Ennis nearly his whole career. Yet last season Ennis had nearly double the numbers. You have to give Ennis credit but you alos have to look at our game plans and wonder what we were trying to acheive/

Black, N Whitw made some fair points. Farahs service was dissapointing and really poor at times. He needs to be sharper next season from Round 1\. Like I said originally he also needs to take some responsibility for a quiet year last year.

I appreciate your opinion, but I feel that is too simplistic a view.

So in a nutshell, Farah had an average year because he was being held back by the coach, whereas Ennis had a good year because the coach gave him free reign? Nope.

I also don't believe that you necessarily achieve success by allowing players to do as they please. Benji Marshall had a few very obvious strengths, but because those strengths were temperamental and paired with some striking weaknesses, he would be rocks or diamonds.

The point I was making is that only the greatest footballers have the ability to truly play whatever is in front of them, to execute their own game plans based on how they see the game unfold. I don't believe Farah is one of those players any more… maybe he was around 2006-2008\. Every other player, even the quite good ones, has game plans set by the coach, and those plans always involve some form of delegation or stepping back, because you typically do not want just a single focus of attack.

I would also argue that if JT is indeed "shackling" Farah, and really we don't know how the game plan is being discussed behind closed doors, then perhaps this is part of a different strategy. Let's say for arguments sake that Robbie and previously Benji were allowed to play what they saw in front of them, they were the foundation of the "flashy" Tigers - well we know how that worked out in terms of finals success.

Lastly, I would say with the whole Farah / Ennis comparison, well perhaps it wasn't the coaches directives at all but the own player's satisfaction / stability / mindset / fitness that played as much a role as anything. Ennis moving to a new club, new structures, new inspiration, new options on the field. Farah with the same club, 2014 being a difficult personal year, not many new faces in the team. They are the same age after all, there is no particular reason why Farah should remain superior to Ennis his entire career, just because he used to be better than him. I think there is a general consensus that Farah's core skills had dropped last year, even kicking and distribution, which begs the question of his overall form.

 

[batboy]

Farah was bog ordinary since Origin last year - Prior to that was the best I had seen him play in 3 years!! Unfortunately, It didn't last very long.

I have a feeling now he knows his spot, His Club status and pride is surely on the line, We will see a bit more from Farah and a bit less blaming the coach for apparently "tying his hands up"

- Funny how short peoples memories are - The way Taylor has been blamed for Robbie's poor form (Which has been from 2011), You'd thing Farah was the 2014 Dally M winner….

I agree with this. He hasn't been in top form for a while. He has lost some pace and his service was never the best part of his game.

Still I think he is still a quality player. He can set-up a try or a bust as good as any dummy half in the game. Lets hope he gets back to top form over the next 2 years.

I agree, He's a good player in his position…..
But so is Isaac DeGois, Nathan Peats and Matt Balin.
I hope this changes his whole attitude an what's required of him....

But if I have to watch him waste another 12 tackles a game running direct at markers trying to get a penalty when every man and his dog knows he's not going to get one - I'll vomit blood!!

Get the ball to those that need it, WHERE They need it (And not half a meter in front, too high or too low) As fast as it can possibly get there - Make his tackles and run when he can.

 

[Eddie]

They asked Benny the wrong questions.

Forget about what happens if Taylor drops Farah and Tigers don't win; ask the reverse: what happens if they win without Farah, or lose with him? Then what does JT do.

I guarantee that if we have a losing start with Robbie playing firsts next year, there will be a long line of Farah apologists saying that he is "being hamstrung" or "should be allowed to play his natural game".

I'll tell you who was allowed to play their natural game: Lockyer, Johns, Tallis. Webcke, Ellis. These guys were excellent every week, so over-coaching would be like telling Federer which shots he should select.

Every other player I've seen, needs to be reigned in to some extent; it's a team game. Even Thurston cannot just play however he chooses, because he's always had the issue of not quite having a stable or directing half option alongside him, flicking back and forth between half and 5/8th. First season that he has a halves partner who is consistently dangerous and at his peak, they win the comp.

Did you watch Michael Ennis play last year??

He was tremendous. He said being allowed to play what he saw a lot more made him so much more effective.

Nathan Brown made that point and it was a really solid one. The coach has an asset in Farah, and refused to use him to the best of his abilities and for the teams best interests.

There is no way Ennis was a more skillful or creative player then Robbie, yet last season he had double the assists and numbers? Why, I would argue PARTLY due to good coaching at Sharks. Robbie has been a better player then Ennis nearly his whole career. Yet last season Ennis had nearly double the numbers. You have to give Ennis credit but you alos have to look at our game plans and wonder what we were trying to acheive/

Black, N Whitw made some fair points. Farahs service was dissapointing and really poor at times. He needs to be sharper next season from Round 1\. Like I said originally he also needs to take some responsibility for a quiet year last year.

I appreciate your opinion, but I feel that is too simplistic a view.

So in a nutshell, Farah had an average year because he was being held back by the coach, whereas Ennis had a good year because the coach gave him free reign? Nope.

.

It might be simplistic, but rugby League is a simple game

My opinion was shared regularly by Ennis himself and coaches like Nathan Brown when reviewing both teams.

So if you think my views are simplistic, well so are 1st grade hookers and coaches.

 

[Masterton]

There's free reign, and there's free reign. I don't think Taylor was ever advised not to run. Cherro ran plenty. But, I do think he was told not to run wide from dummyhalf to become a de facto halfback. We need our real halves to step up into that role.

 

[LCA]

I think it's much more simplistic than any of these scenarios that nobody seems to know are actually true. Farah is a club legend and deserves to be treated better than he was by Taylor and the board.

Taylor, on the other hand, is trying to establish himself as a genuine NRL coach with, I believe, some very curious appointments (Rod Reddy in 2015, for instance) and decisions (calling Triple M to counter some criticism they were relaying at the time).

Robbie is not one for excuses. He knows his strengths and his capacity.

Taylor, by contrast, is "punching above his weight".

There is no leap in faith in supporting Robbie. There is a massive leap in faith in supporting Taylor.

To me, it's that simple.

 

[Pawsandclaws]

http://www.theroar.com.au/2015/05/27/major-problems-for-jason-taylor-and-the-wests-tigers/
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What is completely fair though, is to assess what his team are producing on the paddock each week. Quite simply, that is nothing short of boring, uninspired and dull football

Taylor has completely whipped the imagination, creativity and flair out of this team – and remember that for all their youth and talent this should be one of the most creative teams in the competition. In fact, the only time the Tigers looked remotely dangerous or even interesting for that matter, was the two chip kicks provided by maligned youngster Mitchell Moses.

Taylor has tried to turn this team into a structured-and-rehearsed-play team. That’s (sort of) fine, except that the strategies, structures and rehearsed plays are abysmal – and that is the coach’s fault and his fault alone. The continual midfield bombing from Luke Brooks and Moses is a directive of Taylor – the chip and chase is closer to their natural game.

Taylor needs to relax the reins and allow his creative halves

The fact that Taylor felt the compulsion to call into Triple M this week and defend his tactics only serves to highlight that they are clearly very poor. Ultimately he came across as a very desperate coach, reminiscent of a child pleading his case to the principal.

 

[Masterton]

http://www.theroar.com.au/2015/05/27/major-problems-for-jason-taylor-and-the-wests-tigers/
\
\
What is completely fair though, is to assess what his team are producing on the paddock each week. Quite simply, that is nothing short of boring, uninspired and dull football

Taylor has completely whipped the imagination, creativity and flair out of this team – and remember that for all their youth and talent this should be one of the most creative teams in the competition. In fact, the only time the Tigers looked remotely dangerous or even interesting for that matter, was the two chip kicks provided by maligned youngster Mitchell Moses.

Taylor has tried to turn this team into a structured-and-rehearsed-play team. That’s (sort of) fine, except that the strategies, structures and rehearsed plays are abysmal – and that is the coach’s fault and his fault alone. The continual midfield bombing from Luke Brooks and Moses is a directive of Taylor – the chip and chase is closer to their natural game.

Taylor needs to relax the reins and allow his creative halves

The fact that Taylor felt the compulsion to call into Triple M this week and defend his tactics only serves to highlight that they are clearly very poor. Ultimately he came across as a very desperate coach, reminiscent of a child pleading his case to the principal.

Even Taylor's staunchest supporters would admit the game plan was dreadfully basic in the first half of the season, but if people don't think things changed, they don't know much about football.

 

[LCA]

Apologies if I didn't make my point clear about Taylor calling Triple M. It was not this week, or at least not that I know of, but on a Monday night during the season when the Triple M team were talking about the form of sides more generally.

The fact that he demanded an opportunity to put his case forward (it was not a pre-arranged interview, he called the studio and asked to be put to air) and then promptly backed down on his intent by suggesting they ask him questions, was desperate, cringeworthy, amateurish, petulant and embarrassing.

Up until then, despite some poor form by the team, I was open-minded about his prospects. But from that moment my instincts changed. And, despite some solid wins, the season was more of a negative than a positive one. The decision about Farah, and his preparedness to, AGAIN, seek to "play the victim" has me really concerned.

I go back to my previous point; if it comes to a Farah or Taylor scenario, the decision must be to retain Farah. He has the runs on the board….he is the current NSW SOO hooker, after all. The other bloke can only hope to reach similar heights as a coach and, I would think, he needs to embrace the input and presence of Farah, not marginalise it.

Just my opinion, of course.

 

[Black_n_White]

I dont know LCA…. I heard the interview live, and if I am entirely honest, while he was copping a bollocking himself Brooks was copping the worse end of the stick from MMM hosts. While that interview, or demanded spot did end up a Taylor propaganda piece, where he pretty much stood over the hosts, he undeniably jumped in and threw himself between the panel and the young bloke, accepted responsibility then defended his decisions for the rest of it.

If you only caught the Talyor bit on some replay he sounded like an egomaniac... if you listened to the segment in its entirety, he wasnt even copping the brunt of the MMM callers by a long shot, he was defending Brooks who was being roasted.

 

[king_sirro]

I dont know LCA…. I heard the interview live, and if I am entirely honest, while he was copping a bollocking himself Brooks was copping the worse end of the stick from MMM hosts. While that interview, or demanded spot did end up a Taylor propaganda piece, where he pretty much stood over the hosts, he undeniably jumped in and threw himself between the panel and the young bloke, accepted responsibility then defended his decisions for the rest of it.

If you only caught the Talyor bit on some replay he sounded like an egomaniac... if you listened to the segment in its entirety, he wasnt even copping the brunt of the MMM callers by a long shot, he was defending Brooks who was being roasted.

I didn't hear the interview therefore have never commented on it. What you say is very interesting indeed, and I believe the only person to state the context of the entire MMM scenario.

 

[Geo]

I dont know LCA…. I heard the interview live, and if I am entirely honest, while he was copping a bollocking himself Brooks was copping the worse end of the stick from MMM hosts. While that interview, or demanded spot did end up a Taylor propaganda piece, where he pretty much stood over the hosts, he undeniably jumped in and threw himself between the panel and the young bloke, accepted responsibility then defended his decisions for the rest of it.

If you only caught the Talyor bit on some replay he sounded like an egomaniac... if you listened to the segment in its entirety, he wasnt even copping the brunt of the MMM callers by a long shot, he was defending Brooks who was being roasted.

I didn't hear the interview therefore have never commented on it. What you say is very interesting indeed, and I believe the only person to state the context of the entire MMM scenario.

http://www.triplem.com.au/sydney/sport/nrl/news/2015/5/jason-taylor-discusses-tigers-attacking-woes/

Listen to it for yourself …make up your own mind...

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

That's where Farah was stunted last year. He's not the archetypical hooker. He's somewhere between a seven and nine for mine. That freedom to direct the game as a pseudo half has been taken from him and given to a legitimate halves pairing (legitimate in the sense that they're a genuine half and five-eighth, rather than makeshift halves like in the past,) now he's left to run the game solely from dummy half. Everyone can argue that Cherrington is only playing small minutes etc, but we looked more threatening out of dummy half with him there. Service was faster and the attack appeared to be more direct.

I think due to Taylor's basic, defence orientated game plan, it's easy to pin Farah's performances on that but under the surface it looks more like a case of correlation not equating to causation.

In any case, I'm sure if he is indeed staying that we'll see a different Farah this year, he's on notice much like the coach and will be keen to have a lash. That may be the one shining light out of this whole sorry mess.

Farah will have a point to prove next season, and determination is one thing he has heaps of. and even though that wasn't the reason for the last few month of garbage, I think it will be the result. A more determined Farah than ever

 

[goldcoast_tiger]

Both Farah and Taylor at the same interview early In , or just before the season started, both stated that exact thing. That he'd be standing back and letting the halves take over.
Sounds pretty clear to me

Take over running the team…

I don't recall any comments from either stating "be as boring as bat crap out of dummy half"?

Taylor thought that it was unnecessary to tell him that again , as he had put that in big letters on the back of his game plans :laughing:

 

[Cultured_Bogan]

http://www.theroar.com.au/2015/05/27/major-problems-for-jason-taylor-and-the-wests-tigers/
\
\
What is completely fair though, is to assess what his team are producing on the paddock each week. Quite simply, that is nothing short of boring, uninspired and dull football

Taylor has completely whipped the imagination, creativity and flair out of this team – and remember that for all their youth and talent this should be one of the most creative teams in the competition. In fact, the only time the Tigers looked remotely dangerous or even interesting for that matter, was the two chip kicks provided by maligned youngster Mitchell Moses.

Taylor has tried to turn this team into a structured-and-rehearsed-play team. That’s (sort of) fine, except that the strategies, structures and rehearsed plays are abysmal – and that is the coach’s fault and his fault alone. The continual midfield bombing from Luke Brooks and Moses is a directive of Taylor – the chip and chase is closer to their natural game.

Taylor needs to relax the reins and allow his creative halves

The fact that Taylor felt the compulsion to call into Triple M this week and defend his tactics only serves to highlight that they are clearly very poor. Ultimately he came across as a very desperate coach, reminiscent of a child pleading his case to the principal.

Citing the roar as a legitimate sports media. :laughing:

 

[Eddie]

I think it's much more simplistic than any of these scenarios that nobody seems to know are actually true. Farah is a club legend and deserves to be treated better than he was by Taylor and the board.

Taylor, on the other hand, is trying to establish himself as a genuine NRL coach with, I believe, some very curious appointments (Rod Reddy in 2015, for instance) and decisions (calling Triple M to counter some criticism they were relaying at the time).

Robbie is not one for excuses. He knows his strengths and his capacity.

Taylor, by contrast, is "punching above his weight".

There is no leap in faith in supporting Robbie. There is a massive leap in faith in supporting Taylor.

To me, it's that simple.

Hard to argue with that.